Microsoft Streets and Trips?

[cheri1122]

And for the dude hyperventilating in livid color, settle down dude! The world won’t end tomorrow. Some of us brains don’t operate nearly as slowly as yours apparently does.
[In my best DiNiro voice] You talkin to ME?
Cos I think I have every right to hyperventilate if I think your [distracted] driving might put me or my loved ones at risk on the roads. As I said earlier, I used S&T on my laptop before the Garmin, so I know how different they are. And I don't believe my brain is any slower than most [well, most days, lol] so I consider your comment as totally out of line.
The other point is that when I said "to each his own risks", I was referring to the risk to a laptop that's kept out in the open while driving, as well as the risks of distraction involved in using a laptop while driving - one sudden stop, and your laptop can be toast.
Please reread Turtle's posts, as he explains the differences better than I do, and he's absolutely right.

I tried one of those newfangled standalone Garmins and it was so small I couldn’t see it.
In all the comments I've heard and read, no one has ever made that one before - I'm just sayin.
It now sits in my wife’s car. As for as I’m concerned, Garmins are great for cars, but for 18 wheelers like I drive, I need something much more flexible and capable and that also gives me a panoramic view that you can’t get with a standalone GPS device.

Not to mention that with Streets & Trips you can do 10 times more things with it as well. In fact, most of my friends that use Garmins and Tom Toms use Streets & Trips to do all their trip planning, which is now going to be much easier because I hear Streets & Trips 2010 exports gpx files directly into Garmin and other gpx compatible GPS devices. Thus, if you are smart, you will be using Streets & Trips to do your trip planning as well.[/QUOTE]
I do use S&T, and Garmin, and the good ol atlas [and sometimes, my fellow drivers, too] to trip plan - so perhaps I'm not quite as dumb as I look, eh?

 

[LDB]

I use my laptop for navigation. It sits on the passenger seat. The seat is as high as the air will raise it which is pretty high and the seat is put as far forward as it will go. That puts it so close to the dash the laptop couldn't slide off into the floor if it wanted to. As someone else mentioned, it's no more distracting than checking the side mirror. For the most part it's just listening to it tell/remind me the routing I've already seen before rolling.

 

[layoutshooter]

We have both S&T and Delorme, we prefere Delorme for the most part. We like the "ETA" feature that it has and the "VIA's" make it a bit easier to set up your routing. We have a GlobalSat MR-350 GPS modual outside on a mirror frame. We have the laptop on a "Combo" mount combining the best parts from an old "Cyber-Trucker" and the "Ram" mount system. The screen is just below eye level and is no any more distracting than checking mirrors. That is what works for us. NOT pushing it on anyone else. We would love to sit down with EITHER MicroSoft OR Delorme and have some "custom" screens designed. Neither program does everything that we want.

 

[greg334]

You guys are funny......

 

[Humble2drive]

The screen is just below eye level and is no any more distracting than checking mirrors.

Darn it!! I just wanted to sit this thread out and enjoy the ride but now I have to jump in here.

The fraction of a second that it takes to scan your mirror to see if a vehicle is in it (with the road ahead in your peripheral vision) is NOT comparable to looking down below the level of the dash board and focusing on a route with street names and arrows etc.

Drivers justifying the use of a laptop while driving is like listening to teenagers justify the use of texting while driving.Just saying.

 

[layoutshooter]

Darn it!! I just wanted to sit this thread out and enjoy the ride but now I have to jump in here.

The fraction of a second that it takes to scan your mirror to see if a vehicle is in it (with the road ahead in your peripheral vision) is NOT comparable to looking down below the level of the dash board and focusing on a route with street names and arrows etc.

Drivers justifying the use of a laptop while driving is like listening to teenagers justify the use of texting while driving.Just saying.

Whatever, I did NOT post to argue. You use what you want and we use what works for us. I have trouble seeing "Little Screens" I prefere "Big Screens" They are much easier for Mrs. Layoutshooter when she is "directiing" my which is when we use the system the most. Looking at ANY GPS is a distraction and that IS a fact. I just choose to use a different distraction, the one that works for me. It is up to ME to use that tool in a RESPONSIBLE manner. I am NO longer 16, I CAN act properly and use tools in a RESPONSIBLE manner. SO THERE!!! LOL!!

 

[Humble2drive]

Whatever, I did NOT post to argue. You use what you want and we use what works for us. I have trouble seeing "Little Screens" I prefere "Big Screens" They are much easier for Mrs. Layoutshooter when she is "directiing" my which is when we use the system the most. Looking at ANY GPS is a distraction and that IS a fact. I just choose to use a different distraction, the one that works for me. It is up to ME to use that tool in a RESPONSIBLE manner. I am NO longer 16, I CAN act properly and use tools in a RESPONSIBLE manner. SO THERE!!! LOL!!

Gee, I had a feeling that the hunter instinct in you would cause you to fire back at me.
I understand now. You have vision problems, so you need a bigger screen so that Mrs. Layoutshooter can look at it and tell you where to go. Got it!

 

[layoutshooter]

Gee, I had a feeling that the hunter instinct in you would cause you to fire back at me.
I understand now. You have vision problems, so you need bigger screen so that Mrs. Layoutshooter can look at it and tell you where to go. Got it!

NOW you understand!!! Old age is setting in and "little things" need to be made "bigger" for me to see them!! I DO NOT wear my reading glasses when I drive, talk about a REAL distraction!! Mrs. Layoutshooter has been telling me where to go for years!! That is why SHE is the primary navigator of this team!! It is a NATURAL FIT!!! LOL!!!

 

[Podcast]

[In my best DiNiro voice] You talkin to ME?
Cos I think I have every right to hyperventilate if I think your [distracted] driving might put me or my loved ones at risk on the roads. As I said earlier, I used S&T on my laptop before the Garmin, so I know how different they are. And I don't believe my brain is any slower than most [well, most days, lol] so I consider your comment as totally out of line.
The other point is that when I said "to each his own risks", I was referring to the risk to a laptop that's kept out in the open while driving, as well as the risks of distraction involved in using a laptop while driving - one sudden stop, and your laptop can be toast.
Please reread Turtle's posts, as he explains the differences better than I do, and he's absolutely right.

Actually, I have my laptop mount situated on my right side just out of the way of my shifter and about an inch from the dashboard and angled so it faces me. I also have it set so that it in no way obstructs my field of view of my passenger side window or passenger side mirror. I have been operating in this fashion for the past 5 plus years and 625,000 plus accident free miles.

Not to mention that it is strapped down securely in my laptop mount and when I flip down the laptop screen, which I do every time I enter a truck stop, a shipper, a consignee, or a bad neighborhood, it is totally invisible from the outside.

As a matter of fact, I would argue that using a standalone GPS device represents a much greater obstruction to a driver’s field of vision since it sits either up on the dashboard bouncing up and down and all around or up on the windshield further obstructing your field of vision.

In all the comments I've heard and read, no one has ever made that one before - I'm just sayin,

Well, you haven’t been around much. Most of my friends that drive solo use laptops for exactly the same reason. In any event, if you have been used to looking at a 17-inch screen for as long as I have, you’d know exactly what I mean. Plus with the Truck Stops Plus I can quickly check my routes for restricted routes and low clearances from my laptop screen or search and route to a truck stop in just seconds. Try doing that with a standalone GPS device.

Not to mention that I use Streets & Trips during the course of my days for all sorts of other things that you can’t do with a standalone GPS device as well. It’s all about saving time because time in this business translates into more money in your pocket and also more time to goof off.

Not to mention that I also use the Driver’s Daily Log to do all of my logs as well and to keep the safety department and the DOT off my back. Hell, I also scan and send in all my trips and expenses via my laptop as well.


Hell, in the evenings when I’m instant messaging, emailing, and cruising the Internet with my laptop sitting on my steering wheel, my laptop mount also makes a very handy end table to set my food and drinks on for me. I also use it to set my printer on when I’m scanning my trips and expenses to send them in and also to print out my logs.

Anyway, I’m sorry if I rubbed you the wrong way. I was really just really teasing you.

 

[jrcarroll]

Darn it!! I just wanted to sit this thread out and enjoy the ride but now I have to jump in here.

The fraction of a second that it takes to scan your mirror to see if a vehicle is in it (with the road ahead in your peripheral vision) is NOT comparable to looking down below the level of the dash board and focusing on a route with street names and arrows etc.

Drivers justifying the use of a laptop while driving is like listening to teenagers justify the use of texting while driving.Just saying.

If you use GPS or a computer mapping program, the first thing you should do is pretrip your route! and study it. I always do that. Most of the time the only time that streets and trips is on is when I get within a short distance to final destination. While using it the sound is on so I only have to listen to directions. Streets and trips is not a crutch for me, however it helps me to find local routing to where I deliver. Seven years, no accidents, no tickets while using my laptop.
And yes I still can use a map, or phone to get directions.
As others have said the driver must use their Gps or computer program with great care and safety first always!

And why only pick on teenagers texting while driving? What about others who I've seen drinking coffee, eating AND texting or talking on phone with no reguard for others on the road!!!

 

[cheri1122]

Actually, I have my laptop mount situated on my right side just out of the way of my shifter and about an inch from the dashboard and angled so it faces me. I also have it set so that it in no way obstructs my field of view of my passenger side window or passenger side mirror. I have been operating in this fashion for the past 5 plus years and 625,000 plus accident free miles.

Not to mention that it is strapped down securely in my laptop mount and when I flip down the laptop screen, which I do every time I enter a truck stop, a shipper, a consignee, or a bad neighborhood, it is totally invisible from the outside.

As a matter of fact, I would argue that using a standalone GPS device represents a much greater obstruction to a driver’s field of vision since it sits either up on the dashboard bouncing up and down and all around or up on the windshield further obstructing your field of vision.
The GPS unit on the dash or windshield doesn't obstruct my field of vision at all, and glancing at it doesn't require looking away from the windshield, either. [It's the looking away part that is risky - refocusing your vision from one to the other.]
Well, you haven’t been around much.
Wow - first time I've heard that comment too, lol.
Most of my friends that drive solo use laptops for exactly the same reason. In any event, if you have been used to looking at a 17-inch screen for as long as I have, you’d know exactly what I mean. Plus with the Truck Stops Plus I can quickly check my routes for restricted routes and low clearances from my laptop screen or search and route to a truck stop in just seconds. Try doing that with a standalone GPS device.

Not to mention that I use Streets & Trips during the course of my days for all sorts of other things that you can’t do with a standalone GPS device as well. It’s all about saving time because time in this business translates into more money in your pocket and also more time to goof off.

Not to mention that I also use the Driver’s Daily Log to do all of my logs as well and to keep the safety department and the DOT off my back. Hell, I also scan and send in all my trips and expenses via my laptop as well.


Hell, in the evenings when I’m instant messaging, emailing, and cruising the Internet with my laptop sitting on my steering wheel, my laptop mount also makes a very handy end table to set my food and drinks on for me. I also use it to set my printer on when I’m scanning my trips and expenses to send them in and also to print out my logs.

Anyway, I’m sorry if I rubbed you the wrong way. I was really just really teasing you.

'S ok - debate is a good thing, and I enjoy an intelligent argument, really. I just don't think that a laptop was meant to be used while moving, as opposed to a GPS. If you can do it safely, my hat's off to you, cos I don't think the majority of us can - and that includes me.

 

[layoutshooter]

Not meaning to be a smart alec Cherri, but why is the laptop any different than the GPS? Once you have your routing in you don't touch either one, you don't stare at either one and only glance at them on a rare occasion. My laptop does NOT block any field of view in any direction. The large screen requires less "attention" than a little screen does. I can shift my eyes to the screen and still see out the windshield. I really don't understand. Maybe you can explain it, I am always open to new ideas.

IF I were to buy a stand-alone GPS I would STILL be looking for the largest screen made. Stand-alone GPS units are nothing but less capable computers. They do EXACTLY the same thing. No offense, but I confuse VERY easy!!! Please fill me in.

 

[cheri1122]

Not meaning to be a smart alec Cherri, but why is the laptop any different than the GPS? Once you have your routing in you don't touch either one, you don't stare at either one and only glance at them on a rare occasion. My laptop does NOT block any field of view in any direction. The large screen requires less "attention" than a little screen does. I can shift my eyes to the screen and still see out the windshield. I really don't understand. Maybe you can explain it, I am always open to new ideas.
In post 11, Turtle gives the short version [why the GPS is better than a laptop]. Somewhere in the archives of the Tech forum, he posted the long version, with the research to back it up. It agrees with what makes sense to me, after having used both: the laptop offers too much 'clutter' and requires a refocusing of vision and attention that doesn't seem like much, but when fractions of a second count.....
If you take the time to find and read the post in the Tech forum, you may change your mind.
With the additional risk to the laptop, a GPS is the better [and safer] tool, IMO.
IF I were to buy a stand-alone GPS I would STILL be looking for the largest screen made. Stand-alone GPS units are nothing but less capable computers. They do EXACTLY the same thing. No offense, but I confuse VERY easy!!! Please fill me in.

Garmin [and maybe others] offers a widescreen version. If you confuse easily, having exactly the info you need displayed, and no more, seems a better choice, no?

 

[Podcast]

The GPS unit on the dash or windshield doesn't obstruct my field of vision at all, and glancing at it doesn't require looking away from the windshield, either. [It's the looking away part that is risky - refocusing your vision from one to the other.

Man if I stared out the windshield like a bug eyed paranoid zombie all the time like you do without ever looking around I would go stir crazy, and then I would find myself hyperventilating on websites in bold magenta.

'S ok - debate is a good thing, and I enjoy an intelligent argument, really. I just don't think that a laptop was meant to be used while moving, as opposed to a GPS. If you can do it safely, my hat's off to you, cos I don't think the majority of us can - and that includes me.

By the same token and in my opinion, looking at a tiny micro screen bouncing up and down all day long is more self-defeating than helpful, and I know personally because I tried it and did not like it one bit.

Not to mention that I can’t find a standalone GPS device that shows me all the truck stops, rest areas, picnic/parking areas, turnpike service plazas, weigh stations, etc. while I’m traveling down the roads the way I can with Streets & Trips with the Truck Stops Plus add on template. With my current setup I can see all of those things as I approach them from as far away as 50 miles out. It’s like having radar in my truck. While you, on the other hand, are still stuck using an old fashion truck stop directory or a MCRA to find truck stops and rest areas.

 

[layoutshooter]

I will try to look up that post tomorrow, it is almost bed time now. I used to sell GPS units and am well aware of what they are capable of. What confuses me is other than the screen size the GPS and laptop systems display EXACTLY the same information. I can even buy the Garmin software and have the EXACT Garmin display as a standalone. I will look into it further tomorrow or Wed after we deliver our load. IN the meantime we will use our laptop with S&T on it. Mrs. Layoutshooter put our routing in a couple of days ago. She will direct me into the pick-up using it then on to the main hwy then go to sleep. I won't hardly even look at it until just prior to delivery when we will both be up.

 

[cheri1122]

Man if I stared out the windshield like a bug eyed paranoid zombie
I think you've mistaken me for Moot - he's the bald guy, ok?
all the time like you do without ever looking around I would go stir crazy, and then I would find myself hyperventilating on websites in bold magenta.
Are you colorblind? It's PURPLE, not magenta.




By the same token and in my opinion, looking at a tiny micro screen bouncing up and down all day long is more self-defeating than helpful, and I know personally because I tried it and did not like it one bit.
To quote the Dixie Chicks: there's your trouble - it's not supposed to bounce, and doesn't in my truck.

Not to mention that I can’t find a standalone GPS device that shows me all the truck stops, rest areas, picnic/parking areas, turnpike service plazas, weigh stations, etc. while I’m traveling down the roads the way I can with Streets & Trips with the Truck Stops Plus add on template. With my current setup I can see all of those things as I approach them from as far away as 50 miles out. It’s like having radar in my truck. While you, on the other hand, are still stuck using an old fashion truck stop directory or a MCRA to find truck stops and rest areas.

All the rest areas, truckstops, Wallyworlds, and more can be quickly found in "The Next Exit", or you can download a brazillion POIs [points of interest] from the Garmin website, like bank locations, speed traps, red light cameras, just all kinds of goodies.
But the bottom line is still safety, and I remain convinced that a GPS is a safer tool for navigating in a moving vehicle.

 

[chefdennis]

I guess all of those state hyway patrol officers and Local LEO's had better get those "unsafe" laptops of of their "crusiers"...........im sure they have no idea they are so unsafe to be used....while they are driving......

 

[Podcast]

All the rest areas, truckstops, Wallyworlds, and more can be quickly found in "The Next Exit",

That’s right and that’s exactly why I like my setup much better than your setup. I can see all of those things while driving. You, on the other hand, have to look them up and then manually route to them. Then to drive to them, you have to look and search for them and if you miss them, drive a thousand miles until you find a place to turn around. While I cannot only see them and exactly where they are located while I’m driving for miles ahead in advance, but I can search for them and route to them in seconds, and then get voice guided turn-by-turn directions. I’ve done it your way and my way and I like my way much better.

or you can download a brazillion POIs [points of interest] from the Garmin website, like bank locations, speed traps, red light cameras, just all kinds of goodies.

Been there, done that! It was an amazing waste of time since the freebie POI downloads on the Internet as a rule are always extremely inaccurate, and that’s never a good thing when you are driving a 73-foot vehicle. Plus they don’t give you any of the pertinent information that you need like a truck stop guide does. The Truck Stops Plus add-on template does, plus it is professional and pinpoint accurate.

But the bottom line is still safety, and I remain convinced that a GPS is a safer tool for navigating in a moving vehicle.

Yeah when you miss your turns because you can’t see, you’ll find out what is safe the hard way. Look dude…I’ve done it both ways: I started out using laptops first. Then when the standalone GPS units dropped in price, I switched to a loaded standalone Garmin because I was stupid and thought it would be better.

Nevertheless, it didn’t take me long to switch back to the laptop, and as for as I’m concerned the laptop solution is not only far safer, but a its hell of a lot better. Not only that, but it is a also a lot cheaper and you can do far more things with it that save you time and put more money in your pocket.

For instance, I put every shipper and consignee I ever been to in my Streets & Trips, whether or not they are drop and hooks or live loads, their hours of operation, and if you can spend the night there or not. I also have all my company terminals and drop lots loaded as well.

Hell, I can plan a trip, go take a shower, and eat in the time it takes you to locate one truck stop and to figure out a route to it. Plus, with the Truck Stops Plus add-on template I can check for restricted routes and low clearances right from my laptop screen instead of pulling that big and bulky MCRA and having to flip through the pages. Hell, I’m finished already by the time you are just pulling it out of your storage location.

In any event, until you have experienced using a laptop for routing and GPS navigation and all it can do, you can argue till the cows come home because you don’t know what you are talking about. I’ve used both solutions so I know. You have only used one solution and you don’t know nothing, except how to hyperventilate in bold beautiful magenta.

 

[aristotle]

Mr. Podcast, welcome to EO. Use your fancy laptop to find the nearest library and enroll in every Dale Carnegie course you can find.

 

[Turtle]

"In any event, until you have experienced using a laptop for routing and GPS navigation and all it can do, you can argue till the cows come home because you don’t know what you are talking about. I’ve used both solutions so I know."

I had a rather lengthy Turtle-esque reply penned, but I'll just go with, "That's hilarious."