Prayers Needed Please
- Thread starter bernieh48
- Start date
Glad that the drivers are Ok but unfortunately for them if the accident was as you described they and Panther are on the hook for all of the liability. Panther rearended a pickup that had (slowed, their words due to the fog) then hit the semi and the rest was chain reaction. The Televison Attorneys will argue that the Panther unit did not execise proper diligence and if they had slowed down sooner the whole incident would have never happened..
Remember the old saying,"If a airplane falls out of the sky and hits a truck it is the truckers fault for being there".
Remember the old saying,"If a airplane falls out of the sky and hits a truck it is the truckers fault for being there".
kangar0085
Seasoned Expediter
My god that is the worst wreck ive ever seen. I'm glad the Panther team is ok.
Diane, an attorney, agrees with RichM; provided that the facts of the case turn out to be in line with what is reported in this thread (media reports are not always accurate).
You can be sure that a number of lawyers are already trying to work their way into this multi-year, career-maker case(s).
Also, this incident will likely have adverse consequences on Panther's public offering if Panther proceeds with it. As all registration statements do, Panther's preliminary registration statement includes a section entitled, "Legal Proceedings."
The Legal Proceedings section in Panther's latest statement says, "The nature of our business routinely results in litigation, primarily involving claims for personal injury and property damage incurred in the transportation of freight. We believe all such litigation is adequately covered by insurance or otherwise reserved for and that adverse results in one or more of those cases would not have a material adverse effect on our financial condition, operating results and cash flows."
That is routine language for a company that has nothing extraordinary going on. But the above incident is extraordinary. If the public offering proceeds, the registration statement will be updated and the Legal Proceedings language will likely be changed to reflect the liability or potential liability Panther has rising out of this incident.
That is not the kind of language that prospective investors and investment holding companies like Fenway like to read. It is the kind of language that give current shareholders pause to reconsider their holdings.
If I was a Panther contractor, I would be eager to know how much insurance, re-insurance and self-insurance Panther carries. The ramifications of this accident may extend well beyond Florida.
I am not trying to be an alarmist here, and please do not interpret this as Panther bashing. It is not. Something very serious and sad has happened that may or may not affect other contractors, depending on Panther's insurance levels and ability to get the company out of this mess as soon as they can.
My carrier is FedEx Custom Critical. If it were a FedEx truck involved, and it just as easily could have been, I would be asking the same questions and perhaps dusting off my carrier choice Plan B, in case it may be needed.
It is better to be prepared for problems before they occur than to react unprepared to them after. It is also better to be fully informed about one's carrier's status, especially in a case like this, when the truck stop rumor mills will be running wide open.
This is an opportunity for the newly-elected Panther driver council (is that the correct name for it?) to do good work on behalf of their drivers and carrier. Council members know what drivers will want to know. They can help Panther get that information privately and quickly to the fleet before rumors compound the problems Panther already has.
You can be sure that a number of lawyers are already trying to work their way into this multi-year, career-maker case(s).
Also, this incident will likely have adverse consequences on Panther's public offering if Panther proceeds with it. As all registration statements do, Panther's preliminary registration statement includes a section entitled, "Legal Proceedings."
The Legal Proceedings section in Panther's latest statement says, "The nature of our business routinely results in litigation, primarily involving claims for personal injury and property damage incurred in the transportation of freight. We believe all such litigation is adequately covered by insurance or otherwise reserved for and that adverse results in one or more of those cases would not have a material adverse effect on our financial condition, operating results and cash flows."
That is routine language for a company that has nothing extraordinary going on. But the above incident is extraordinary. If the public offering proceeds, the registration statement will be updated and the Legal Proceedings language will likely be changed to reflect the liability or potential liability Panther has rising out of this incident.
That is not the kind of language that prospective investors and investment holding companies like Fenway like to read. It is the kind of language that give current shareholders pause to reconsider their holdings.
If I was a Panther contractor, I would be eager to know how much insurance, re-insurance and self-insurance Panther carries. The ramifications of this accident may extend well beyond Florida.
I am not trying to be an alarmist here, and please do not interpret this as Panther bashing. It is not. Something very serious and sad has happened that may or may not affect other contractors, depending on Panther's insurance levels and ability to get the company out of this mess as soon as they can.
My carrier is FedEx Custom Critical. If it were a FedEx truck involved, and it just as easily could have been, I would be asking the same questions and perhaps dusting off my carrier choice Plan B, in case it may be needed.
It is better to be prepared for problems before they occur than to react unprepared to them after. It is also better to be fully informed about one's carrier's status, especially in a case like this, when the truck stop rumor mills will be running wide open.
This is an opportunity for the newly-elected Panther driver council (is that the correct name for it?) to do good work on behalf of their drivers and carrier. Council members know what drivers will want to know. They can help Panther get that information privately and quickly to the fleet before rumors compound the problems Panther already has.
There is nothing particularly extraordinary about the accident, at least insofar as the Panther truck's involvement in it. These were two separate and distinct accidents. If the published account is true, then the Panther truck was following too closely, and caused a rear-end collision of the pickup truck, followed by a collateral sideswiping of the big truck. Accident over. End of Panther's involvement.
At the scene of that accident, as traffic began merging into one lane, and slowing down, to get around the initial accident, two tractor trailers actually stopped, one, the soda pop truck, in the right lane behind the fire truck, and another in the left lane. It was then that the BMW that was following the big trucks too closely slammed into the rear of the left lane truck, and right behind the BMW was the Chevrolet TrailBlazer who was also following too closely and failed to stop, and then swerved into the soda truck. Then a couple of other big trucks, also following too closely, slammed into the big mess.
It's the pickup truck's fault, but he and the original side-swiped big truck (assuming his logs were in order) will be the only ones who go blameless in the whole ordeal. Everyone else was following too closely.
At the scene of that accident, as traffic began merging into one lane, and slowing down, to get around the initial accident, two tractor trailers actually stopped, one, the soda pop truck, in the right lane behind the fire truck, and another in the left lane. It was then that the BMW that was following the big trucks too closely slammed into the rear of the left lane truck, and right behind the BMW was the Chevrolet TrailBlazer who was also following too closely and failed to stop, and then swerved into the soda truck. Then a couple of other big trucks, also following too closely, slammed into the big mess.
It's the pickup truck's fault, but he and the original side-swiped big truck (assuming his logs were in order) will be the only ones who go blameless in the whole ordeal. Everyone else was following too closely.
slfisher45
Expert Expediter
Ateam, you wrote the two paragraphs copied below. I edited them out of your wordy ill-placed condemnation of Panther Expedited Services. Quoting Diane an attorney agreeing with RichM is hardly a rich source of reliable information. Turtle explains the accident quite well, you on the other hand have to deny Panther bashing, as if it were my thought, until you mentioned it. Suggesting all Panther drivers "dust off their carrier choice plan B." is almost telling everyone to bail. Again I say you and RichM should have posted your input elswhere in a business forum under, "Business concerns about your carrier."
The following is the aforementioned excerpt:
"Diane, an attorney, agrees with RichM; provided that the facts of the case turn out to be in line with what is reported in this thread (media reports are not always accurate).
You can be sure that a number of lawyers are already trying to work their way into this multi-year, career-maker case(s).
My carrier is FedEx Custom Critical. If it were a FedEx truck involved, and it just as easily could have been, I would be asking the same questions and perhaps dusting off my carrier choice Plan B, in case it may be needed.
Check the topic of the original post..............
The following is the aforementioned excerpt:
"Diane, an attorney, agrees with RichM; provided that the facts of the case turn out to be in line with what is reported in this thread (media reports are not always accurate).
You can be sure that a number of lawyers are already trying to work their way into this multi-year, career-maker case(s).
My carrier is FedEx Custom Critical. If it were a FedEx truck involved, and it just as easily could have been, I would be asking the same questions and perhaps dusting off my carrier choice Plan B, in case it may be needed.
Check the topic of the original post..............
bernieh48
Veteran Expediter
Some of you on here never seem to quit amazing me! After such a horrific accident all you can think about is who is going to get sued and blamed for this!
For your info those of you who are so-called ambulance lawyers the Panther truck was not at fault and was not cited. The pickup was cited as he was trying to move back over in front of the other semi and was halfway between to two lanes when he slammed on the brakes in front of both the Panther truck and the other semi!
You should wait and get all the facts straight next time you choose right away to condemn the Panther drivers for this! No wonder why I don't post on here very often because everything that is said or done gets twisted into whatever agenda seems to be on your mind that day!
So sad that people in this country both on this forum and on other forums are right thinking about who can be sued and who is to blame!
Why don't you concentrate on the families of the people who died!
God Bless and have a great day!
For your info those of you who are so-called ambulance lawyers the Panther truck was not at fault and was not cited. The pickup was cited as he was trying to move back over in front of the other semi and was halfway between to two lanes when he slammed on the brakes in front of both the Panther truck and the other semi!
You should wait and get all the facts straight next time you choose right away to condemn the Panther drivers for this! No wonder why I don't post on here very often because everything that is said or done gets twisted into whatever agenda seems to be on your mind that day!
So sad that people in this country both on this forum and on other forums are right thinking about who can be sued and who is to blame!
Why don't you concentrate on the families of the people who died!
God Bless and have a great day!
Ateam wrote
That is routine language for a company that has nothing extraordinary going on. But the above incident is extraordinary. If the public offering proceeds, the registration statement will be updated and the Legal Proceedings language will likely be changed to reflect the liability or potential liability Panther has rising out of this incident.
That is not the kind of language that prospective investors and investment holding companies like Fenway like to read. It is the kind of language that give current shareholders pause to reconsider their holdings
============================================
Just who do you think owns Panther? Could it be Fenway? Phil, that has got to be one of the more rediculous posts you have put up in a while. The Panther driver wasn't even cited. Additionally, the implication that Panther is underinsured is foolish.
Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
That is routine language for a company that has nothing extraordinary going on. But the above incident is extraordinary. If the public offering proceeds, the registration statement will be updated and the Legal Proceedings language will likely be changed to reflect the liability or potential liability Panther has rising out of this incident.
That is not the kind of language that prospective investors and investment holding companies like Fenway like to read. It is the kind of language that give current shareholders pause to reconsider their holdings
============================================
Just who do you think owns Panther? Could it be Fenway? Phil, that has got to be one of the more rediculous posts you have put up in a while. The Panther driver wasn't even cited. Additionally, the implication that Panther is underinsured is foolish.
Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
Sadly, this thread has gotten completely off topic. Although the litigation potential topic is very interesting, it should not have pre-empted the issue at hand, which is the health and well being of our colleagues in the Panther D Truck.
To all those interested in the legal aspects of this tragic accident, please move on to another thread. All members more interested in the purpose of bernieh48's thread please carry on.
Terry O'Connell
Moderator
To all those interested in the legal aspects of this tragic accident, please move on to another thread. All members more interested in the purpose of bernieh48's thread please carry on.
Terry O'Connell
Moderator
FAMILYEXPDT
Seasoned Expediter
What an idiot.
Our prayers to the people involved in this accident. A word of advice....unless you were there...stop speculating....and I am also certain that like most companies the talk should only occur from authorized people. Bernie's original post for concern for people involved is where this should stop. ATeam should know a good business person needs goodwill and compassion, as well as knowledge. There is a time and place to talk about legal repercussions...no time and place to speculate on future of company unless you are the one deciding that future. This forum does not strike me as either the time or place...and ATeams sig is not on my settlement.
-Charlee
Our prayers to the people involved in this accident. A word of advice....unless you were there...stop speculating....and I am also certain that like most companies the talk should only occur from authorized people. Bernie's original post for concern for people involved is where this should stop. ATeam should know a good business person needs goodwill and compassion, as well as knowledge. There is a time and place to talk about legal repercussions...no time and place to speculate on future of company unless you are the one deciding that future. This forum does not strike me as either the time or place...and ATeams sig is not on my settlement.
-Charlee
Unfortunately it looks like it was my post that triggered the liability issue. I should have know better and want to apologize to anyone whose feelings may have been hurt. I sent PM's to Bernie and Fish re this issue.
However my first sentenace was that "I am glad the drivers are OK,"then I was just thinking out loud about the cause and pitfalls of the accident. Had I known that I was going to get the A Team cranked up I would have stayed silent.
Kudos to Panther for doing the right thing for their drivers. About 12 years ago I was rear ended by a Semi near Memphis and Roberts did all the right things for me. The relationship between carrier and contractor is sort of like a family that doesn't always get along but when the chips are down they are there for each other.
However my first sentenace was that "I am glad the drivers are OK,"then I was just thinking out loud about the cause and pitfalls of the accident. Had I known that I was going to get the A Team cranked up I would have stayed silent.
Kudos to Panther for doing the right thing for their drivers. About 12 years ago I was rear ended by a Semi near Memphis and Roberts did all the right things for me. The relationship between carrier and contractor is sort of like a family that doesn't always get along but when the chips are down they are there for each other.
blacktiger
Expert Expediter
Glad your friends are doing ok Bernie.
Gotta wonder what the I'm so perfect team was thinkin with that story.
Charlotte got it right
Don't worry Mr. Rich, it didn't sound like you were on a bash Panther crusade.
George
Gotta wonder what the I'm so perfect team was thinkin with that story.
Charlotte got it right
Don't worry Mr. Rich, it didn't sound like you were on a bash Panther crusade.
George
I apologize too. It was only after we were assured the Panther drivers were OK that I commented on Rich's liability item and I was one of the first to express concern about those folks in a post of my own and in this thread. Nevertheless, I was insensitive and apologize.
bernieh48
Veteran Expediter
Well the news is pretty much the same. The teamt mainly the female driver are really shook up. She keeps thinking about the 5 dead. I try and tell her to get that thought out of her head as it was just a major unfortunate series of events that caused it. She did nothing to cause it.They are still in a hotel down there awaiting to see if the engine in the truck is fixable. Not sure if it will be though. A testament to strapping down loads good though is that none of the frieght was damaged at all esp. since they had 2 jet engines on.
Once again thanks to all for their concern.
Rich your apology is accepted and I knew you weren't getting off on a tangent. Can't say as much for Phil though. He always has to have the limelight. Even start his own thread on everything too!
Once again thanks to all for their concern.
Rich your apology is accepted and I knew you weren't getting off on a tangent. Can't say as much for Phil though. He always has to have the limelight. Even start his own thread on everything too!
Driving too fast for conditions
Appears that the log hauler got the worst end of the truckers side of it, just about as bad as the people in those crumpled cars. Never seen a cab mangled beyond comprehension like that in 30 years. If it weren't for the truck wheels and stacks, I'd have a hard time believing that was a truck. Panther appears to be OK if she stayed in the truck. That Deputy who was standing outside his cruiser doing his procedures sure didn't expect what was about to happen his way.
As bad as this one was, there have been quite a few worse, many more cars and trucks involved, and many more people on the way to either the morgue or hospital. The hills around Kentucky and Tennessee have been famous for fog related wrecks involving up to 50 or more vehicles.
Those poor people in that BMW never had a chance. Sure Panther is doing OK IF she didn't get out of her truck. Man, that log hauler had to be peeled out from under all that mess.
Bad, real bad for those unlucky few.
>Can everyone please keep those involved in that terrible
>accident on the FL turnpike in their prayers. One of our
>fleets owners D units with Panther was involved in this. You
>can go to sunsentinel.com to read the story and see the
>pics. Please keep this driver in your prayers. She was a
>single line female driver. Still do not know how she is
>doing. Thanks
OOIDA MEMBER#: 708700
Appears that the log hauler got the worst end of the truckers side of it, just about as bad as the people in those crumpled cars. Never seen a cab mangled beyond comprehension like that in 30 years. If it weren't for the truck wheels and stacks, I'd have a hard time believing that was a truck. Panther appears to be OK if she stayed in the truck. That Deputy who was standing outside his cruiser doing his procedures sure didn't expect what was about to happen his way.
As bad as this one was, there have been quite a few worse, many more cars and trucks involved, and many more people on the way to either the morgue or hospital. The hills around Kentucky and Tennessee have been famous for fog related wrecks involving up to 50 or more vehicles.
Those poor people in that BMW never had a chance. Sure Panther is doing OK IF she didn't get out of her truck. Man, that log hauler had to be peeled out from under all that mess.
Bad, real bad for those unlucky few.
>Can everyone please keep those involved in that terrible
>accident on the FL turnpike in their prayers. One of our
>fleets owners D units with Panther was involved in this. You
>can go to sunsentinel.com to read the story and see the
>pics. Please keep this driver in your prayers. She was a
>single line female driver. Still do not know how she is
>doing. Thanks
OOIDA MEMBER#: 708700
RE: Driving too fast for conditions
While our first thoughts are for the injured and those who lost their lives in the accident, I would argue that the matter of blame, in a legal sense, is an appropriate subject, on a forum for drivers. I believe we all know that "there, but for the grace of God..." because we are out there seeing it every day. And this accident, particularly, is of interest, because the original accident was a rear ender. If the reports that the Panther driver who rearended the pickup truck was absolved of blame are accurate, this represents a reversal of the traditional assignment of "fault" to the driver who ran into another vehicle - a reversal that IMO, is long overdue. Because the 'safe following distance' upon which the rule is based, simply doesn't exist, sometimes, no matter how much one tries to maintain it - if there is room for someone to get in, someone will. And this is an even bigger problem for those of us who drive vehicles that are bigger, because no one wants to be behind us. Have you never had a vehicle pull in front of you, then hit the brakes? I'm pretty sure that isn't what happened here, but still, the rule that says rearend collisions are ALWAYS the fault of the driver in the rear is one that needs revised. If that happened here, then glory be, it's about time.
While our first thoughts are for the injured and those who lost their lives in the accident, I would argue that the matter of blame, in a legal sense, is an appropriate subject, on a forum for drivers. I believe we all know that "there, but for the grace of God..." because we are out there seeing it every day. And this accident, particularly, is of interest, because the original accident was a rear ender. If the reports that the Panther driver who rearended the pickup truck was absolved of blame are accurate, this represents a reversal of the traditional assignment of "fault" to the driver who ran into another vehicle - a reversal that IMO, is long overdue. Because the 'safe following distance' upon which the rule is based, simply doesn't exist, sometimes, no matter how much one tries to maintain it - if there is room for someone to get in, someone will. And this is an even bigger problem for those of us who drive vehicles that are bigger, because no one wants to be behind us. Have you never had a vehicle pull in front of you, then hit the brakes? I'm pretty sure that isn't what happened here, but still, the rule that says rearend collisions are ALWAYS the fault of the driver in the rear is one that needs revised. If that happened here, then glory be, it's about time.