Mexican Trucks

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Oh, the pain, the paaaiiinnn. The pain of change. Too funny.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

If you go back in history to the beginning of organized civilization you will find then, as now, the privileged few, and the masses. You had lands with kings and nobles, and then the peasants. Modern civilization as we know it today was build on the foundation of the Romans and Greeks, who built their societies largely on the slave-state. Indeed, Aristotle and many others believed not only in a natural inequality amongst humans, but that many people were natural born slaves.

Modern society is no different. We have the privileged few, and the masses. One could certainly argue that the lower class, the minimum wage earners and others, are to a degree the modern-day equivalent of the ancient slaves, where people aspire no higher than where they are at present, and indeed, could not rise to a higher level even if they wanted to, for lack of ability, intelligence, knowledge and drive, and, to be sure, a lack of opportunity.

There have always been the privileged, and the not-so privileged, and there always will be. This is not news. Just like the poor. There have always been poor, and there always will be, regardless of how much money you throw at them. In fact history has proven that the more money you give to the poor, the more poor there are. Funny, that.

So, now, because of modern technology and a rapidly changing world, the US has a choice to make. We can continue doing the same things we have been for the last 40 years and sit back, watch and wait, to see how things unfold, or we can take steps to ensure that the country as a whole can prosper with security.

People will lose their jobs, and jobs will move to Mexico and overseas. People will get other jobs, different jobs. The unemployment rate and the available workforce rate in this country has remained relatively stead throughout. It's not like the makers of manual typewriters, buggy whips and Tucker automobiles are incapable of other kinds of work. They just do different work now. The changes that are likely to occur will not be good for some people, but they will not even effect many others in their daily life at all. Mexican trucks delivering goods into the US and Canada might not be good for Billy Joe Bob the trucker, but for Jiminny Billy Bob the HVAC repair guy in Paducah, he's not gonna care much one way or the other.


It's simply economics, and if I owned a company I'd be inclined to do the same thing. If I could make my widgets for a cost of $10 or a cost of $40, I'm gonna go with the lower cost.

Here's a hypothetical for ya. All other things being equal, included loaded miles per year, you're made an offer where you can have all of your loads in the future at $1.50 per mile, or at $6 per mile. Which do you choose? Not so fast. In order to pay the $6 per mile contract, Alice the dispatcher will lose her job.

That's a tough call. Scribble, scribble, scribble, punch, punch, punch, crunch, crunch, crunch. "Sorry Alice, I just can't give up an extra $4.50 a mile out of my pocket to save your job. It's not my job to save your job. It's my job to make as much money and be as profitable as possible."

Yet that's precisely what many people are wanting the companies who move their manufacturing plants to do. It's not their job to provide, save and secure jobs for people. It's their job to make and sell widgets as profitably as possible.

Incidentally, the liberals among us who "ridicule" and "trivialize" do so because we refuse to allow others to make up our minds for us. We study intently both side of the issues, and take most everything with a grain of salt, facts and speudo-facts included, because all too often the speudo-facts turn out to be more accurate than the factually accurate lies we are given. Other times, not so much. Most often, the real truth is to be found somewhere in the middle, underneath all the wool. Also, some of the liberals among us ain't all that liberal. Some of the liberals among us, for example, wouldn't vote for Pat Buchanan because he's not far enough to the right. ;)
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
I actually think change and competition can be a good thing. What makes this alittle different is that government controls put US carriers and drivers at a significant disadvantage.
As for the economy I agree, Jack's widgets are going to be cheaper to purchase because his shipping costs will be less.
No secret as to why so many companies are relocating to Mexico.









Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
I do think it will be interesting to see what happens with the difference in the controls and regulations. To see, for example, if countless Mexican trucks will be pot OOS at scales for log and HoS violations. And how they're gonna deal with things like fuel taxes.

I do think that the same background checks that are done here for HAZMAT and FAST should be done for Mexican drivers wanting to enter here. And being that all three countries are in this together, if any of the Mexican drivers are denied entry into Canada, for any reason, then they should also be denied entry into the US for the same reason.

Maybe even more interesting will be to watch how the American truckers react if the DOT and others aren't enforcing these things. There are all kinds of possibilities, some really amusing and some pathetically sad. I have visions of a total blockade of US-Mexican border crossings, and a 55' trailer siege on Washington bringing all traffic to a snarling halt. hehe

I know all of the Mexican drivers are supposed to be able to speak and read English, but one thing I'm not looking forward to is having to deal with Spanish over the CB, because that means having to deal with the pure hatred that will be unleashed over the airwaves. And far too often that kind of crap escalates right to the side of the road.

I do think the initial deal is a little too ambitious. Instead of 100 companies, they should do exhaustive background checks for perhaps 100 trucks. Then, over a coupe of years or so, gradually raise it to the 100 company level. The problem with so many at once is, if there are any major problems, and you just know there will be, they will be totally unable to handle it in a rapid and efficient manner. And by the time they figure out what to do about it, there will be a different administration in charge. That will be bad enough, but if that administration belongs to Hillary... <shudder>
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
Your last sentence is scary Turtle. I quess if that comes to pass, they will be handing out free medical/health plans to foreigners at the border.











Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
 

driver628

Seasoned Expediter
Now im not sure what the Greeks and the Romans would have to say about all this, or the lords and knights at the round table. As an American, one who has seen and been effected by a cheap Mexican labor pool displacing normal everyday jobs and taking the skill out of skilled labor. It is my opinion that a job is a job is a job. For example, it is cheaper for someone who owns a brick mason company to hire a family of cheap labor than to employ a handfull of skilled masons. Result, that handful of guys is out a job that they would have otherwise had. This can be said for any job, including expediting when our turn comes around. If a non american can replace an american job, I just dont see how that could be good for anyone except those at the top? At the end of the day, if you can pay a mexican 5 cents a mile to drive a truck, it is only a matter of time before you, or me, or any of us are no longer cost effective labor. Solution, Mexico is for Mexicans, AMERICA is for legal AMERICAN citizens.
 

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
turtle,
the bad thing about your 55 footer idea is they will be all over length and considered oversized loads which means when those trailers roll of the assembly line they will have to purchase permits for them before they go to d.c. which means the government will be making money off of the blockade. or did you mean 53 footers. just pickin on ya. please don't take it personal.:p
 

silverdollar

Expert Expediter
Turtle, you are living proof that" a little knowledge is a dangerous thing." I have been told by a Texas DOT officer that
1- It is impossible to do a good back ground check on Mexican drivers,

2- Most Mexican drivers do not carry log books.

3- Mexican drivers do not run under HOS rules.

4- Almost impossible to ID a Mexican driver.

5- Almost all Mexican drivers will be driving Celedon or Swift or one of the other American company trucks, so how is DOT to know who to check. they sure can not check them all. face it, the politicians have brought this country to its knees. I feel sorry for the working man that is not ready to retire.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Not quite sure how I'm living proof that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. If yer gonna level a charge like that, the least you could do is back it up with specifics, particularly specifics that I've stated inaccurately. When someone falls into the category of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing, that means they have a limited, incomplete knowledge, and they are making decisions based upon that limited knowledge. Please, how have I done that? I don't know it all, not do I profess to. Educate me.

I'm well aware of the first four points you address, which is why I mentioned them in the manner that I did. For example, since Mexican drivers do not carry log books or run under HoS rules, I think it's a fair a logical question to ask if DOT officers will put Mexican drivers OOS en mass for these violations, and that's why I brought it up. Please tell me, in what way have I erred because of that limited knowledge?

Your fifth point, I'm not sure how that relates to my severely limited knowledge, as I may very well be wrong if I were to assume that "almost all" Mexican drivers will be driving American trucks, particularly since the issue at hand is allowing domiciled Mexican trucks with Mexican drivers into the US. It's not about the hiring of Mexican drivers legal or otherwise, to drive American trucks, as that is another issue altogether.


Maybe it's because I mistyped 55 instead of 53, I dunno. If so, I do apologize for showing my ignorance, as well as my poor typing skills (of that there is no question - I suck at typing).
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
What bothers me about this most of all is the comment Tutle made; "I know all of the Mexican drivers are supposed to be able to speak and read English," I think he has brought up an important point.

What level of english do they need to have to drive here?

Is it something like being able to say yes and no or have a third grade level of english?

I can tell you that living in arab world here in Michigan, the Arabs are treated in such a way that they don't have to even attempt to learn english and you don't dare question the state for the 30 different languages (emblishment there) of state forms and the allowence of use of translators for things like drivers license tests. I would say the prevention of 'discrimination' of the latino person has been the utmost importance for our country at the cost of life and liberties and has allowed exceptions to be made under the same guise that is used for the Arabs.

But let's go a little beyound the language problem, what happens if some mexican national in a truck (that could work for any company) causes an accident and drives back over the border to flee? I mean that many mexicans come here and commit crimes and simply go back over the border. The mexican goverment does not arrest common criminals for US prosicution, (in some cases they are relatives of corupt cops in Mexico and even here which protects them) and they have had a habit of helping invaders to come here. In addition to this, our laws do not allow us to sue the company that employs these people unless there is some sort of negelence on their part, which is unlikely seeing that the companies had a hand in writing the laws to hire and allow these mexicans to drive on our roads.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Whew. Don't get me started on a national language. I know that if I moved to France, they're not gonna give me a driver's license unless I can fluently speak and write French. Here, you can take your driver's license test in Chinese, for cryin' out lout. When you move to another country, and if you want to participate in that country, then out of simple respect for others in that country, you should learn the language of that country.

All multiculturalism does is foster the barriers of separation, and prevents anything from melting in the melting pot.

In order to get a CDL you have to be able to understand English well enough to speak it and read it. And I'm sure that the first crop of Mexican drivers will all be fluent in English, as they will be engaged in English conversation in order to get them approved.

But what about after this first crop comes through? How soon before we start seeing drivers who can't read what the Amber emergency and construction warning signs are telling them?
 

simon says

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Wake up and smell the coffee. You would be better served talking to your fellow Canadian drivers about their raging dislike for Pakistani drivers. Anyway, not singling you out, but I don't think the Pakis have come over in hordes to ruin driving here or ON., and I don't think a handful of Mexican drivers will either. Besides, they can only drop here, pickup and go back. Just like the US & CA. drivers.

Frankly, this whole thread belongs in the soapbox column- it's starting to stink up the general expeditor column...
 

darkunicorn

Seasoned Expediter
Not going to totally repeat my self already posted to a similar but its not new its been going on for over 2 years maybe adding more companies to it but there has been 4 Mexican trucking companies doing it for some time now.
No CDL or Insurance look around they are here already news media is a little slow.
 

joebob1_30132

Expert Expediter
>Iam sure 53's will be more common.
>I have to agree with the others. Even if a US carrier is
>granted to go in to Mexico, it won't be with my trucks.
>There is way too much risk for drivers let alone equipment,
>for me to even consider it.

>You got that right Dave and they know that ..this is a win win for the mexican labor pool.. t will be equal on paper only. truckers list of wont do's is( no cheap freight and home time) and certainly no dangerous runs ..very respectable, and resonable, It is unfair to undercut these items by recruiting cheap labor .. This maybe one for the unions? ( Gawd help me).
>
>
>Davekc
>owner
>22 years
>PantherII
>EO moderator
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
For two years they have been able to operate within 50 miles of the border, not running in all 48 states. In otherwords, you haven't to this point seen a Mexican carrier on the Ohio turnpike.
That is what would be new.
There has always been a handful in other areas, but I would well imagine they are running illegal.







Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
 

blizzard2014

Veteran Expediter
Driver
One word; Accident! Yup, there it is; i've said it! You're going to see a definite increase in traffic accidents once our interstate system is overrun by mexican truck drivers. So, I hope that little bit of money they save by hiring them will offset the massive wave of lawsuits that will shake the big trucking companies right down to their very core.
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
>They are currently retrofitting trucks with extra fuel tanks
>so when they come up into the US, they can carry Mexican
>fuel. Mexican fuel is considerably cheaper because it
>doesn't have the same tax, or have to meet any EPA
>standards.

I remember in the late 70's Canadian trucks coming down from Winnipeg with those oval shaped home heating oil tanks strapped behind the cab.
These tanks were full of diesel fuel or maybe they were smuggling hockey pucks.

Eventually trade, wages, prices and monetary value evened out. The same will happen with Mexico. And when it does the problem with illegals should disappear. It just might take 20 or 30 years.
 

highway star

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
I've been to Laredo and Brownsville and I haven't seen anything that supports the increased accident concern. And, that's where they're operating. I'm not saying I'm a fan of them being here...
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
My only hope is that their drivers can read a sign that says "STOP" or "ROAD CLOSED AHEAD"









Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator
 

davebeckym

Expert Expediter
Well, I've been to Quebec a few times. They didn't ask me at the border if I spoke French, so I don't think they'll be asking Mexicans if they speak English. Last time I was there, I went to the receiving door and didn't see anyone. So I Hollered "Anybody here?" and some guy answered in French. I asked "Do you speak English?" and he said "Yes, do you speak french?" "NO." "Why not?" he asked. "Because where I live, a lot of people speak Spanish. So I learned some Spanish. Do you speak Spanish?" "No" "well why not?" I asked.

He didn't think it was funny.

A couple things I haven't seen mentioned. Mexican diesel tends to gel up when it gets cold. If they don't stop and buy some expensive American diesel, they're going to have problems in cold weather. And speaking of cold weather, how many Mexicans have ever driven in snow?

Also, when Japan opened to more free trade, all those cheap Asian imports flooded in and was one of the causes of their deflation. Japan's GNP was stagnant for a decade or more. Could cheap imports from Mexico, Central America and South America do the same to us?
 
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