Low prices are killing this month!ppl bending over like crazy!

[ATeam]

Well if and when the ELD mandate takes effect a van hauling placardable hazmat that has to log would have to log electronically from what I can see.

That could become a significant issue. Trucks have to log all the time so having an ELD all the time makes sense (assuming you you agree with the requirement to have an ELD in the first place). Vans only have to log when placarded but they would have to pay the cost of having an ELD in the van all the time.

Would the monthly and ongoing cost of an ELD justify the number of HAZMAT loads a given van caries? Would the HAZMAT pay differential for a van make it worth it to have an ELD?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

easy solution....don't offer van service for Hazmat loads....give the work to the Straights....

since there is no incentive for a CV owner to do so....I wouldn't even consider the extra expense of being certified and the ELD....

 

[Turtle]

since there is no incentive for a CV owner to do so....

DING! DING! DING! We have a winner!

There used to be a huge incentive. Hazardous material requiring placards used to pay nearly double that of a non-HAZMAT load. It was worth the additional hassles and risks involved, and it was worth the time and trouble for HAZMAT education and certification. Now most HAZMAT loads pay no different than a regular load.

 

[BigStickJr]

Wow, little to no incentive ?

PT Barnum was right !

 

[coalminer]

That could become a significant issue. Trucks have to log all the time so having an ELD all the time makes sense (assuming you you agree with the requirement to have an ELD in the first place). Vans only have to log when placarded but they would have to pay the cost of having an ELD in the van all the time.

Would the monthly and ongoing cost of an ELD justify the number of HAZMAT loads a given van caries? Would the HAZMAT pay differential for a van make it worth it to have an ELD?

But remember you can use paper logs if you don't need to log more than 8 days in a 30 day period so dispatch will have to take that into consideration.

 

[Moot]

DING! DING! DING! We have a winner!

There used to be a huge incentive. Hazardous material requiring placards used to pay nearly double that of a non-HAZMAT load. It was worth the additional hassles and risks involved, and it was worth the time and trouble for HAZMAT education and certification. Now most HAZMAT loads pay no different than a regular load.

What carrier was paying nearly double for HazMat loads?

 

[davekc]

Probably early Panther or Roberts days when I remember that.

 

[Moot]

Wow! Nearly double? In 1998 I was getting a $26 Hazmat surcharge. A few years latter it went up to $29.

 

[davekc]

Wow! Nearly double? In 1998 I was getting a $26 Hazmat surcharge. A few years latter it went up to $29.

Not on every load from what I remember. It was when you were the only one available. Still goes on today under the right circumstances. lol

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Wow! Nearly double? In 1998 I was getting a $26 Hazmat surcharge. A few years latter it went up to $29.

My Canadian carrier we received a 25% of the linehaul surcharge .

 

[FlyingVan]

Back in my FedEx Custom Critical days I did a fair share of them HazMat loads. If my memory still serves me, it wasn't double, but a good chunk more than regular loads. But of course all that changed when we went to flat rate.

 

[Turtle]

What carrier was paying nearly double for HazMat loads?

In taking with drivers from other carriers, several of them paid significantly more than a regular rate, but I can only speak to my own experiences at Con-Way NOW.

My very first load in expediting was four drums of HAZMAT paint from Decatur, AL to Wrigley Field. It paid $2.08 a mile. My second load was some kind of tar-like construction roofing material from Chicago to Heyward, CA (by Oakland). A bunch of metal 5 gallon buckets on two pallets. It paid $1.96 a mile. And now that I was good and giddy about expediting, my third load from San Jose, CA to Phoenix paid 85 cents.

The majority of my HAZMAT loads were Sherwin-Williams paint drums (generally $1.70 a mile), BASF chemicals ($1.40 a mile), Crown Battery, railroad batteries mostly but also some forklift batteries ($1.48 a mile), and Chromatech dyes and pigments out of Canton, MI ($1.55 a mile).

 

[Moot]

I only got my percentage of the published tariff and the percentage of the HazMat surcharge.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

I remember 1 carrier took their % of my hand unload....I'd say to them I got my 67% unloaded now you come out and do your share...LOL

 

[Turtle]

I only got my percentage of the published tariff and the percentage of the HazMat surcharge.

On many loads I did, too. But the 4 shippers above, I knew what they paid, and I stuck to my guns. I told them straight up I know what those shippers pay and I won't run HAZMAT from them on the cheap. I simply asked for 62% (despite not being contracted on a percentage), which I thought was fair. Only a couple of times did I turn the load down and not eventually get it at the higher rate.

That was back in the day when a lot of the BOLs had the line haul rate listed right there, and we knew exactly how badly we were getting screwed some times. LOL

I'll never forget one time with Panther I got a load picking up at a Gander Mountain in Chattanooga, TN going down to one in Mobile, AL. 400 miles and it paid my regular rate of 77 cents per mile plus the FSC (which I think was about 20 cents). My pay was $388. It was hot, hot, hot, picking up at 10 PM after they were already closed, and delivered straight through ASAP. It was emergency generators and coolers going down there because a hurricane was coming. It ended up being a pretty mild one that fizzled out before it hit land and I don't think it ever reached beyond tropical depression status. When they called me about the load I asked for a $50 bonus to cover deadheading back out to Memphis or Birmingham or even back to Chattanooga. The dispatcher said "We don't have enough in the load for that." Well, I got to the shipper and the BOL they handed me was the actual rate sheet that showed they paid Panther directly $1180.38. Cheap bastards.

I remember 1 carrier took their % of my hand unload....I'd say to them I got my 67% unloaded now you come out and do your share...LOL

The carrier taking their percentage of assessorials is normal, and understandable. They're the one that convinces the customer to pay it, and they are the ones who collect it.

 

[GuyUpNorth]

Ok

I was told the exact same thing by a MSP officer (at a Subway in Grand Rapids). He said OOS technically only applies to CMVs and that No Logs Required would be most accurate, even preferable to Off Duty.

I think No Logs Required sounds better and makes more sense as well. What doesn't make sense is continuing to log for the next 7 days if you think you might get another HAZMAT placarded load in that time frame. Why can't you just go back to No Log Required during the time between placarded loads?

 

[Turtle]

Why can't you just go back to No Log Required during the time between placarded loads?

When the officer asks for your logbook, and you hand it to him, it's supposed to show the previous 7 days, and if it shows a logged HAZMAT load 3 or 4 days earlier, you're not gonna be able to get away with No Logs Required, as the regulations explicitly say otherwise.

 

[GuyUpNorth]

When the officer asks for your logbook,in and you hand it to him, it's supposed to show the previous 7 days, and if it shows a logged HAZMAT load 3 or 4 days earlier, you're not gonna be able to get away with No Logs Required, as the regulations explicitly say otherwise.

Once I drop that first HAZMAT load I am no longer required to log. Why would I continue to do so?

 

[Turtle]

Once I drop that first HAZMAT load I am no longer required to log. Why would I continue to do so?

You are required to log the hours worked for compensation, whether in a CMV or not. The moment you sat behind the wheel of a CMV with that first HAZMAT load your 70 hour clock started. Performing work for compensation in a non CMV doesn't magically stop the clock.

If you don't carry another HAZMAT load within the next 7 days, you're good to go, no logging required. But if you get a HAZMAT load again within 7 days, your clock is still running, and you have to show those hours.

 

[GuyUpNorth]

There haven't been too many weeks over the last few months where I have not gotten at least 1 or 2 loads that would have forced me to break the 11 or 14 hour rule as well if I were under HOS rules. It would really be pretty difficult for me to take more than 1 placarded load in a van per week and remain 100% legal. Maybe i will just stick with under 1001lbs. Or class 9 hazmat and stay away from the placarded loads.