For the Ron Paul Supporters

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
It's just a matter of harsh reality - Paul is not going to win any of the primaries, just like in '08.
LOL ... we'll hold ya to it there Carnack ..... and we'll see ya way down the road ....

Regarding the mess we're in: the Labor Force Participation Rate continues to be stuck at 64% and will not show any improvement until Obama is defeated and the Democrats are marginalized in the Senate.
ROTFLMAO ......

If Paul runs as a 3d party candidate Obama wins - it's that simple.
Actually, maybe not:

More than two-thirds of Americans would consider voting for a third-party presidential candidate, while nearly half of all voters think a third-party is needed, a new poll shows.

Sixty-eight percent of voters said they would “definitely vote for” or “consider voting for” a third-party candidate whom they agreed with on most issues, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll Friday.

Only 28 percent said that they would definitely not vote for an independent candidate.

Americans are split over whether the creation of a third party is necessary, however — 48 percent consider a third party necessary, while 49 percent say that it is not necessary. [rlent: anyone seeing a tipping point somewhere around here ?]

The most likely to support the creation a third party? A majority of independents (61 percent), liberals (60 percent) and moderates (51 percent) said that a third party was necessary.

The Washington Post-ABC News poll was conducted Jan. 12-15, with a sample of 1,000 adults and a margin of error of plus or minus 3.5 percentage points.

Politico: Poll Shows Two-thirds Would Vote Indie

.... times they are changing ....

So Paul needs to be placated at the GOP convention, and it won't be the first time that's happened.
You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about - you really think he (we) can be "placated" by "promises" from the amoral and thoroughly corrupt ? ..... that's just totally delusional.

You also have absolutely no real understanding of what you are seeing and looking at .... we're in this for the long haul.

Try watching the "Rally for the Republic" - which took place concurrently with the 2008 GOP convention <spit> - after Dr. Paul was dismissed and shut out by neocon McCain <spit>.

The following (1 1/2 hour) video is Dr. Paul speaking at the rally (with an introduction by Barry Goldwater Jr.)

Rally for the Republic: Dr. Ron Paul Speaks

Full video of the event (it's over 5 hours long):

CSPAN: Rally for the Republic
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
It's just a matter of harsh reality - Paul is not going to win any of the primaries, just like in '08. Regarding the mess we're in: the Labor Force Participation Rate continues to be stuck at 64% and will not show any improvement until Obama is defeated and the Democrats are marginalized in the Senate. If Paul runs as a 3d party candidate Obama wins - it's that simple. So Paul needs to be placated at the GOP convention, and it won't be the first time that's happened.

The harsh reality is that Obama will win anyway with either romney or Gingrich running.

The funny thing is that I don't really expect Paul to 'win' but take the issues of his followers into the national spotlight - which seems to be those liberal left leaning nutcase military members.
 

jaminjim

Veteran Expediter
The funny thing is that I don't really expect Paul to 'win' but take the issues of his followers into the national spotlight - which seems to be those liberal left leaning nutcase military members.
Thought I have seen several Polls in the past and not one of them said the military members leaned to the left.

And why do you call them nut cases? :confused:
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Might be some tongue-in-cheek humor ;) (.... given that Dr. Paul, who seems to garner the most support from the military out of any of the candidates by far, has been branded by some as a liberal left-leaning nutcase ... :rolleyes:)
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Thought I have seen several Polls in the past and not one of them said the military members leaned to the left.

And why do you call them nut cases? :confused:

OK here is what I'm saying.

The funny thing is that I don't really expect Paul to 'win'

This means that I would love to see him or someone like him actually take the GOP or the Democrat party into the real world but it is not going to happen with all of these liberal/conservatives around.


but take the issues of his followers into the national spotlight -

I think this is his plan, to make the waves needed to become more and more mainstream with the people, like planting the seed of common sense and rid them of their stupidity.


which seems to be those liberal left leaning nutcase military members.


This was a sarcastic poke at the media who claims in many cases, like in the case of Fox (rush and even palin), that his followers are left leaning but in fact if they would take the time to dig under the surface of their pea brain thought process, they may find that this who are following Paul are not in fact those who are related to the occupy wall street crowd but more of the people who should be 'conservative' in nature, a majority is surprising the group that has more to lose with a bad president and congress, the Military.

So to recap because people think that everyone who is a paul follower is a left leaning nutcase, then the military people who paul has a strong following must be like those others.

Hope that makes sense?
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
OK here is what I'm saying.

The funny thing is that I don't really expect Paul to 'win'

This means that I would love to see him or someone like him actually take the GOP or the Democrat party into the real world but it is not going to happen with all of these liberal/conservatives around.

That is basically what I was saying months ago. Just not going to happen with his current numbers.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
So to recap because people think that everyone who is a paul follower is a left leaning nutcase, then the military people who paul has a strong following must be like those others.
Everyone "knows" all his supporters are hippie dope smokers .... they just want to see him get elected for the weed ... and a free pony .... :rolleyes:
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
That is basically what I was saying months ago. Just not going to happen with his current numbers.

Well the problem many of his followers see is with the current numbers that the republicans have going into the fall election, they need all then help they can get but with the continuous trashing of them, they may vote for Obama.

Everyone "knows" all his supporters are hippie dope smokers .... they just want to see him get elected for the weed ... and a free pony .... :rolleyes:

so true
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
Well the problem many of his followers see is with the current numbers that the republicans have going into the fall election, they need all then help they can get but with the continuous trashing of them, they may vote for Obama.

That is certainly in the realm of possibilities.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
I don't think it is too far off, I am hearing a bunch of frustrated people saying that they are tired of the trashing and the assumption that the base is the only group who counts for either party.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
The harsh reality is that Obama will win anyway with either romney or Gingrich running.
The funny thing is that I don't really expect Paul to 'win' but take the issues of his followers into the national spotlight - which seems to be those liberal left leaning nutcase military members.
Neither you nor anyone else is in a position to make the assumption at this point in time that Obama will win. That's simply a reflection of what's being dictated by the mainstream media. Barack Hussein Obama has the worst record in office since Jimmy Carter and could easily have an approval rating in the single digits if it weren't for the bias of the MSM and the fact that he's the first black president of the U.S. (even thought he's only 1/2 black). Once the GOP decides on a candidate - be it Romney, Gingrich or Santorum - and the campaign begins in earnest, the numbers will begin to change against him over time. Although the GOP primaries are just starting, the nation as a whole won't start paying serious attention to presidential politics until football season starts. If we're still over 8% unemployment and there's some sort of trouble going on in the Middle East, Obama is toast.
 
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RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Neither you nor anyone else is in a position to make the assumption at this point in time that Obama will win.
.... thus saith the great assumption-maker hiss bad self ..... :rolleyes:

That's simply a reflection of what's being dictated by the mainstream media.
..... hang on a second .... I need to unplug-in my mainstream media chip implant and see if that reflection goes away or not .....

Barack Hussein Obama has the worst record in office since Jimmy Carter and could easily have an approval rating in the single digits if it weren't for the bias of the MSM and the fact that he's the first black president of the U.S. (even thought he's only 1/2 black).
ROTFLMAO ..... and here I thought Clinton was .....

Once the GOP decides on a candidate - be it Romney, Gingrich or Santorum - and the campaign begins in earnest, the numbers will begin to change against him over time.
..... yup ... no assumptions there ..... move along folks, nothing to see here ...... :rolleyes:

Although the GOP primaries are just starting, the nation as a whole won't start paying serious attention to presidential politics until football season starts. If we're still over 8% unemployment and there's some sort of trouble going on in the Middle East, Obama is toast.
In what manner might a possible 3rd party run by Dr. Ron Paul figure into that scenario ?

What about the possibility of Americans Elect fielding a candidate for the office ?

Or is this thinking above still constrained back in the political dark ages ?
 

twe2011

Seasoned Expediter
Neither you nor anyone else is in a position to make the assumption at this point in time that Obama will win. That's simply a reflection of what's being dictated by the mainstream media. Barack Hussein Obama has the worst record in office since Jimmy Carter and could easily have an approval rating in the single digits if it weren't for the bias of the MSM and the fact that he's the first black president of the U.S. (even thought he's only 1/2 black). Once the GOP decides on a candidate - be it Romney, Gingrich or Santorum - and the campaign begins in earnest, the numbers will begin to change against him over time. Although the GOP primaries are just starting, the nation as a whole won't start paying serious attention to presidential politics until football season starts. If we're still over 8% unemployment and there's some sort of trouble going on in the Middle East, Obama is toast.

Wow, someone with real facts and common sense...thank you for being here! :)
 
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greg334

Veteran Expediter
Am I watching fox?

Look it is simple

With the republican party being stuck in the dark ages since 1992, I not just think that who ever they put up to lose but expect it. I saw my first Obama ad yesterday so as many have said in past year, the republicans have to start early and get a strong candidate but they again lost the message among the words.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
"The dark ages since 1992"... really? The facts would say otherwise. Plus, poor ol' dubya - the dumb cracker from TX won two terms as POTUS against the supposedly superior Democrat candidates that the mainstream media told us would blow him away - remember how the polls that told us he had no chance against Al Gore or John Kerry?? Granted, the GOP had losers like Bob Dole and John McCain to even out the previously mentioned Democrat losers - but none of the above mentioned four was as bad as Barack Hussein Obama, and he's turned out to be a far worse POTUS than candidate. That will change now that he's got a record instead of a fictional image. The notion that he's unbeatable is a myth promoted by the mainstream media; it's not only a myth, it's a joke. Any one of the remaining GOP candidates - Newt, Romney or Santorum - will defeat Obama. The media would like for us to forget the 2010 midterm elections and their results - the voters will not.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
"The dark ages since 1992"... really? The facts would say otherwise.
You do know that this is the first time since it's inception in 1980 that a candidate who won the South Carolina primary did not also win either IA or NH right ?

Gingrich didn't even place in the top three in either contest .....

...... we ain't in Kansas anymore Toto .....

Plus, poor ol' dubya - the dumb cracker from TX
Got that right !

won two terms as POTUS
Some would say bought it, courtesy of the courts (having the better lawyers - which I, regrettably, helped pay for) ...

Others would say won, courtesy of the votes of myself and many, many others like me ..... who, being once bitten, are now twice shy - and for some, even thrice shy .... if you consider those who voted for Obama in 2008 (I wasn't one of them)

We now see neither of the parties as being a solution - but only part of the problem for the most part .... since they are largely functionally the same.

A lot of us look with absolute horror on what has happened since 2000 to present ..... and say never again, in terms of contributing to that insanity .... which is why it's a chuckle watching the pontifications of those who are so devoted to party above all else, that they have no regard or concern for the character and integrity of those that they would support ....

against the supposedly superior Democrat candidates that the mainstream media told us would blow him away - remember how the polls that told us he had no chance against Al Gore or John Kerry??
Nope - I wasn't paying much attention to the polls at the time.

Granted, the GOP had losers like Bob Dole and John McCain to even out the previously mentioned Democrat losers - but none of the above mentioned four was as bad as Barack Hussein Obama .......
In who's opinion ?

It's all relative .... depending on who is doing the looking ....

and he's turned out to be a far worse POTUS than candidate. That will change now that he's got a record instead of a fictional image. The notion that he's unbeatable is a myth promoted by the mainstream media; it's not only a myth, it's a joke.
Oh, it's not that he's unbeatable - he clearly is - but doing so requires the right candidate ...

The problem with your narrative is this: it's one that's dreamed of purely from a perspective that chooses to ignore that there are those of us out here, which no longer see either of the parties as a solution but as the problem ... that number has been steadily growing .... as polling clearly shows ....

It's dreamed of from viewpoint that deems the base constituencies of two parties are the only relevant ones .... they aren't .... and they are becoming less relevant everyday ....

You should understand this from having lived through the 2008 election - but being a (so-called) "conservative true believer" you simply can't bring yourself to face it .....

Any one of the remaining GOP candidates - Newt, Romney or Santorum - will defeat Obama.
Ain't gonna happen .....

How ya think it's gonna go over when it comes out that Sick Rantorum has publicly stated that Islam as a religion needs to be "eradicated ..... in a "long war" ..... ?

(.... keeping in mind the general populace's current lack of taste for war generally, of course .... :rolleyes:)

Seemingly, as a matter of course, that would include either the eradication (or conversion :eek:) of all Muslims as well - that pretty much puts him in the same category as Al Qaeda for a lot of folks .... (I understand that you may personally have no problem with this, but there are more than just a few of us that would)

Next, we have the Newter ...... given his predilection for bellicose rhetoric, illusions of grandeur, and personal history of instability and general flakiness (to say nothing of the ethical baggage), you figger that there's any likelihood that a majority or a plurality of the populace is gonna get onboard with that ?

..... for either of those two, cue the 2012 remake of Lyndon's 1964 "Daisy" ad against Goldwater:

Daisy

(I'll dig very deep to help fund that and keep either of these goofballs from getting anywhere near a trigger, nuclear or otherwise)

Newt has the highest national unfavorability ratings of any of the four candidates (26/60) .... and these are getting worse as time goes on ...... probably because he's the best known .... and I have a feeling that we'll be getting to know him alot better as time goes on .... mebbe Aunt Nancy will help ....

If you have any lines into senior GOP "insiders" then you probably already know that there is a very real fear that if Newt is the nominee the GOP may actually end up losing the House in November .... might be why he's little short on any significant endorsements ....

He's a highly polarizing figure .....

Out of the three, the only one (besides Dr. Paul) that even has a prayer (and that's iffy, given what we've seen in the last week or so) is Romney, as polling indicates .... probably due to his business background, because he appears to be most level-headed (even if somewhat "plasticy" and not "genuine") and the least bellicose on foreign policy of the three ...

And here's a final thought: 2016 .... remember - like I said, a lot of us are really playing the long game ....

Despite what Dr. Ron Paul might decide to do in terms of a 3rd party run or whatever, if there is a neocon with an "R" behind their name in the White House in 2016, Dr. Paul The Younger will be unable to run against them ... so, as is typically said elsewhere:

"..... you know what to do ......"

Get it ?

The media would like for us to forget the 2010 midterm elections and their results - the voters will not.
Nope .... those who won't forget them are those that are completely fixated on them - and cling to them as evidence of the "great conservative reawakening" .... or the "great liberal rejection" ......

FWIW, 2012 may be the year of "a pox on both your houses" .....
 
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greg334

Veteran Expediter
"The dark ages since 1992"... really?

Yes really, do you want me to repeat it so you get that the entire party is like Europe in the dark ages?

The facts would say otherwise.

What facts?

That the republican run congress was run like the democrats were running it, under Gingrich's partial control?

Oh it is the fact that despite being sold a BS line, the attempts to reduce the government were actually an expansion of government during the 90's?

Plus, poor ol' dubya - the dumb cracker from TX won two terms as POTUS against the supposedly superior Democrat candidates that the mainstream media told us would blow him away - remember how the polls that told us he had no chance against Al Gore or John Kerry??

Well looking at the environment at the time, I see Bush was the better of the two others, especially Gore - who seemed not to win over the support of Clinton, but nevertheless, they were all p*ss poor candidates and further proves that the issue of the party being in the dark ages seems to be more true than not.

Granted, the GOP had losers like Bob Dole and John McCain to even out the previously mentioned Democrat losers - but none of the above mentioned four was as bad as Barack Hussein Obama, and he's turned out to be a far worse POTUS than candidate.

Well I don't know how that can be, Dole was not the right guy and it seems to remind me that the republican party has done this thing where they pay back people and put them as the party candidate when there is a need to do so - Dole and McCain both are really poor leaders (except Dole made a very good move by resigning his senate seat when he accepted the candidacy), this contributes to the dark ages of the party and the lack of understanding that the best man for the party is not the best canidate for the country. I assume that Romney or Gingrich will win but that means there is going to be another McCain presented to the country for them to choose and we already know what Obama is like as a country, but we don't know what Gingrich or Romney will do in his place because they both seem to be cut from the same cloth as Obama.

That will change now that he's got a record instead of a fictional image.

Actually I think you are dreaming a bit too much.

The notion that he's unbeatable is a myth promoted by the mainstream media; it's not only a myth, it's a joke.

Actually nope I don't think it is a joke and it isn't the mainstream media that seems to be promoting it. The religious right among many other groups seems not to get that they are not speaking for the country and the country is seeing improvements from the administration while the they are pointing out that the problems with congress have to do with the republicans who in my opinion are frickn' clueless on how to stop Obama or the dems.

Any one of the remaining GOP candidates - Newt, Romney or Santorum - will defeat Obama.

Ah ... nope.

Gingrich has too much baggage and as some in the democratic party have pointed out, he stinks with some ethics issues. I personally don't trust him and he, like other republicans has been more of an opportunist on many fronts than an actual leader. I don't want another opertunist president to be in the White House.

Romney is Obama but a different color (not to offend Obama followers). His tenure as governor wasn't as it should have been and still he left the state with Romney care, which is part of the model of Obama care. Big government liberal/conservative which begs the question - why would we want him when we already know what obama is?

Santorum?

Seriously, any more blessing of this candidate we will have to have God send someone down to be on his staff. For some reason, I can't take him seriously because he speaks as if he is a puppet.

You forgot Paul, who may not have won in SC but it seems is still getting a lot of people, especially young people, thinking about what Government should be doing.

The media would like for us to forget the 2010 midterm elections and their results - the voters will not.

Not true, just the opposite - MSNBC has talked about it as has a few shows on NPR, all of which I think the republican party could have learned a lesson from the 2010 elections, and triggered a rebirth of sorts for them but they are still towing that same banner around as the dems are but with a different mascot.
 
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