Newbies and the truck search
- Thread starter Toes
- Start date
Very difficult question to answer. There is no firm guide as too what a New expediter might want in a truck.The smart ones stay small and see how their income is and go from there.Other folks rush in ,then they over buy,the income cannot pay for the truck plus their lifestyle needs and they fail.
Sometimes they listen to individuals who paint a glowing rosey picture as too their future income and wind up loosing their trucks,get a bad credit rating,possibly fileing for bankruptcy and so on.
Sometimes they listen to individuals who paint a glowing rosey picture as too their future income and wind up loosing their trucks,get a bad credit rating,possibly fileing for bankruptcy and so on.
Rich,
I'm finally opening my own truck lot. Buying, building, and selling Expediters. I'll stretch class 8's at a reasonable price. ($6.000/ $6,500 or so, including box.)
But primary goal is to find and supply realstic "starter units". Trucks a person can own without breaking the bank. Not worn out junk-decent units. 97's or better. Solid trucks that they can get in and ride.
But at the same time...and I had this happen already. Didn't matter about the truck. All the newbie wanted to know, was does it have a fridge and TV.
So I'm wondering, in what order do the options matter? Sure enough, I can do the inverter route. Fridge, microwave, tv...but that doesn't make the truck earn anymore money.
I'm finally opening my own truck lot. Buying, building, and selling Expediters. I'll stretch class 8's at a reasonable price. ($6.000/ $6,500 or so, including box.)
But primary goal is to find and supply realstic "starter units". Trucks a person can own without breaking the bank. Not worn out junk-decent units. 97's or better. Solid trucks that they can get in and ride.
But at the same time...and I had this happen already. Didn't matter about the truck. All the newbie wanted to know, was does it have a fridge and TV.
So I'm wondering, in what order do the options matter? Sure enough, I can do the inverter route. Fridge, microwave, tv...but that doesn't make the truck earn anymore money.
RE: Rich,
Your right, the fridge and microwave won't make any money, but they can allow the driver(s) to save a lot of money on the road. A 25 cent can of soup heated in the truck beats a $3.99 bowl of soup heated in a restaurant's microwave, and a 50 cent bottled water from the truck fridge beats a $1.50 bottle from a rest area vending machine. The combo can also allow one to eat on the run, keeping the truck rolling. While not totally true in this business, the old saying "It's not what you make, it's what you save" has a lot of merit.
While we're on the subject, other things once considered as bells and whistles (laptop computers, GPS programs, hands-free cell phone kits, etc.) are quickly becoming necessary tools of the trade. The driver is confident that he/she will not get lost, will be able to find alternate routes around delays, will deliver on time, and will have both hands available to drive. DVD players will provide hours of entertainment, even allowing video-gamers to play in the truck during downtime instead of feeding quarters to the truckstop machines.
Anything to make the driver or the truck safer, more efficient, or happier is worth considering - as with anything you just have to be sure to look at cost versus return.
Good luck with the truck business!!
BanditMan
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Your right, the fridge and microwave won't make any money, but they can allow the driver(s) to save a lot of money on the road. A 25 cent can of soup heated in the truck beats a $3.99 bowl of soup heated in a restaurant's microwave, and a 50 cent bottled water from the truck fridge beats a $1.50 bottle from a rest area vending machine. The combo can also allow one to eat on the run, keeping the truck rolling. While not totally true in this business, the old saying "It's not what you make, it's what you save" has a lot of merit.
While we're on the subject, other things once considered as bells and whistles (laptop computers, GPS programs, hands-free cell phone kits, etc.) are quickly becoming necessary tools of the trade. The driver is confident that he/she will not get lost, will be able to find alternate routes around delays, will deliver on time, and will have both hands available to drive. DVD players will provide hours of entertainment, even allowing video-gamers to play in the truck during downtime instead of feeding quarters to the truckstop machines.
Anything to make the driver or the truck safer, more efficient, or happier is worth considering - as with anything you just have to be sure to look at cost versus return.
Good luck with the truck business!!
BanditMan
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Doggie Daddy
Veteran Expediter
RE: Rich,
banditman is completely right about how certain acessories can save alot of money.we have a coffee maker on board,and it has saved i am sure many hundreds of dollars in the last 15 months.plus the best part of all,is that no matter where we are we can start the day off with a fresh pot of tim hortons.it don't get any better than that. :7 :7 DD.
banditman is completely right about how certain acessories can save alot of money.we have a coffee maker on board,and it has saved i am sure many hundreds of dollars in the last 15 months.plus the best part of all,is that no matter where we are we can start the day off with a fresh pot of tim hortons.it don't get any better than that. :7 :7 DD.
btbenn1039
Expert Expediter
"The smart ones stay small see how their income is and take it from there". Good advice from Rich M. I myself am curious about the Expediting Industry as a Career change, still have 2 years before making my mind up. Will stay Small though,downsize from Public Transit Bus. Terry O'Connell's setup appeals to me. Starting out Small though keeps the Financial Overhead value down if your the Owner/Operator. The deadhead miles won't be as costly. Just my Thoughts, Good Luck
Until Next Time/Take Care Out There/Take Pride In Your Ride
Until Next Time/Take Care Out There/Take Pride In Your Ride
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
I would recommend that you put in fridge and microwave, and leave room for all the other toys. Give the idea that they CAN expand with your truck. That's the way I'd want mine... usable, yet simple enough that I can customize the rest myself. Of course, then you have the made to order group...
While I agree with all the "extras"
When you're done with that, you've added a chunk of change to the price. Realize that the buyer will now have to borrow even more money, moving ever closer to the 20,000 range.
When I did my early trucks, each luxury was added as time went by. But everybody agrees a basic inverter-fridge-microwave-tv/vcr-cb package is reasonable, even on an older unit?
Toes
When you're done with that, you've added a chunk of change to the price. Realize that the buyer will now have to borrow even more money, moving ever closer to the 20,000 range.
When I did my early trucks, each luxury was added as time went by. But everybody agrees a basic inverter-fridge-microwave-tv/vcr-cb package is reasonable, even on an older unit?
Toes
Dave when I started trucking
Air conditioning was a rare option. Your "bunk" was a board across the seats. I've seen trucks change in many many ways. Oh yes, they are much nicer today. And mine is decked out...down to the video games. Next thing I want are some electric dollys.
Air conditioning was a rare option. Your "bunk" was a board across the seats. I've seen trucks change in many many ways. Oh yes, they are much nicer today. And mine is decked out...down to the video games. Next thing I want are some electric dollys.
rode2rouen
Expert Expediter
Having been on the road for the past couple of months in my Company's FL and M2 Freightliners, I want a Class 8 rig for myself!!!!!
I'm leaning toward an '00 or newer International 9200 or 9400 with a 72" Hi-Rise single bunk sleeper, 375-425HP w/engine brake(Detroit Diesel need not apply), 10spd OD trans (AutoShift would be nice, but not a "must"), 3.60ish rear axle ratio, air suspension, dual 100gal. tanks, and less than 500k miles. Stretch the frame to allow a 24' dry freight box to be mounted.
The biggest snag is that 99.99% of the used rigs on the market are tandem axle. I'd rather have a single rear axle and the option of adding a tag axle if freight conditions warranted. Toes, have you ever removed the forward axle of a tandem set up to make a truck a single axle unit??
"Must have" items are heated, power mirrors and a power passenger side window. Also, and some of you may think this excessive, power dollies. Monday night I arrived at my delivery point in Springfield, OH and found that the grease in the dolly gearbox was so stiff, due to the cold (it was a single-digit night), that I could only turn the crank in low range, and that in itself was a serious, high-effort situation!! It takes way too many rotations of the crank to lower and raise the dollies in low range!!!!!I'll have a push button set up, thank you!!
As far as creature comforts, I already have a satellite radio set up and a 12volt cooler. The microwave oven and the TV would be nice, but can be done without initially. A genset would be a higher priority from an economy standpoint, as it will pay for itself in a reasonable time just in no-idle fuel savings.
Spare me the highly polished aluminum and chrome stuff! NO "chicken lights"!!!!!!!!!! DOT required lighting is plenty, although I will probably get a set of Hella H-4 80/100 watt halogen headlights and a set of docking lights to compliment the truck's reverse lights. Some of my night drops have been into docks that look like black holes!!!
My bottom line is that this truck is to be a tool to generate revenue.
It has to be reasonably comfortable and economical, but it cannot require excessive attention beyond routine maintenance. All the foo-foo stuff is nice to look at, I guess, but it adds nothing to the bottom line and in some cases (electrical problems with ANY truck are a BIG DEAL as they can be time consuming and expensive to repair) may even subtract heavily.
My preferences are based on my limited experience on the road so far (When do you quit being a Newbie??) and many years as a truck technician with a lot of hands-on with Internationals. I would appreciate any feedback to what I'm considering for my solo D unit. Also, I have no axe to grind with the "Show Truck" folks, so if you disagree with me from that standpoint, that's cool, it just dosen't work for me.
Rex
I'm leaning toward an '00 or newer International 9200 or 9400 with a 72" Hi-Rise single bunk sleeper, 375-425HP w/engine brake(Detroit Diesel need not apply), 10spd OD trans (AutoShift would be nice, but not a "must"), 3.60ish rear axle ratio, air suspension, dual 100gal. tanks, and less than 500k miles. Stretch the frame to allow a 24' dry freight box to be mounted.
The biggest snag is that 99.99% of the used rigs on the market are tandem axle. I'd rather have a single rear axle and the option of adding a tag axle if freight conditions warranted. Toes, have you ever removed the forward axle of a tandem set up to make a truck a single axle unit??
"Must have" items are heated, power mirrors and a power passenger side window. Also, and some of you may think this excessive, power dollies. Monday night I arrived at my delivery point in Springfield, OH and found that the grease in the dolly gearbox was so stiff, due to the cold (it was a single-digit night), that I could only turn the crank in low range, and that in itself was a serious, high-effort situation!! It takes way too many rotations of the crank to lower and raise the dollies in low range!!!!!I'll have a push button set up, thank you!!
As far as creature comforts, I already have a satellite radio set up and a 12volt cooler. The microwave oven and the TV would be nice, but can be done without initially. A genset would be a higher priority from an economy standpoint, as it will pay for itself in a reasonable time just in no-idle fuel savings.
Spare me the highly polished aluminum and chrome stuff! NO "chicken lights"!!!!!!!!!! DOT required lighting is plenty, although I will probably get a set of Hella H-4 80/100 watt halogen headlights and a set of docking lights to compliment the truck's reverse lights. Some of my night drops have been into docks that look like black holes!!!
My bottom line is that this truck is to be a tool to generate revenue.
It has to be reasonably comfortable and economical, but it cannot require excessive attention beyond routine maintenance. All the foo-foo stuff is nice to look at, I guess, but it adds nothing to the bottom line and in some cases (electrical problems with ANY truck are a BIG DEAL as they can be time consuming and expensive to repair) may even subtract heavily.
My preferences are based on my limited experience on the road so far (When do you quit being a Newbie??) and many years as a truck technician with a lot of hands-on with Internationals. I would appreciate any feedback to what I'm considering for my solo D unit. Also, I have no axe to grind with the "Show Truck" folks, so if you disagree with me from that standpoint, that's cool, it just dosen't work for me.
Rex
If you add a dollar then my opinions are worth a cup of coffee. Be that as it may, I believe a refrigerator and microwave are mandatory. I've saved enough money on meals to pay for them both and then some. It's truly amazing how much longer the money lasts when you aren't pushing it across a food counter 3 times a day.
An inverter large enough to power fridge/microwave/tv/video should be included. Drivers can add whatever they want beyond that as time and finances allow.
Another important factor is cleanliness. I wouldn't buy a truck that is filthy or one that reeks of smoking.
Ability to offer some sort of warranty would be a good selling point. Any worry the driver doesn't have to carry is great.
Leo
truck 767
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.
An inverter large enough to power fridge/microwave/tv/video should be included. Drivers can add whatever they want beyond that as time and finances allow.
Another important factor is cleanliness. I wouldn't buy a truck that is filthy or one that reeks of smoking.
Ability to offer some sort of warranty would be a good selling point. Any worry the driver doesn't have to carry is great.
Leo
truck 767
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.
Toes: You might consider becoming aware of the various carrier minimum/maximum truck ages they will accept for new sign-ons. You would then be in a better position to sell the right truck to a newbie who has aspirations for a particular carrier.
Some good advise from Terry. You don't want to sell a truck to a guy that would have to resell it in short order. Many carriers won't go past a 96 or 97. Payments would be high if one had to finance it for a period of one year. Something to consider
Davekc
Davekc
Looking to stay 99's or better
Like you say...older trucks just aren't worth the investment in the long run. After Jan. 1, I want 99 or newer trucks. Units the buyer can work for a few years. At the same time I'll be stretching a few class 8's to roll out. But even they need to be affordable. And set up for teams.
What about the under cdl class trucks? Should I have a few around?
Toes
Like you say...older trucks just aren't worth the investment in the long run. After Jan. 1, I want 99 or newer trucks. Units the buyer can work for a few years. At the same time I'll be stretching a few class 8's to roll out. But even they need to be affordable. And set up for teams.
What about the under cdl class trucks? Should I have a few around?
Toes
RE: Looking to stay 99's or better
Most companies require the drivers to have a Cdl. I would go after the 33gvw trucks. The only exception would be if you are doing the vans. Be careful on the latter as age requirements on those are usually less than the straight trucks.
Davekc
Most companies require the drivers to have a Cdl. I would go after the 33gvw trucks. The only exception would be if you are doing the vans. Be careful on the latter as age requirements on those are usually less than the straight trucks.
Davekc
>Very difficult question to answer. There is no firm guide
>as too what a New expediter might want in a truck.The smart
>ones stay small and see how their income is and go from
>there.Other folks rush in ,then they over buy,the income
>cannot pay for the truck plus their lifestyle needs and they
>fail.
>Sometimes they listen to individuals who paint a glowing
>rosey picture as too their future income and wind up
>loosing their trucks,get a bad credit rating,possibly
>fileing for bankruptcy and so on.
In addition to answers to the questions toes asked, this thread features advice for newbies; namely, start small and work your way up.
Another approach exists that is frequently mentioned by numerous Open Forum members. That is, start with a fleet owner. You can then sample the business without having to lay out a dime of your own capital for a truck. Your income does not have to be a mystery before you buy a truck. In fact, if you don't have a good idea of what your expediting income ALREADY IS, you probably shouldn't be buying a truck at all.
Projecting your income based on the experiences of others has limited value. You simply won't know how YOU will perform as an expediter until YOU actually step onto the field and try to score points of your own. You can sit in the stands, cheer others on, form opinions, and analyze the game as an expert commentator for years. But until YOU actually suit up and get in the game, you'll never know how YOU will do.
Allow me to share an Army story to further illustrate my point. At the Fort Benning, GA Officer Candidate School (OCS) my classmates and I had to complete a challenging program to earn our commissions. We knew going in - based on the school's statistics - that perhaps as many as half of us would fail. But we had no way of knowing who. And of course, everyone believed it would be someone else. We'd done our research. We knew what to expect. We were not going to give up no matter how tough it got. We were ready! Bring it on!!! Huahhh!!!
One day, about half way through the course, one of our exercises was to walk blindfolded off the end of a 3-meter-high diving board while carrying our web gear, rifle, and being dressed in heavy BDUs and combat boots. When we plunged into the water, we were to remove the blindfold and make our way with all equipment to the side of the pool and climb out. The task worried none of us. We were enthusiastic young studs with muscles and endurance honed by the physical training we did every day. Compared to many of the exercises we've already completed, this would be easy.
One by one, each Officer Candidate (OC) climbed up the ladder, got blindfolded by a TAC Officer, walked off the end with a loud battle cry, made a big splash, plunged deep down, surfaced, and made his or her way to the side. As we waited our turn, the show got boring. There was no challenge; nothing to worry about. So we chatted with each other, or used our few moments in line to study the class notes we carried in our pockets.
Then all of a sudden, the shrieks of a panicked soldier echoed through the field house. We all looked at the diving board where one of our own stood. He'd lost it. He was trembling, screaming baby talk, and trying to escape. When the TAC Officer tried to calm him down, the OC panicked further and while still blindfolded fell off the side of the board. When he surfaced he was coughing up water and floundering about. The lifeguards calmly hooked him with long poles and dragged him out. He was immediately hustled away, presumably for medical attention. We never saw or heard from him again.
No one, not even him, could have predicted that. He entered the course fully expecting to succeed. His chances appeared as good as anyone's. But something came out of nowhere (in this case from within himself) and took him out.
Expediting is full of surprises. I've seen folks leave the business with little to show for their efforts after being at it many years. Why? Each story is different. Sometimes their poor performance has more to with personal issues than with the industry. It might have been bad decisions or a family illness. It might have been that after several years of doing it, winter driving became frightening. A good work ethic may have given way to a poor one. It could have been booze, a bad relationship, or a new casino addiction. The problem(s) might be too much truck, too little truck, or have nothing to do with a truck at all.
In a business where today's high flyers can become tomorrow's failures, it is unwise to presume that if you simply do what the high flyers do, success will come your way. The fact is, you have no idea how YOU will do until you get into the game. The safe way to do that is with a (good) fleet owner.
Put yourself through the paces. Run with a fleet owner long enough to prove in the real world what kind of gross income YOU can generate and what kind of business manager YOU really are. Face the challenges. See how you react. Find out if you can make it or not. You'll learn a lot about yourself. And you'll learn which truck is right for you.
Every day in expediting is a new test. If you succeed as a fleet driver, a whole new set of challenges will rise when you become an Owner/Operator. If you succeed for two years as an Owner/Operator, the third year will test you all over again. While the basic tasks of expediting are relatively easy to master, performing them in settings that constantly change can give rise to demons you never knew were there.
When selecting your truck, there are a host of factors to consider. I'm not going into them here. I'm writing now simply to say that the question, "How do I keep from going broke when I buy a truck?" is not the best one to ask; and that the advice, "Start low and work your way up." is not caved in stone.
A better question to ask is, "What do I have to do right now to achieve my goals as an expediter?" Ask it several times a day; and understand that the answers will change with your circumstances and mindset.
If you ask, "How can I keep from going broke if I buy a truck?" you're focus is on going broke. If you ask, "What do I have to do right now to achieve my goals as an expediter?" and if your goals include owning a top-end truck, you'll likely see truck opportunities that are there for everyone, but invisible to those that are starting low and working his way up.
>as too what a New expediter might want in a truck.The smart
>ones stay small and see how their income is and go from
>there.Other folks rush in ,then they over buy,the income
>cannot pay for the truck plus their lifestyle needs and they
>fail.
>Sometimes they listen to individuals who paint a glowing
>rosey picture as too their future income and wind up
>loosing their trucks,get a bad credit rating,possibly
>fileing for bankruptcy and so on.
In addition to answers to the questions toes asked, this thread features advice for newbies; namely, start small and work your way up.
Another approach exists that is frequently mentioned by numerous Open Forum members. That is, start with a fleet owner. You can then sample the business without having to lay out a dime of your own capital for a truck. Your income does not have to be a mystery before you buy a truck. In fact, if you don't have a good idea of what your expediting income ALREADY IS, you probably shouldn't be buying a truck at all.
Projecting your income based on the experiences of others has limited value. You simply won't know how YOU will perform as an expediter until YOU actually step onto the field and try to score points of your own. You can sit in the stands, cheer others on, form opinions, and analyze the game as an expert commentator for years. But until YOU actually suit up and get in the game, you'll never know how YOU will do.
Allow me to share an Army story to further illustrate my point. At the Fort Benning, GA Officer Candidate School (OCS) my classmates and I had to complete a challenging program to earn our commissions. We knew going in - based on the school's statistics - that perhaps as many as half of us would fail. But we had no way of knowing who. And of course, everyone believed it would be someone else. We'd done our research. We knew what to expect. We were not going to give up no matter how tough it got. We were ready! Bring it on!!! Huahhh!!!
One day, about half way through the course, one of our exercises was to walk blindfolded off the end of a 3-meter-high diving board while carrying our web gear, rifle, and being dressed in heavy BDUs and combat boots. When we plunged into the water, we were to remove the blindfold and make our way with all equipment to the side of the pool and climb out. The task worried none of us. We were enthusiastic young studs with muscles and endurance honed by the physical training we did every day. Compared to many of the exercises we've already completed, this would be easy.
One by one, each Officer Candidate (OC) climbed up the ladder, got blindfolded by a TAC Officer, walked off the end with a loud battle cry, made a big splash, plunged deep down, surfaced, and made his or her way to the side. As we waited our turn, the show got boring. There was no challenge; nothing to worry about. So we chatted with each other, or used our few moments in line to study the class notes we carried in our pockets.
Then all of a sudden, the shrieks of a panicked soldier echoed through the field house. We all looked at the diving board where one of our own stood. He'd lost it. He was trembling, screaming baby talk, and trying to escape. When the TAC Officer tried to calm him down, the OC panicked further and while still blindfolded fell off the side of the board. When he surfaced he was coughing up water and floundering about. The lifeguards calmly hooked him with long poles and dragged him out. He was immediately hustled away, presumably for medical attention. We never saw or heard from him again.
No one, not even him, could have predicted that. He entered the course fully expecting to succeed. His chances appeared as good as anyone's. But something came out of nowhere (in this case from within himself) and took him out.
Expediting is full of surprises. I've seen folks leave the business with little to show for their efforts after being at it many years. Why? Each story is different. Sometimes their poor performance has more to with personal issues than with the industry. It might have been bad decisions or a family illness. It might have been that after several years of doing it, winter driving became frightening. A good work ethic may have given way to a poor one. It could have been booze, a bad relationship, or a new casino addiction. The problem(s) might be too much truck, too little truck, or have nothing to do with a truck at all.
In a business where today's high flyers can become tomorrow's failures, it is unwise to presume that if you simply do what the high flyers do, success will come your way. The fact is, you have no idea how YOU will do until you get into the game. The safe way to do that is with a (good) fleet owner.
Put yourself through the paces. Run with a fleet owner long enough to prove in the real world what kind of gross income YOU can generate and what kind of business manager YOU really are. Face the challenges. See how you react. Find out if you can make it or not. You'll learn a lot about yourself. And you'll learn which truck is right for you.
Every day in expediting is a new test. If you succeed as a fleet driver, a whole new set of challenges will rise when you become an Owner/Operator. If you succeed for two years as an Owner/Operator, the third year will test you all over again. While the basic tasks of expediting are relatively easy to master, performing them in settings that constantly change can give rise to demons you never knew were there.
When selecting your truck, there are a host of factors to consider. I'm not going into them here. I'm writing now simply to say that the question, "How do I keep from going broke when I buy a truck?" is not the best one to ask; and that the advice, "Start low and work your way up." is not caved in stone.
A better question to ask is, "What do I have to do right now to achieve my goals as an expediter?" Ask it several times a day; and understand that the answers will change with your circumstances and mindset.
If you ask, "How can I keep from going broke if I buy a truck?" you're focus is on going broke. If you ask, "What do I have to do right now to achieve my goals as an expediter?" and if your goals include owning a top-end truck, you'll likely see truck opportunities that are there for everyone, but invisible to those that are starting low and working his way up.