Another GPS Question

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Ok, I have Garmin GPS software loaded in my laptop and I love it. That being said, I am tired of it sometimes routing me down 2 lane country roads that not even a car should be using, let alone a truck with freight in it.

Now I drive a CV and don't haul Hazmat at all. I don't have a NEED for a GPS that as all of the Big Truck requirements but I WANT one that will only route me onto Truck routes that the heavy GVW trucks have to use. I understand I will get alot of stuff i don't need, but thats life.

So what is the best stand alone unit for accurate minimal heavy thuck routing. I would like to still have dock to dock and voice promtps for all turns..

Any suggestions?
 

cheri1122

Veteran Expediter
Driver
Do a search for the threads discussing GPS units - there have been several. Far as I know, an accurate unit with truck routing hasn't been made yet. :( My Garmin Nuvi 350 works fine for me, but it's a personal preference thing, mostly.
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Thanks Cheri! I guess since i don't need the things that you bigger unit drivers need and I am simply looking for the routing on major hyways and away for the "car" routes is why i asked for accurate routing. it is also why i did do a search since the routing is the msot important thing for me, since i don't need the weght , haz mat and all of the issues that concern all of you that drive the big trucks.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Hey Chef, is there a setting on your software to "force" routing to certain size roads? We run DeLorme on our laptop. We can set it to stay on interstates or whatever. It makes a mistake once in a while but we always match our routing to what FedEx gives us AND we also check that against the Rand McNally trucking Atlas. We have found mistakes from both FedEx and Delorme. We have more problems than you because of size. Layoutshooter
 

bluejaybee

Veteran Expediter
From what I have read, none are perfect for a truck. I do believe there is a general feeling that Garmin is the best for the buck. That is what I have and like. Of course, there will be those who have other opionons and you will probably wind up having to decide from what you feel best suits your needs.
 

guido4475

Not a Member
i have a cobra navone 5000. i wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy!!!! what a piece of 500.00 crap.is has been nothing but a problem since i got it, and i actually physically went to cobra in chicago to have them fix it.it helped,but it still isnt perfect.dont waste your money on it.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
I have a Garmin c550 standalone. It will route you differently based on vehicle type. If I were to get a new one today, it would be something in the Nuvi 600 or 800 series.

Never used Garmin's MapSource for routing on the laptop (better just to chew tinfoil and lick a 9-volt battery while pulling hair out of your arms), but you can go to EDIT|PREFENCES / Routing, and set the vehicle type and it'll route you accordingly.
 

nightcreacher

Veteran Expediter
In my lap top I have both the garmin,(sucks) and streets and trips,and thru my sprint phone,I also have gps.I like my phone gps as well as any,but when routing myself or checking the miles compared to what Ive been offered,the streets and trips is great.You can also get it to use prefered roads,that I cant do with my cell,but after I go off route,cause of useing my own diretions,the phone will change to the way I'm going.My main reason for GPS is just for local directions,I can read a map so as far as needing a GPS to get me from one town to another,it would just be a useless.GPS,its just a toy.
 
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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
I don't think I would go as far as to call GPS a toy. It is just another tool. Ours has pays for itself every year. We have used it to re-route when we run into road problems or those really fun un-marked detours. It really helps for the locals. We bought a $99 GPS modual 3 years ago and it still works perfect. We buy the new version of Delorme every year for around $50 or less. It saves us way more than that in fuel, not to mention the fact that Mrs. Layoutshooter and I would most likely be divorced by now without it!! Everyone must keep one thing in mind. GPS is NOT a civilian system, it is built for and run by the D.O.D. All of the stand alones and computer programs are put together by private companies. The system is only 25-35 years old and everyone is still learning how to use it. Use on the roads is really new. If you were flying an airplane there are much better systems. I don't know why there is not better programs/stand alones for truckers. It might be that truckers seem to be slow picking up on new technology and the demand has not been that great yet. If we want better systems we have to demand them from those who produce them. Just be sure to remember that it IS a D.O.D. system and they can, if they have to, encrypt the signal and EVERY gps system other than thier own would quit working. Not too big a problem for trucks but for recreational boaters and pilots who have forgotten how or never learned how to navigate would be in real trouble. Layoutshooter
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Thanks for the info people! I can't force this program at all, the only edit i can do is for a car, motorcycle ora person walking. The only other settings are "fastest and or shortest" and a few avoidances such as toll roads, but not much else. For the most part it works fine, its just those times that take be down a unpaved farm road that no big truck could go down at all, and it is just a pain in a CV, then when you are in that situation, you are running on 2 lane backwater roads. Now sometimes, you get to see some nice countryside, but with 2 inches of snow at night, i don't need it!

I still use a map to change the routing by 'adding" stops along the route before I move and that can fix it sometimes, but I thought i would beable to simply buy a stand alone unit and set it to 53 ft of TT , 70,000 lbs of gvw that should keep me on major road ways and let it go from there. Maybe I am looking for something that isn't available at this time...
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
...Everyone must keep one thing in mind. GPS is NOT a civilian system, it is built for and run by the D.O.D. All of the stand alones and computer programs are put together by private companies. The system is only 25-35 years old and everyone is still learning how to use it. Use on the roads is really new. If you were flying an airplane there are much better systems....

Just be sure to remember that it IS a D.O.D. system and they can, if they have to, encrypt the signal and EVERY gps system other than thier own would quit working....

Not really. The Global Positioning System, while originally a US military project, is considered a dual-use technology, and is now a part of the civilian fabric worldwide. Most of the satellites that are currently up there, and all of them in the next generation of GPS, doesn't even have the capability of being encrypted.

Ground-based radar navigation systems, the LORAN and the Decca Navigator system, were developed and used during WWII. When Sputnik was launched in 1957, scientists discovered that because of the Dopler Effect and knowing their precise position on the globe, they could determine Sputnik's precise orbit by measuring the Dopler Effect. Inspiration moved the US Navy to first test 5 satellites for navigation in 1960, which provided a position update about once an hour. In 1967 the Navy developed the Timation satellite, which proved that accurate clocks coule be put in space, something that future GPS satellites would need. In the 1970's the Omega Navigation System became the first worldwide radio navigation system, based in part on signal phase comparison and on satellite data.

The Omega System was the one that was used by the military and commercial aircraft, as well as maritime shipping, for many years, right up until KAL Flight 007 was shot down in 1983 after wandering into Soviet air space. President Reagan then signed an Executive Order making GPS freely available for civilian use for the common good. The NAVSTAR satellites, which is the GPS sysem we use today, were launched between 1989 and 1993 and became officially operational in 1995. All of the originals have been replaced with more modern satellites that allow for more accurate positioning and more precise timing applications. Newer satellites with more stuff is planned for the near future (GPS III)

Selective Availability is the term used where one signal, highly accurate but encrypted, is for the military, and another signal, intentionally degraded with positional errors of up to 100 meters, for civilian use. Selective Availability was the standard, with the military using the more accurate L1 Signal and the rest of us using the intentionally degraded signal.

During the 1990-1991 Gulf War, a shortage of military GPS units, compared with the widespread availability of civilian units, caused many soldiers in the field to buy their own civilian units. The whole Selective Availability thing was based on the assumption that U.S. troops and enemy troops would have military-specification GPS receivers and that civilian receivers would not exist in war zones. In an ironic twist of fate, Selective Availability was now hindering friendly troops instead of enemy troops. So they turned it off.

If they turned it back on again, the world's GPS receivers wouldn't suddenly stop working, they'd merely be inaccurate.

After the Gulf War the FAA (among many others) wanted the military to make the change permanent, as it would save them millons of dollars a year in maintaining the radio navigation systems. Bill Clinton signed an Executive Order stating that the amout of error introduced to the civilian signal be set to zero, and that the L1 signal be unencrypted and available for civilian use. This happened in 2000. In 2005 the next generation of satellites containing a second L2C signal (the one the SIRF II and SIRF III chipsets read) went operational, and over the next couple of years yet another generation of satellites will be launched.

In theory, the Selective Availibility could be turned back on and errors introduced, but knowing the problems involved, flight and shipping safety, it's highly unlikely that it would ever happen, and the FAA and the military both say it won't, as it has worldwide implications. The specs for the GPS III satelites, in fact, do not even have the capability of encryption or Selective Availability, nor the abillity of selctive turning on or off the various Block Signals, thus making the policy of unfettered civilian access to GPS satellites a permanent one. The specific military channels of the satellites, of course, are encrypted. They include channels signals that detect nuclear detonations, among other things.

The new GPS III satellites will have four new civilian channels. And one military channel which when used with the new DAGR (Defense Advanced GPS Receiver) will detect GPS jamming signals and still maintain an encrypted lock on the satellite even when civilian units lose the signal lock. But GPS jamming only works for relatively small areas, line of sight, or within radio range. So it's not like someone can flip a switch and turn off all the GPS receivers worldwide.
 

nightcreacher

Veteran Expediter
Although very informative,I sometimes wander if Turtle and A Team are having a contest to see who can write the longest answer to any question.
 

nightcreacher

Veteran Expediter
shooter,I have a very good map,same as everyone in trucking.I can not believe you have saved enough miles with a GPS system to save enough fuel to pay for your GPS.Of course if you can't read a map,then yes,this would help you consideably
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Yea night, i understand your take on Turtles informative post. While the 1st post he offered up was helpful (i have don't a bit if research based on that post) the 2nd post, while it might be very informative, it didn't answer a thing to my question.

I bet Turtle is a real ball of fun at worthless knowledge in "trival pursuit!" :D
 

aristotle

Veteran Expediter
Yea night, i understand your take on Turtles informative post. While the 1st post he offered up was helpful (i have don't a bit if research based on that post) the 2nd post, while it might be very informative, it didn't answer a thing to my question.

I bet Turtle is a real ball of fun at worthless knowledge in "trival pursuit!" :D

Grammar Nazi Alert!! See parenthetical phrase above. *L*
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
...the 2nd post, while it might be very informative, it didn't answer a thing to my question.
Nor was it intended to answer your question. It was specifically to address the highly inaccurate belief the GPS system is not a civilian system, that the DOD owns it and runs it and can do whatever they want to with it, and at a whim, the military could encrypt GPS satellite signals which would result in all GPS devices worldwide to suddenly stop working.

I suppose I could have gone short and sweet with, "No, that's not true," and left it at that. But I figure that if you're going to stand up and tell someone that they're wrong, you'd better have a really good reason for telling them so, and have something concrete and verifiable to back it up. Otherwise, it's just a case of "because I said so," and would quickly denegrate to Pee Wee Herman-esque volleys of, "I know you are but what am I?"



I bet Turtle is a real ball of fun at worthless knowledge in "trival pursuit!" :D
You have no idea. For some reason my brain stores worthless knowledge in chisseled-in-stone triplicate, while storing actual knowledge on scraps of synaptic thermal ink receipts.
 

nightcreacher

Veteran Expediter
Shooter,any gadget you have that you don't really need is a toy.Maps are in existance to show you the routes to take from point A to point B,and if you buy one of the expensive trucking maps,it even shows truck stops,scales,and even those sometime hard to find rest stops.What happens if your GPS, that you so rely on,quits?It's like dispatch when the computers go down,no one knows what to do,they cant even tell you what time the load picks up or delivers.Getting around a construction detour,or accident.The map will do the same thing.Yes a GPS is concidered a work tool,but as I stated,to me it's just one of my other toys.I do like the mapping part of my Streets and Trips,I can find short cuts and be able to get a mileage check,and cost annalysis,thats all I use it for.
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
see thats where i go wrong, i just write the mileage on those Flyin J receipts, never got around to writing my BS ideas down on them, althought they are small enough to hold most of them...:D
 

cheri1122

Veteran Expediter
Driver
You have no idea. For some reason my brain stores worthless knowledge in chisseled-in-stone triplicate, while storing actual knowledge on scraps of synaptic thermal ink receipts.[/quote]

I think mine does that, too. I hear some stupid forgettable song like "Our day will come" and my brain announces "Ruby & the Romantics!" and then I'll accept a load going to Homestead, Fla because I thought it was on the panhandle. :eek:
PS I very much enjoy the trivial pursuit explanations, myself.
 
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