Our experience with C&M Transport so far...

[Mike99]

you two will be fine. you will figure it out. these times are tough and especially when you are new and its january. dont move from c&m. that advice is not sound advice. dont care what someone else at another carrier is doing. could be like my carrier, they pay a little better and wont run cheap so sometimes thing slow up because of all the others that will. we know it can be rough but atleast you are not paying for fuel. you should be able to make it through provided you have planned for things like this. if three weeks with minimal pay is going to break you as some have pointed out then you will have to find a way to get by. thats expediting. i cant imagine that will be the case. hang in there. you two seem to be willing and that is a huge plus.

and, our 2 van owner with panther, would 3 weeks with minimal pay break you. if so, i dont know what to say. if your a fleet owner you should be able to go longer than that. just seems you are stuck on goin broke and i cant see it.

You try to be smart ,I try to help this guys.I'm realistic. I dont have just two vans ,I have more .The two vans with Panther was just an example. I'm in business with vans since 2007 so I think I know some numbers. No, three weeks will not break anybody but you have to know when you stop. In my opinion they will not do at CM much better. They may be a great company ,but apparently they not a good fit for van teams.I wish this guys the best ,I wish 2000 plus miles week by week but I doubt they will do. Lets see in an other 3 weeks who was right. Be safe.

 

[highway star]

It is a little perplexing how I read posts from OntarioVanMan in the thread regarding "January locations" and he's posting 2500-3000 mile weeks.

But, you can also see that Turtle's experience has been very different, and he's with the same carrier as OVM. Luck really does come into play. January's just like that. I had a very bad January a few years back. I was at the office and was asked how I'm doing. When I said how bad January was for me, they were surprised as it was the best January C&M ever had. Just bad luck of the draw for me.

I'm very happy at C&M. I would encourage you to try and stick it out. They're as honest and straight forward a carrier as you'll ever find. They really do care about us.

 

[Dynamite 1]

You try to be smart ,I try to help this guys.I'm realistic. I dont have just two vans ,I have more .The two vans with Panther was just an example. I'm in business with vans since 2007 so I think I know some numbers. No, three weeks will not break anybody but you have to know when you stop. In my opinion they will not do at CM much better. They may be a great company ,but apparently they not a good fit for van teams.I wish this guys the best ,I wish 2000 plus miles week by week but I doubt they will do. Lets see in an other 3 weeks who was right. Be safe.

no, not trying to be smart. trying to point out, and several others in the business with quite a bit of experience, as much as you or in some case twice as much as you, will agree. giving advice to leave a carrier after 3 weeks in january is not sound advice. you cant just sign on somewhere and in 3 week decide to jump ship cause freight is slow. the op admitted there was another team that does quite well. besides the owner of their van probably would not be inclined to move it so they would then have to find another owner and go through the whole process again causing them more downtime.

no matter how you look at it 3 weeks in january isnt long enough to make a decision on. if im wrong then im sure all here will let me know cause we usually do. no gettin mad or being insulted its just trying to give opinion that help. which you are allowed to give yours as well. some of us just dont think it is sound for a new team just starting out.

 

[davekc]

I would probably have a different approach since you are hemorrhaging with limited information either from your fleet owner or the company itself. I know little about van freight with C & M and it wouldn't matter, but if I had a van struggling or was considering them, I would want some specific information.
This would apply regardless of the carrier.

In this case, it has been posted that "DSC" vans are owned and basically being loaded from one of their own dispatchers. Is that a problem? Are there others? May or may not be depending on the volume of van freight they handle. This is hardly a new concept as several carriers have someone "in house" with vehicles.
To determine if it is a problem is simple. Ask the carrier for revenue out of their top ten vans excluding those owned by the dispatcher. Last 6 or 12 months would be sufficient. That valuable information can be used to determine your position, or as a vehicle to make contact and see what they are doing to be successful.

It would be no different than purchasing a franchise in any industry. Wouldn't you want to know what the potential and or the return on investment.
Have to be careful with that ROI.
Keep in mind also that recruiters are sales people. Have to keep that in the proper context. One of those, "trust but verify".

If the carrier is unwilling to provide and share that information, then there is likely a reason. At this point with few paid miles and deadheading all over the place, you need to determine whether your current situation is a sustainable one.

There's my penny in the pond.

 

[highway star]

In this case, it has been posted that "DSC" vans are owned and basically being loaded from one of their own dispatchers. Is that a problem? Are there others? May or may not be depending on the volume of van freight they handle. This is hardly a new concept as several carriers have someone "in house" with vehicles.

I expressed concern about this with them when I first started. I was assured that it wasn't an issue. Now, most will say, "Well, duuuhhhh! What else are they gonna say?" But, given my overall experience with them I think that's the case.

 

[davekc]

I expressed concern about this with them when I first started. I was assured that it wasn't an issue. Now, most will say, "Well, duuuhhhh! What else are they gonna say?" But, given my overall experience with them I think that's the case.

Very true. That is why I said it may or may not be an issue. In this case since they are talking vans, it could be an issue. Since you have a straight, it may have little impact.
I guess if you are "dying on the vine" you have to make those issues a non factor.

 

[LDB]

One thing many may not be aware of, is that there is a particular dispatcher at C&M that also is a fleet owner of around 20 vans. They have DSC on them as well as the C&M logos. Something to consider. Just sayin.

That would definitely be a red flag. As already mentioned there are ways to check on it and find out if it's an issue or not.

 

[Mike99]

no, not trying to be smart. trying to point out, and several others in the business with quite a bit of experience, as much as you or in some case twice as much as you, will agree. giving advice to leave a carrier after 3 weeks in january is not sound advice. you cant just sign on somewhere and in 3 week decide to jump ship cause freight is slow. the op admitted there was another team that does quite well. besides the owner of their van probably would not be inclined to move it so they would then have to find another owner and go through the whole process again causing them more downtime.

no matter how you look at it 3 weeks in january isnt long enough to make a decision on. if im wrong then im sure all here will let me know cause we usually do. no gettin mad or being insulted its just trying to give opinion that help. which you are allowed to give yours as well. some of us just dont think it is sound for a new team just starting out.

I did not say quit tomorrow . Be realistic and admit that their miles,revenue is way under the average. They did everything good , they was in good locations. What I say is that they may find an other carrier where as a team do much better. The question how much they have to wait to see that they not make money? Three weeks , two months?I said ,I hate to change carriers but sometimes you have to do what you have to do. For example if you ask me ,Panther is not a good fit for a solo driver but it is for teams. In business is very important how and when to react. What I would do, I would stay two more weeks and if thing not getting better than change something. Dont forget they have to put food on the table.

 

[Turtle]

I did not say quit tomorrow .

No you didn't. You told them to quit sooner, right now, today. You said, "You should change company...." which is an implicit unqualified immediacy.

Be realistic and admit that their miles,revenue is way under the average.

One also needs to be realistic and admit that regardless of the month in question or the revenue, three weeks is not a sample size large enough which can be used to draw any type of conclusions about long term business trends.

They did everything good , they was in good locations.

Are you saying that good locations are always good locations? That good locations cannot ever, under any circumstances be bad locations? If so, then I have to tell you that my experience is very different. If you've been reading EO lately you will know that a lot of people have been commenting on how slow it is for the last 3 or 4 weeks. The industry itself has been slow, but for an individual truck that may or may not be the case. Some may have been routinely in the right place at the right time and did well, while some may have been in the wrong place at the wrong time and did worse than normal. There have been plenty of times over the years where people were going on and on about how busy they have been, while at the same time I've done squat. There have been other times when it was slow for everyone else, but I was running my little turtle wheels off. It happens.

For example if you ask me ,Panther is not a good fit for a solo driver but it is for teams.

That can also depend on your point of view. As a fleet owner, you'll make more money with a team van since the team van will run more miles. But for an individual driver in that van, their personal revenue is often not any better than a solo. For example, as a solo owner/operator driving my own van I will make considerably more money with a 1500 mile week than I will splitting revenue with an owner as a team putting in 2200 miles the same week. I was with Panther for 5 years and did very well there. As a solo. If I owned a vehicle that someone else was driving for me, obviously I'd prefer to have two people driving it rather than one.

The last three weeks for me has personally sucked rocks. But the last year most certainly has not.

 

[Mike99]

No you didn't. You told them to quit sooner, right now, today. You said, "You should change company...." which is an implicit unqualified immediacy.

One also needs to be realistic and admit that regardless of the month in question or the revenue, three weeks is not a sample size large enough which can be used to draw any type of conclusions about long term business trends.

Are you saying that good locations are always good locations? That good locations cannot ever, under any circumstances be bad locations? If so, then I have to tell you that my experience is very different. If you've been reading EO lately you will know that a lot of people have been commenting on how slow it is for the last 3 or 4 weeks. The industry itself has been slow, but for an individual truck that may or may not be the case. Some may have been routinely in the right place at the right time and did well, while some may have been in the wrong place at the wrong time and did worse than normal. There have been plenty of times over the years where people were going on and on about how busy they have been, while at the same time I've done squat. There have been other times when it was slow for everyone else, but I was running my little turtle wheels off. It happens.

That can also depend on your point of view. As a fleet owner, you'll make more money with a team van since the team van will run more miles. But for an individual driver in that van, their personal revenue is often not any better than a solo. For example, as a solo owner/operator driving my own van I will make considerably more money with a 1500 mile week than I will splitting revenue with an owner as a team putting in 2200 miles the same week. I was with Panther for 5 years and did very well there. As a solo. If I owned a vehicle that someone else was driving for me, obviously I'd prefer to have two people driving it rather than one.

The last three weeks for me has personally sucked rocks. But the last year most certainly has not.

Trust me I dont want to argue with you. I just said my opinion. And if waiting for load in WI ,OH, MI or IL is not good than where? In AL, GA, MS, TX?I have drivers and trust me I would do something in this situation.One more time, we are talking about 3 weeks not one week. It is just not normal .One more time it is just my opinion as a small fleet owner.

 

[Zoli]

you two will be fine. you will figure it out. these times are tough and especially when you are new and its january. dont move from c&m. that advice is not sound advice. dont care what someone else at another carrier is doing. could be like my carrier, they pay a little better and wont run cheap so sometimes thing slow up because of all the others that will. we know it can be rough but atleast you are not paying for fuel. you should be able to make it through provided you have planned for things like this. if three weeks with minimal pay is going to break you as some have pointed out then you will have to find a way to get by. thats expediting. i cant imagine that will be the case. hang in there. you two seem to be willing and that is a huge plus.

and, our 2 van owner with panther, would 3 weeks with minimal pay break you. if so, i dont know what to say. if your a fleet owner you should be able to go longer than that. just seems you are stuck on goin broke and i cant see it.

They will be fine... When? Poor guys have 1000 miles in three weeks....

 

[Rocketman]

They will be fine... When? Poor guys have 1000 miles in three weeks....

Definitely a rough start. But.... it's January and they are leased to a company that sticks to their rates. That's a tough call when it's slow, but overall, you'll learn to appreciate it.

 

[Dedic8edDave]

Wow!! Thank you all so much for your responses! I logged on this evening expecting to see a response or 2 but all of your feedback and positive reinforcement is wonderful to say the least. As far as going broke, that shouldn't happen for a while. We can hold out for another month or so to see if things get better. We are hoping things pick up with C&M as they do seem like a good company and very reputable here on EO.

It's funny that the fact there's a fleet owner/dispatcher at C&M was mentioned. Candy and I actually met our fleet owner for the first time just a few nights ago and he mentioned this to us as well. Just like Highway Star, our fleet owner was "assured" that there's no foul play at hand. I guess my question is, why? Why would a carrier have a fleet owner dispatch? It's obviously going to cause concern for all other fleet owners, owner/operators and drivers, so why do it? That's just my opinion. Maybe there is some reason that makes good business sense that I'm just totally unaware of.

I do have one big question for all of you that I hope you'll answer. If you were teaming in a Sprinter, what would be your top 3 choices of carriers to run with?

Thanks again everyone. All of your comments and suggestions are appreciated and respected.

 

[Turtle]

I do have one big question for all of you that I hope you'll answer. If you were teaming in a Sprinter, what would be your top 3 choices of carriers to run with?

Express-1, Panther, and I'm too ignorant to come up with a third. I just know that those two in particular will favor a team van over a solo van. And they're not coy about it, either.

 

[highway star]

I guess my question is, why? Why would a carrier have a fleet owner dispatch? It's obviously going to cause concern for all other fleet owners, owner/operators and drivers, so why do it? That's just my opinion. Maybe there is some reason that makes good business sense that I'm just totally unaware of.

A good question. Many companies have rules that prohibit the practice just for the peace of mind it gives their contractors. I can't come up with anything that would point to it being a "good" practice. Why have even a hint of impropriety? Has it cost them potential contractors signing on? Probably. Have contractors left when they found out about it? Probably. But, as I said before, my belief is it's all good. I have an excellent working relationship with that fleet owner and feel like he's as fair as anyone in that office.

(Hey Painesville, I've done some serious posterior smooching here... A load would be nice!)

 

[BigBadBill]

Definitely a rough start. But.... it's January and they are leased to a company that sticks to their rates. That's a tough call when it's slow, but overall, you'll learn to appreciate it.

This says it all and is so true. When a driver gets to a slow market, they are the ones that suffer from a firm line in the sand policy.

 

[xiggi]

Express-1, Panther, and I'm too ignorant to come up with a third. I just know that those two in particular will favor a team van over a solo van. And they're not coy about it, either.

I think you can add fedex to that list.

Sent from my Fisher Price - ABC 123

 

[Moot]

... but the thing about that is that no one knows which location is hot today, sigh.

Unless you got a load south yesterday, way south, I can guarantee you aren't in a hot location today!

 

[kurtkaoss]

Let me give you a bit of insight into what I've been doing, Dave:

I leased on with a major carrier in November, being told the their Sprinter freight was just booming. After a month on the road with them, I got 963 paid miles. Unhappy and going broke, I took a chance and moved to a smaller but well known carrier just before Christmas.

..In the last 9 days I've run 2600 miles, and I'm a solo. Will these miles keep up? Who knows...it's January, and the most unpredictable month in expediting, besides July.

My suggestion is, stay with C & M for a little while longer. I've been doing this on & off since 1997, and all the C & M drivers I've talked to are relatively happy. I hope you find great success doing this.

 

[Turtle]

I think you can add fedex to that list.

Sent from my Fisher Price - ABC 123

Possibly, but not on my personal list. They don't even make my Top 100.