DQ'd - left holding the bill. need advice

[Saturnista]

This is a post that most of you have probably been expecting, if you've read the post my wife made asking for advice in the past couple weeks. We just weren't expecting it to come about in this exact way.

Well, I've had so many fellow students informing me the big T/T company I signed with was looking for ways to cut students, I thought it possible, but didn't think it would happen to me, at least that's what I hoped.

I've been away for several days without internet while attending orientation. I just got home after being DQ'd during orientation.

I've already gone to their CDL Mill, got a IN license that I need to transfer back to TN if I even can.

I've told pretty much everyone, from the recruiter, to the school, to now my ex-perspective employer, that I had a left knee injury resulting from a car accident, and wasn't sure I could pass the DOT physical, and wasn't sure I could drive a clutch / manual transmission for extended periods.

Well, the recruiter and the school took me in, and told me don't worry about it, the company you are going to has almost all automatics. I passed the school's DOT physical, even telling the school's DOT doc that I had a knee injury.

I got all the way through the CDL Mill, even though they only had 10 speed MT's. It was a bit painful and trying, normally my knee doesn't hurt much if at all, but after all the time in the school trucks, it was starting to ache. I graduated from the CDL Mill, and got sent to Orientation at the company.

The company, once I arrived at their terminal, I then learned only had a few automatics, almost all of their fleet is manuals, and all of their trainer trucks are manuals. So they asked me to see their DOT doc and get re-examined. The DOT doc said my knee is offset, likely needs to be examined by an orthopedist, and may even need surgery. The Doc said he couldn't sign off on my DOT physical knowing that I would be going into a manual, that they would only be able to approve me with DOT for an automatic only.

At this point with my DOT standing at automatic transmission only, I was DQ'd. They furthermore claimed that my medical records from the school indicated that my knee wasn't as bad off as their doc felt it was, so they felt I was being dishonest, and that very likely, I would still owe the $6,000-7,000 cost of training. They advised I should try and find a company that is willing to hire me with no OTR experience, and would guarantee me an automatic from the start. What gripes me the most is I told them going into all of this, with the recruiter, that I had a knee injury resulting from a car accident and now they're telling me that I lied to them. It looks like the recruiter may have fudged the paperwork to make me look better to the company to start with, and now I'm taking the blame.

I also learned while at the company that the other thing I had asked about before starting school, that the recruiter was "mistaken" [sic] in what he said, and that I would not be able to do both.

That issue was this: Currently I am a reserve police officer in TN, and have an address in that state that I use for my work with that department, while my primary residence is in OH. I need to spend about two-three weeks a year in TN to work for that department to stay certified as a police officer. Keep in mind that's not three weeks straight, but about three weeks worth of off time (so: a day here, weekend there, is ok usually).

I figured that might be easy enough... I'm a hard worker. I figured I'd go out for 5-6 weeks straight, then take my allotted 4-5 days off in TN, fulfill my obligations to the Police Department, then next time I had some off time closer to Ohio, spend it with my family.

I was told they would not be able to do that, and that even though I had two permanent addresses, as employment was offered through OH not TN, that I would have to have an OH CDL.



I'm at a loss now. I don't have $7 grand. Hell, i'm in the hole by a grand. I've been laid off since December. I want a job, I need a job. The jobs are scarce here. There is more people looking for a job than actual jobs available. The Police departments aren't hiring in OH, and i'm not sure I'd pass a strenuous PT with a new department if I tried.

Since I didn't pass DOT (the doctor said I would pass with auto-only if the company would take it, but the company wouldn't so I didn't pass) so I'll have to do that over again except now it'll all be on my own dime.

I'm not asking for a hand out, I don't want anyone's money. I do want a job, but I'm only posting this here asking for advice.
If you have a genuine need for a driver and think you can work with my needs and help me out, great! Let me know. I'm not asking for anyone to go out of there way for me though, I really came here for advice.

I'm married, with no kids. I have obligations (at least for now) to my police department, and to my family, we moved from TN to OH for family reasons on my wife's side, and unfortunately we can't back "root" to TN. I could move back to TN on my own if I needed to, that's the reason why we kept two addresses, but my wife would not be able to come with me, and the job availabilities doesn't appear much better in TN right now with the state of the economy.

I got interested in trucking to begin with because I was interested in Expediting. I used to work for FedEx Express, and through that made relations (now lost) to truck drivers and FXCC Expediters. I was hoping to get a year of OTR with the big van company, and then move into expediting. Now it seems more like my entire life as of late has been one huge nightmare.


In the last ten years, i've had one not-at-fault accident, which is what resulted in my knee injury, and no tickets. I've got a clean driving history. I've got a squeaky clean drug, alcohol and criminal history as a cop. I don't drink, don't smoke, don't do drugs, and try to be as trustworthy as humanly possible.

I want to say again, I'm not asking for a hand out, I'm not asking for anyone to go out of their way with a job offer, If the best you can offer is advice, please do so. I've looked through the classifieds and found two postings that looked promising and I will contact, but I'd like to look for other opportunities also and would like your advice in finding them.

 

[BillChaffey]

You might want to send your letter to the Attorney General of the state the Carrier is in, as long as you have some type of proof you told the Carrier up front about your Knee.

 

[Saturnista]

It was verbal, over the phone, and verbal in person several times, from interview to the first DOT doctor. It wasn't until the company I was supposed to start with, and their own DOT doctor, do I feel like someone even really really listened to me. Everyone acknowledge what I was telling them when I talked to them, but now I'm left holding the bag with no proof in my hands.

I thought it weird, the school had me sign the exam document and their dot doc asked the questions on it, but i never marked them, when I got to the company they had me fill all that out myself, and their form was much more in depth about each little thing than the one the school had. I feel like I was pushed through the school and set up to fail.

And now, I have nothing. Except possibly the bill.

If I can get in with someone that has an auto I should be fine, My knee hadn't been hurting for a long time, and didn't really start hurting til I was driving a 10 speed at the school. Occasional clutch work I could do I think, and I told them that, but daily non stop clutch work, probably not.

I've got a few directions i'm pursuing, with any luck I can get on with someone else, and if i'm really lucky, maybe I won't be stuck with the bill (especially if I can't use the CDL).

 

[Crazynuff]

I hear more and more about tractor trailer schools exploiting students . They will take students with bad MVR's knowing they are very unlikely to get a job . Carriers send potential students prehire agreements which mean nothing . Wannabes showing up on trucking forums are warned but few listen . There are too many graduates already that can't find work and the number increases every day .

 

[Saturnista]

Yeah, I wished I had read around beforehand.
Hindsight is 20/20

 

[termite289]

once again someone who was told trucking is easy, this is all ya gotta do.
dude i understand your problem. However, millis transfer has a driver mill as well, and at one point they had auto shift trucks, (have a clutch and you only use it to start and stop). there is a lot more to the job than just sitting there holding a wheele. sliding tandems to adjust the weight, requires you to climb in and out. hand unloads. sweeping out the trailer. trudging through the snow in the winter, and walking from the far end of the truckstop parking lot in the summer. carying paperwork into the scale house. and what happens when you get called to have a physical while on the road. will that doc who dosn't know you, or have any interest in whether you pass or not, will he pass you?
when i first went to work with millis, 12 years ago, i rode a grey dog up to orientation, and was rejected because i had a hernia. They were nice enough to let me ride home with one of their drivers, who wouldn't drive at night, and had to park close to a bar. broke and in dispair i waited on this goober to get me to Ga, where i made a phone call and had someone come and pick me up.
then i went to the bank, borrowed the money, had a hernia repair surgery, and went back to orientation in 4 weeks. and stayed with millis for 6 years.
have you checked with other companies near your home, covenant, ozark, u.s. express. avrit, or ups.
might get a cargo van gig, or a strait truck

 

[Saturnista]

I've contacted a few large companies already, still waiting to hear back from them. I've also talked to an individual expediting fleet owner that was interested in me and genuinely seemed interested in helping me out and putting me into a team with an experienced driver in an auto shift straight truck. I'll know some time next week whether that one will pan out, it'll depend on if I can get my paperwork filed for the DOD clearance necessary.

As for the rest of the things that go with driving, I've never had a problem with them, to be honest. I know my limitations, and they basically are only long-term repetitive use (such as clutching, or riding a bike for several hours). I've been to many doctors about this ever since the car accident and this doctor is the first one that has ever said I was bad enough off to qualify for disability and welfare (yes, the doctor actually said that!) and should work a desk job for the rest of my life. Up until recently, I've always worked in high-activity jobs. Over Christmas I worked in a distribution center and that involved a lot of physical activity, and it never bothered my knee because it wasn't that type of repetitive activity that I know I can't handle.

I'm just really frustrated by all this, it's like I was telling them all along and they were going "oh, you'll be alright." And now they're using it as an excuse to not only not hire me but to get money out of me too. I have a friend who is a lawyer in the state that the training school is in that I'm going to have a talk with about all this. I blame this mostly on the school and especially the recruiter for pushing me through when they shouldn't have, knowing that I had this problem and might get cut. The recruiter and the school flat out lied about the company's fleet, claiming that they had all automatics, when in reality, they run mostly manuals.

 

[Marty]

I have been in trucking for over 30 years and I have yet found a recruiter or a truck school representative that doesn't lie. Recruiters get paid to hire drivers not to tell the truth. If they didn't paint a much rosier picture than is real then there wouldn't be many truckers.
Wanabees beware! Under these tough economic conditions things are terrible out there for our industry. Don't believe any rosy story you hear just because you are hearing what you want or need to hear. Research exhaustedly before making any move.

 

[truckrnnr]

'll bet that school you went to was at 36_3 east raymond street,indianapolis indiana. If so,......they are known for doing this for as many years as i can remember.

 

[Scuba]

Did you keep the first DOT card?? long form ??? if you dont have them call that dr's office and get copies that means you are medicaly quailfyed to drive if the company wont hire you they are just out the money let them try to sue it wont get far. Because it looks like they went out of their way to dq you sucks to be them i woludnt pay them a dime. Usxpress has a 100% automatic fleet and i think but im not sure but i think CFI is also an automatic fleet

 

[Saturnista]

Yes & No, same school, different location (I got sent to the north even though Indy was closer to me).

Yes, I have the original first DOT exam paper.

Yeah, USX is close by to me, I'm going to call them and also Roehl, trying also to see if I have any hope of somehow miraculous getting straight into Expediting. Otherwise, I'll go where ever, work where ever.

 

[greg334]

If you have your orignal DOT, think about contacting a lawyer and discussing how to pursue either suing the school for the tuition or how to force the school to work with you.

The thing that bothers me, maybe I'm not reading this right but you live in Ohio, you have a IN CDL and you need it transfered to TN?

 

[Saturnista]

The thing that bothers me, maybe I'm not reading this right but you live in Ohio, you have a IN CDL and you need it transferred to TN?

Yes, I have two permanent addresses. One in Ohio, and one in Tennessee. The Tennessee address is where I want on my CDL. When I went to school, they had me get an IN license because that was the state they taught in. Everyone at school had to use the school's address, unless they lived in Indiana.

Swift got busted for doing the same thing in TN, but apparently IN either hasn't caught on yet, or doesn't care.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

To me, the "we can get you your CDL and a job" mantra is the same as "send us your $$$ and you can make a million a year working at home" scam. These companies make a LOT of money running ppl thru their schools, knowing full well they will only put a small percentage in the seats. And I'm not talking about those who legitimately fail.

 

[greg334]

Yes, I have two permanent addresses. One in Ohio, and one in Tennessee.

I was under the impression that it was really not legal to have two permanent residence. In Michigan, it is fraud because we base our home taxes on one's permanent residence.

 

[Saturnista]

Technically the Tennessee address is my "permanent" address, because I intend to eventually go back to it. We are in Ohio while my wife finishes school and while we take care of her family for a short while. So Ohio is a permanent-temporary address - we pay taxes in Ohio, held jobs in Ohio, and have lived here for a year and a half. We will probably be here at least 2 or 3 more years. In Ohio, you pay taxes based on where you live for more than 50% of the year. Even though Ohio has higher taxes (TN has no state, local or school income taxes), we pay taxes here because most of our income was earned here.

We will be returning to Tennessee when we have concluded our responsibilities here. We have a house to return to in TN and I am still a reserve police officer in TN, so we maintain our vehicle titles and registrations, and drivers licenses there. We were intending to move completely to Ohio, but I cannot get on with any departments up here (too many candidates, not enough positions), so we're maintaining residency in TN. We are considered dual-state residents, along the same lines of people who own summer homes in Florida and have obligations in two states. I cannot hold a license in more than one state, and because I am a reserve officer in TN, I need to keep a TN license.

This was one of the biggest draws to trucking for me. I would be able to spend half my home time in Ohio with my wife, and half in Tennessee, fulfilling my obligations there, all while my wife works on finishing her degree and taking care of her grandmother.

 

[greg334]

well I understand that, but the feds will have a very big problem - especially if you try to get a HAZMAT endorsement. This may flag your clearance and put a hold on it until they investigate it. Not only that, the state that issues a license may have an issue with the fact that you spend more than 50% out of the state.

I think that you need to be very careful with this issue, the trucking companies mitgate their risks by listening to their complience departments and more specifically thier insurance company. They will have to be the judge of multiple addresses.

But back to your original problem, I went through a simular thing. I did my best to document everything and got my docs on my side, but now that the DOT is requiring the docs to be 'registered' with the DOT, it will screw a lot of people. The problem with this is my docs have years of experience to judge my condition compared to some clinic doc who only sees me once. On top of this, my company is now following the sleep apnia 'suggestions' (aka guidelines) which my doctor who is a specailist in this field said "who is the DOT listening to? they got their head up their a** with these guildlines". He said this because he said they are forgetting one important thing - consistent uninterrupted continues sleep which can't be done in this business.

I would start with the origanal DOT physical, get a lawyer and ask him what can be done about this. They cleared you first, they are supposed to fulfill their obligation after that, and if you have to sue them for the cost of the school and lost wages.

When you get into this business, I recommend getting a lawyer and an accountant. It sounds simple to get one when you need help but it really matters to get one who you can talk to and who knows you. I know this form personal experience, so... good luck.....

 

[dogshed]

For the next newbie: Go to a community college or tech school and then have your employer reimburse you when they hire you.
$1500 vs. $7000.

Now for you now...

Try small claims court or the labor board in your state.
It can't hurt to check before dumping more money on a lawyer.

As for which state you live in? People move all the time. If you were hired in one state and then got your license in another and then moved to a third state it shouldn't matter. Just tell your employer and they will change the taxes and whatever in their computers.

Ooops. Didn't realize how old this thread was. I hope everything worked out.

 

[CharlesD]

Q: How can you tell when a recruiter is lying?

A: His lips are moving.

 

[Rabbit]

This may well be covered under the Americans With Disabilities Act, which _requires_ that emnployers make "reasonable accomodations" for employees with handicaps. I can say with some degree of assurance that giving you an "automatic" truck will be considered "reasonable". There's almost certainly a disabled workers group of some sort in your area-- they're all over-- that can and will advise you regarding your legal rights. In most cases where the worker has a leg to stand on, the company almost immediately realizes just how vulnerable they are to lawsuit and caves quickly. A good friend has much experience with this.

I _hate_ exploiting this sort of law, but these guys sound like they deserve it in spades.