Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
So you're defending Waters, McKinney, and Conyers? Do you have a clue what you're saying?
The Cain Mutiny
- Thread starter aristotle
- Start date
So you're defending Waters, McKinney, and Conyers? Do you have a clue what you're saying?
tbubster
Seasoned Expediter
exactly it takes all the republican party is just made up of a bunch of red neck racist card right out of the picture.Think about it not that any of them would even care but what about the last two plus year of the TEA PARTY is all racist.Gone see you later.Maybe he would lose to Obama, maybe he wouldn't. But IF Cain ran on the Republican ticket, there goes the idea that blacks are automatic Democrats, and Republicans are "masters of the plantation" bs. They're afraid of his message... a black man's message to other blacks that you CAN rise above, regardless of what the Dems tell you; and you don't need the government to do it!
Why should she look into the Republican party for a scandal? She'd be stepping on the toes of the MSM looking for the same thing. By looking at the Dems, she's all alone.
Ann Coulter, IMO, is a decent investigative reporter. The rest of the media either dropped the ball by not figuring this out, or just tossed it in the garbage, cause it didn't fit their agendas.
It is true!!Think about it we did even see it in 08 only it was with Palin and her unwed teenage daughter haveing a kid not McCain.It was palin who people flocked to on the republican ticket not McCain.In every race Obama has ever been in who ever he was running against had a scandel.Yes yes Obama said the kids are of limits end of story.But the story was already out there so why not say that.Also why was he only asked about it a couple of times.Why did the press not push him for his thoughts?
Attacking the messenger when you can't defend the message??
Just sayin'........
That is all some can do and it is sad really.Look at the messanger and discard with out giving it real thought or looking to check the facts.To some it does not matter if it is all true or not just put certian names to it and its all a bunch of crap.In a way its funny when you think about it I mean we are the soupposed to be the closed minded blind sheep that drink the Flavor Aid and do as the government tells us to do!Even when the truth is on our side.
So again I will ask Even though I know it WONT BE ANSWERD.Who has ever run and not responed to something that only made it worse?Who has ever been asked a question yet did not screw up the answer that made him look like a dumb A@@?No one not even the good........Well I wont say it but it was not gonna be Obama
tbubster
Seasoned Expediter
Any decent investigative reporter could come up with these allegations Dont think so.Judges do not take kindly to reporters Ignoring their orders when they SEAL a case.Will not unless you got the right connections
Why on God's green Earth would anyone in the Obama administration not want to see Cain as the Republican nominee?
Ignor the Writting on the wall.Well I guess thats one way to do it.
Now thats funny right there.
Looks like 'the Herminator' [gag] got his professional spinmeister working, because everyone's talking about things other than what matters: Cain's response to unsettling & unwelcome news. [I'm thinking every potential candidate should be sandbagged during their campaign - it reveals a lot we wouldn't see otherwise.]
How the info was found doesn't matter. If Obama and whatshisname should be looked at closer, then do it - but that's a separate issue, it doesn't make any difference to Cain's campaign.
Bialek doesn't matter [just having the white female version of Jesse Jackson as her attorney tells us that.]
The truth or fabrication of the allegations made years ago doesn't matter - we will never know the truth anyhow. [And you can't fault the women who choose to remain unidentified, either. Reading the comments about a "bimbo eruption", I'd decline to be known as the bimbo du jour, too.]
What matters is how Mr Cain handles himself in a tough spot, and he failed BIG TIME.
Reading the link RLENT posted, I'm even more convinced that Mr Cain is just another bad news for the people candidate that frequently wants to run the country, but couldn't even run their 'business' well. [Meaning the energy company]
I still don't think a businessperson as an ideal candidate anyhow, because the government id NOT a 'for profit' institution, and shouldn't be run like one, either.
How the info was found doesn't matter. If Obama and whatshisname should be looked at closer, then do it - but that's a separate issue, it doesn't make any difference to Cain's campaign.
Bialek doesn't matter [just having the white female version of Jesse Jackson as her attorney tells us that.
]The truth or fabrication of the allegations made years ago doesn't matter - we will never know the truth anyhow. [And you can't fault the women who choose to remain unidentified, either. Reading the comments about a "bimbo eruption", I'd decline to be known as the bimbo du jour, too.]
What matters is how Mr Cain handles himself in a tough spot, and he failed BIG TIME.
Reading the link RLENT posted, I'm even more convinced that Mr Cain is just another bad news for the people candidate that frequently wants to run the country, but couldn't even run their 'business' well. [Meaning the energy company]
I still don't think a businessperson as an ideal candidate anyhow, because the government id NOT a 'for profit' institution, and shouldn't be run like one, either.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
Looks like 'the Herminator' [gag] got his professional spinmeister working, because everyone's talking about things other than what matters: Cain's response to unsettling & unwelcome news. [I'm thinking every potential candidate should be sandbagged during their campaign - it reveals a lot we wouldn't see otherwise.]
How the info was found doesn't matter. If Obama and whatshisname should be looked at closer, then do it - but that's a separate issue, it doesn't make any difference to Cain's campaign.
Bialek doesn't matter [just having the white female version of Jesse Jackson as her attorney tells us that.
The truth or fabrication of the allegations made years ago doesn't matter - we will never know the truth anyhow. [And you can't fault the women who choose to remain unidentified, either. Reading the comments about a "bimbo eruption", I'd decline to be known as the bimbo du jour, too.]
What matters is how Mr Cain handles himself in a tough spot, and he failed BIG TIME.
Reading the link RLENT posted, I'm even more convinced that Mr Cain is just another bad news for the people candidate that frequently wants to run the country, but couldn't even run their 'business' well. [Meaning the energy company]
I still don't think a businessperson as an ideal candidate anyhow, because the government id NOT a 'for profit' institution, and shouldn't be run like one, either.
Hey! Cheri's back! And look at that... she skimmed past the new stuff, about the "bimbos" all being from Obamaland.
I agree about the businessman not being a good president tho. He'd have to be used to spending more than he's taking in; and a businessman wouldn't be in business very long if he did that. If he were alive, we could get Enron's old CEO. He would make a much better president.
Hey! Cheri's back! And look at that... she skimmed past the new stuff, about the "bimbos" all being from Obamaland.
What I read, only the latest accuser [Bialek] is linked to Axelrod, and I already said she doesn't matter, because she had nothing to say years ago, before Cain was famous.
If Axelrod is 'helping' Obama, that should be brought to light - but it doesn't change the main issue- Cain's response to this little problem.
Did you read the link RLENT provided? I'd have some tough questions about Cain's 'business sense' as well.
Stick a fork in him, like I said days ago.
I agree about the businessman not being a good president tho. He'd have to be used to spending more than he's taking in; and a businessman wouldn't be in business very long if he did that. If he were alive, we could get Enron's old CEO. He would make a much better president.
My point was serious: the government is not, and was never intended to be, a for-profit business - so why should a potential POTUS be superior for having business skills?
I'd think critical thinking [which Cain didn't demonstrate then, at the energy company, or now, with his little 'image problem'] and diplomacy and foreign affairs knowledge would all be more important.....
jaminjim
Veteran Expediter
If you don't like the term 'Herminator' why use it, why intentionally gag yourself? You complain about not answering professionally (What ever that means) so he brings in help and you don't like that either.
Yep the credibility of the accusations.
Yep lie about Cain and he should come clean and just admit to the lies in a contrite way.
Where have you been? The media regularly attempts to 'sandbag' the candidates especially if they don't like their political view.
First we don't know if it is information. It might just be a huge lie. I don't know, do you?
People are looking into it, that's what the Ann Coulter article was about.
No it is the reason for the issue.
So you don't like the way Cain responded to the lies, I guess that means his response's were not as polished and forth coming as say, Bill Clinton. Don't know about you but I would rather have an honest answer as opposed to a slick feel good lie.
And David Axelrod and Obama thank-you.Bialek doesn't matter [just having the white female version of Jesse Jackson as her attorney tells us that.
The truth or fabrication of the allegations made years ago doesn't matter
Well it's nice to see we can agree on something.
Had they either came forward and stated facts, or stayed silent you're correct, at this point they look like gold diggers.
Luckily just in your eyes (and the right leaning media)
You read and believe a story from 'Mother Jones' and completely buy into 'the evil Herman Cain" theory, but completely blow off a story that would show that he might have been setup. (priceless) Do you even know what Cain's involvement was with that company? He was on the board of directors. Do you know what that typically means?
Well we know that career politicians don't work.
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jaminjim
Veteran Expediter
I read the article, knowing that you typically do research prior to posting stuff, a few questions.
What was Cain's day to day involvement with the company?
According to the courts findings was Cain found guilty or at fault for any of this?
If you don't like the term 'Herminator' why use it, why intentionally gag yourself?
Because it says so much about how he views himself.
You complain about not answering professionally (What ever that means)
I said nothing about professionally - I wasn't impressed by the number of times he changed his story before abruptly and arrogantly declaring he would no longer answer questions about it.
so he brings in help and you don't like that either.
I'm not impressed by misdirection, [getting hung up on details that don't matter, while the main question is ignored]
.
Yep the credibility of the accusations. Yep lie about Cain and he should come clean and just admit to the lies in a contrite way.
At this point, the credibility of the accusations is a moot point [though there's some evidence that he considers himself as waaay more 'charming' than he appears to others]. We'll never know whether the women lied or not, and that's not the issue at all.
Where have you been? The media regularly attempts to 'sandbag' the candidates especially if they don't like their political view.
Since none of them reacted as Cain has, it didn't make much of an impression, I guess.
First we don't know if it is information. It might just be a huge lie. I don't know, do you?
What lie? That he was accused of sexual harassment and the case was settled is a fact - whether the accusations were merited is unimportant. What matters is how Cain reacted to the questions about it.
People are looking into it, that's what the Ann Coulter article was about. No it is the reason for the issue.So you don't like the way Cain responded to the lies, I guess that means his response's were not as polished and forth coming as say, Bill Clinton. Don't know about you but I would rather have an honest answer as opposed to a slick feel good lie.
I'd like an honest answer too, which is why his changing the story numerous times before refusing to talk about it any more [as if!] is such a problem: he's hiding something, is what it looks like.
And David Axelrod and Obama thank-you.
Bialek: no question. But there are 3 others, who spoke up years ago, before he was a candidate. They may have been opportunists too, but when a group of successful businessmen [in an industry where success is hard to come by] agrees to pay a year's salary to settle a complaint, I have to think there was some merit to it - just sayin.
Luckily just in your eyes (and the right leaning media)
You read and believe a story from 'Mother Jones'
I believe what can be proven - what the story said is a matter of public record, no matter who reports it.
and completely buy into 'the evil Herman Cain" theory,
Evil? No, not even close. Just a little too arrogant & conceited, with too little reason, IMO.
but completely blow off a story that would show that he might have been setup.
Set up by who - Axelrod? Only if I believed that Bialek was truthful & that what she says matters at all, but I don't, and I've said so from the beginning. Do you think Axelrod is responsible for the first 3 complaints, lodged years before Cain was a potential competitor to Obama?
(priceless) Do you even know what Cain's involvement was with that company? He was on the board of directors. Do you know what that typically means?
Don't know if it's typical, but according to the lawsuit, Cain chaired the board's compensation committee, which had direct oversight of the push to get employees to invest in more & more Aquila [company] stock. 60% of the employees retirement fund consisted of Aquila stock - a figure financial experts say should never exceed 10-20%.
He doled out $30 million in bonuses to 5 executives in 02, [while the stock was plummeting], and just a month later, 500 employees were laid off. The loss to employees holding company stoock had reached hundreds of millions of dollars, and many lost from 70-90% of their retirement savings. While the execs got millions in bonuses - see anything wrong with that? Does the name ENRON ring a bell?
All the above is public record, and Cain's campaign has not replied to a request for comment. I wonder why....
Well we know that career politicians don't work.
It might be better if many 'business executives' didn't either, seeing how much of what they do is sneaky self serving tactics to pile up personal wealth at the expense of the folks who actually do work for a living, and Cain is right up there with them.
tbubster
Seasoned Expediter
Well here is What I took out of the story.
1You can find it in many other liberal Outlets as well.The thing that is funny is that almost 100% of them are the same word for word.2One has to take into account who is writting the article.In this case it is a man named Andy Kroll a very liberal one sided so called reporter.Take this one written by Mr Kroll
Ohio's Union Fight: Cash Warfare | Mother Jones
You will see he has no problem telling people how the evil republican groups are spending money to defend Porp 2 in Ohio.He has no problem in his attempt to make them shady as can be.Yet he stays mum on the fact that the Unions alone spent over 30 million fighting prop 2 never mind the rest of the liberal groups.As stated a very onesided reporter.
Now lets talk about the lawsuit.First this Kroll says that In 2007, Aquila settled with the employees for $10.5 million. Not long after, Aquila merged with other Midwestern energy companies and now no longer operates as Aquila.)
the company sold for 1.7 billion dollars.The employees suing the company claim a loss of over $200 million yet settle for a very low sum of 10.5 million??????????Either they had a really crapy lawyer or the had a very weak case as to real loses.Im thinking its the latter.Funny how the reporter leaves out the company was doing well enough to sell for 1.7 billion dollars
The reporter says the compant started in 1917?It was started in 1902.Also the reporter claims Then, in early 1999, the company's leadership decided running power plants wasn't lucrative enough; energy trading and speculation had grown popular, and as the class suit lays out, Aquila wanted a piece of the action.
yet the FACTS are they started in 1989,4 years befor cain joined the board of directors.Even though the writer tries to make it seem as if cain helped guide the company to this it is not true.
It was a dangerous move—as a company spokesman later put it, "the risk was huge." In the end, it proved disastrous. Aquila's decision to join Enron, Reliant Energy, and the other heavy-hitters in the energy trading markets would ultimately wipe out 94 percent of Aquila's stock value between 1999 and 2004Yet the FACT is in may of 2001 AQUILA's stock peaked at over 37 dollars a share.They are listed at # 33 in 01 on fortune 500.Did the stocks tank in the wake of the Enron scandal? yes! as did most electric utilities companys.
Now were there risk taken that maybe should not have been im sure there were.However that is how the stock market works.As the reporter tries to make it out that cain was calling the shots well that is just false.he sat on the board of directors,He was not there seeing the everyday going ons.This attack story on Cain can be picked apart bit for bit if I had more time.With that said some people would be better off if they did their own research on their own and not belive when someone post a article that is not even close to what it seems.Dont belive me really dont belive me go to the article linked and click on the links provided by this so called reporter.Enron, Reliant Energy, and the other heavy-hitters same trading tricks because this is what I get
U.S. Senate: Content Responsibility > Requested File Not Found
tbubster
Seasoned Expediter
Judge throws out class action against Aquila - Kansas City Business Journal
Aquila, Inc. -- Company History
AQUILA INC - Annual Report (Regulation S-K, item 405) (10-K405) EXHIBIT 13
This one explains a few things
5 Reasons Why Herman Cain Would Make a Bad President | Ron Paul 2012 | Sound Money, Peace and Liberty
yes alot of it is a matter of public record yet some seem unwilling to really look for the truth in that record.Heck even Ron Paul quotes the Reporter Kroll.
As far as the bonuses go.They were for the previous years performance.2001 was their best year.So really they were not out of line.
Aquila, Inc. -- Company History
AQUILA INC - Annual Report (Regulation S-K, item 405) (10-K405) EXHIBIT 13
This one explains a few things
5 Reasons Why Herman Cain Would Make a Bad President | Ron Paul 2012 | Sound Money, Peace and Liberty
yes alot of it is a matter of public record yet some seem unwilling to really look for the truth in that record.Heck even Ron Paul quotes the Reporter Kroll.
As far as the bonuses go.They were for the previous years performance.2001 was their best year.So really they were not out of line.
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jaminjim
Veteran Expediter
Years ago I was a member at a golf club that was investigating the club manager for sexual harassment. Within days of it being brought to the boards attention there was a meeting that included the attorney (also a board member) for the club. The manager was immediately fired, and a apology was made to the female employees. No money payout was given, because the club had not allowed it to go on, and had taken the appropriate action quickly.
Our Club attorney was one of the Company attorney for a very large privately owned Company.(sold for more than a billion dollars in 1980 with very few hard assets) he was sitting around with a few of us one night swilling a few cold ones when the harassment issue came up. He explained that it was often times much more cost affective to settle out of court then to go thru a long protracted court battle. So in a situation where there was any chance that they could be found culpable in any way, they would offer to settle the case. Part of those settlements would always include the requirement to never disclose the terms of the agreement or the nature of the allegations. It did matter if the person was guilty or not, it was just a business decision.
It stands to reason that if someone, anyone disclosed the information that it was more than likely done in an attempt to destroy someone's career.
Our Club attorney was one of the Company attorney for a very large privately owned Company.(sold for more than a billion dollars in 1980 with very few hard assets) he was sitting around with a few of us one night swilling a few cold ones when the harassment issue came up. He explained that it was often times much more cost affective to settle out of court then to go thru a long protracted court battle. So in a situation where there was any chance that they could be found culpable in any way, they would offer to settle the case. Part of those settlements would always include the requirement to never disclose the terms of the agreement or the nature of the allegations. It did matter if the person was guilty or not, it was just a business decision.
It stands to reason that if someone, anyone disclosed the information that it was more than likely done in an attempt to destroy someone's career.
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chefdennis
Veteran Expediter
Here you go...
Libtalker Bill Press Compares Herman Cain to Penn State Molester
SMEAR OF THE YEAR- Libtalker Equates Cain With Penn State Molester - YouTube
Libtalker Bill Press Compares Herman Cain to Penn State Molester
SMEAR OF THE YEAR- Libtalker Equates Cain With Penn State Molester - YouTube
RLENT
Veteran Expediter
As an outside Corporate Director, he likely had no day to day involvement (he did have some involvement however, even if not day to day)
Do you believe that that fact somehow relieves someone of their responsibilities and fiduciary duties ?
Was OJ Simpson convicted of murder ?
How about Casey Anthony ?
Do you believe either were actually guilty - in spite of a verdict to the contrary ?
Courts, being overseen by flawed men, often render flawed verdicts
(ask me how I know
)Given that Congress and the Executive are For Sale, is it really such a stretch to believe that the Judiciary might be as well ?
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RLENT
Veteran Expediter
That's certain a possible (even likely) motivation ......
It's also possible (but somewhat less likely) that it could be the case that someone in a position to know the guy a little better than most, knows his true character well enough that they decided that it's in the public interest to know what they know .....
Regardless, the relevant thing is how Cain handled it.
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RLENT
Veteran Expediter
Oh Boobie
...... I would have thought that you might have learned a thing or two during your brief stint as a "Wiki editor" ....The sun is out and the weather is nice, I have work to do on the Sprinter, and the wife is after me to help her with yard work ..... but I will see if I might possibly indulge your apparent penchant for flagellation (self and otherwise) a bit later if I can ......
RLENT
Veteran Expediter
Bubbie,
I can now see that you, like Mr. Cain, are entirely unfamiliar with the basic tenets of positioning, branding, and public relations ....
Perhaps one of the most fundamental laws in the above in the above subjects is:
You never, ever want to promote or forward your opposition's (or competition's) message .....
Thank you for completely ignoring that law, and pointing everyone to the 5 Reasons Why Herman Cain Would Make a Bad President ........ thereby delivering footbullets to your cause ..... a truly smooth move there Ace .....
I can see that you too are desperately longing for the EO Soapbox Real Men Of Genius Merit Badge™ ...... and you too shall have it !
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Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
Who hands out those Real Men of Genius merit badges and do you get a free case of Budwieser with that?
Better watch it... a giant can might come out of the sky and land on ya.