Pray for Dallas.

[Moot]

One doesn't hear much outrage from BLM concerning that is because it has nothing to do with state violence.

Sure it does! If one or more of BLM's 7 points is connected to State violence then protecting or lack of protecting black citizens (all citizens) from criminal violence should be included. The State is responsible for protecting all of us from crime and violence. Why is it so difficult for people to acknowledge that gang murder rates far exceed the killing of young Black men compared to cops of any race killing young Black men? Where is the outrage? Certainly there are bad cops. There are also bad "community activists, politicians, truck drivers, etc. Once you demonize cops to the extent that is currently prevalent, what sane person would want to join the ranks of law enforcement? Law enforcement agencies will recruit from the bottom of the barrel. Sadly racial quotas will also be involved.

Disclaimer: This rant came to you via Moot who is the proud father of a police officer that graduated with honors from a 4 year university with a degree in Law Enforcement and Spanish. Yeah, I'm biased, but I look at the big picture. I'm biased but I try to weigh everything before passing judgement or coming to an unfounded conclusion.

It's the same exact reason we don't hear much outrage from BLM over McDonald's only selling the McRib for a limited time instead of all the time. All of those bullet points say the same thing - black lives should be treated in America by the state with the same respect and importance as the state treats non-black lives.

No! Your McRib analogy is a poor deflection of a serious problem in this country. Black lives matter. All lives matter. Crime, poverty and murder are all out of control in this country. Look at who is on the presidential ballot this November. Are these two a rational choice for a country that has it's together? Are these two the best this great country can offer?

 

[Turtle]

... but I try to weigh everything before passing judgement or coming to an unfounded conclusion.

Except you've concluded that BLM should mean something other than it does.

Why is it so difficult for people to acknowledge that gang murder rates far exceed the killing of young Black men compared to cops of any race killing young Black men?

I don't think anyone has any difficulty in acknowledging that. But that's not what BLM is about.

Yes, blacks are killed by blacks more than anyone else, which shouldn't come as a shock, as whites are killed by whites more than anyone else. The same holds true for other racial and cultural concentrations, like Latinos and Native Americans. That's a neighborhood issue, not a state abuse issue.

No! Your McRib analogy is a poor deflection of a serious problem in this country.

It's an accurate analogy of something NOT on the BLM bullet list that shouldn't be. BLM is what it is, and no matter how much you think it should be something else, it's not.

 

[brokcanadian]

Geez, what a mess. Just a crazy Libertarian here (and a Canadian one at that), trying to understand where this all came from. My opinion, others can only do to you what you allow them to. Poverty, marginalization...why allow a government/society/group to make you poor?

Happiest times of my life were in a trailer with no running water, and a very stinky outhouse. Move away, buy a cheap piece of land, grow your own food and make your own power...what does this have to do with BLM? I can't understand why a group of people feels oppressed in today's free society, but I never understood high school either, everyone wanting to separate into groups that hated each other.

BLM won't change anything. But they seem to convince people that they are being held down by other people, and can't do what they want to do in life because of those other people.

If I was black I'd be doing the same thing I'm doing now, removing my dependence on government and society and making sure myself and my family were healthy without outside systems of support.

George Carlin summed it up, it's a big ******* club and you aint in it. Stop feeding people that feed on you.

 

[Turtle]

If I was black I'd be doing the same thing I'm doing now, removing my dependence on government and society and making sure myself and my family were healthy without outside systems of support.

But you'd have to do all that while getting pulled over half a dozen times a year for DWB (Driving While Black), WWB (Walking While Black) or JBB (Just Being Black), she getting arrested several times for mouthing off, not complying with an officer's request, and resisting arrest.

 

[brokcanadian]

That's my point. I don't often see police where I chose to live. We're free to move within our own countries to whichever state (or province) gives us what we're looking for. Not every police force or area in the country is racist. Put your effort and money into an area that reflects the way you want to live. Reminds me of " bread not circuses " or the "99 percent" . I'd have serious problems buying even a hamburger knowing the taxes were supporting the people who had just arrested me for "being black" . Where I grew up, I was pulled over more than 6 times a year for "being young" since they didn't have anything else to do.

That's not directly comparable I know, I was never arrested or shot at, I thought it was an extremely interesting comment about militarization in police forces needing an enemy, whether being young or black or both. Move away, buy used, grow food or direct from farms, stop paying the police to harass you. Take your talents and effort and reward a place that doesn't suck. What I think groups like BLM have wrong, is its the individuals that have the power, not the institutions if you take yourself out of the situation. You feel discriminated against? Take yourself and your worth, as a person and financially, to someplace that appreciates it.

 

[Moot]

Except you've concluded that BLM should mean something other than it does.

You have concluded that I have concluded that BLM should mean something other than it does. BLM stands for Black Lives Matter. Read their website.

 

[Turtle]

You have concluded that I have concluded that BLM should mean something other than it does.

My bad.

If Black lives really matter why does BLM only protest when a black person is killed by a white cop?

 

[RoadTime]

Related, coincidence? The other high profile
case location has its own police ambush.

3 officers killed; 3 injured in Baton Rouge - CNN.com

 

[Turtle]

Related, coincidence?

I'd say it's almost a certainty that it's related. We don't really know if it's an ambush or not, or who the shooter is, whether the shooter acted alone, the motivation behind the shooting, or whether police officers were intentionally targeted. But this follows a week of ongoing protests in Baton Rouge after the police arrested nearly 200 protesters, almost all of whom weren't breaking the law in any way. The police, decked out in full intimidating and escalating military regalia, actually went into people's yards and arrested people, saying being on private property wasn't good enough, they had to leave the area. Unbelievable. The lawsuits have already been filed over that one.

But an ambush of police officers in Baton Rouge, while sicken an abhorrent, is certainly more understandable than the ambush of police officers in Dallas, where the police and the community have virtually zero problems. The relationship between police and community in Dallas is practically the gold standard for how it's supposed to be, while Baton Rouge is practically the exact opposite of Dallas.

I'm afraid this is still gonna get worse before it gets better.

 

[Pilgrim]

I guess I should have added a little facetious smiley face thing to my reply in post #35. I was being flippant as I am prone to do occasionally. My point is that one doesn't hear much outrage from BLM concerning Black on Black violence (gangs) and innocent victims being killed by gangs.

I visited the Black Lives Matter website. http://blacklivesmatter.com/about/ Hash tag or no hash tag, Black Lives Matter has expanded well beyond it's original platform rooted in the death of Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown. The BLM website lists 7 bullet points that explain what Black Lives Matter means. Some of their points sound like they come from right wing, white government conspiracy believing nut jobs. No mention of gangs or the innocents caught in their crossfire. No direct mention of how government welfare programs enslave poor people of all colors, thus "state violence".

Most of their bullet points are sheer nonsense.

What Does #BlackLivesMatter Mean?

When we say Black Lives Matter, we are broadening the conversation around state violence to include all of the ways in which Black people are intentionally left powerless at the hands of the state. We are talking about the ways in which Black lives are deprived of our basic human rights and dignity.

*How Black poverty and genocide is state violence.
Yes, we have LBJ, the Democrats and govt. welfare system to mostly thank for the everlasting poverty rate - yet blacks continue to vote overwhelmingly for Democrats no matter who the candidate might be. And this is supposed to be "state violence". But genocide - seriously??

*How 2.8 million Black people are locked in cages in this country is state violence.
Might have something to do with the crime rate within the black population.

*How Black women bearing the burden of a relentless assault on our children and our families is state violence.
The Great Society has destroyed the black family. More than 70% of black babies are born to single mothers. Poverty, gangs and drug addiction are also factors. Yet they try to label this cultural rot as "state violence".

*How Black queer and trans folks bear a unique burden from a hetero-patriarchal society that disposes of us like garbage and simultaneously fetishizes us and profits off of us, and that is state violence.
Nonsensical gibberish

*How 500,000 Black people in the US are undocumented immigrants and relegated to the shadows.
So half a million illegal aliens should be given amnesty because they're black?

*How Black girls are used as negotiating chips during times of conflict and war.
Really?? Are they serious or just plain nuts?

*How Black folks living with disabilities and different abilities bear the burden of state sponsored Darwinian experiments that attempt to squeeze us into boxes of normality defined by white supremacy, and that is state violence.
Tell that to Oprah, Lebron James, Clarence Thomas or Condoleezza Rice. More nonsense. If they're trying to refer to govt programs like the War On Poverty, yes it's an abysmal failure but doesn't remotely qualify as state violence.

They are implicitly encouraging the anarchy and violence against law enforcement that's starting to be an almost daily occurrence in our country, and the civilized majority of our population will soon reach their limit of toleration for this Black Lives Matter crap. This is an election year and people will remember this when they go to the polls in November.

One other thought: what happens when the white militia wackos start their own vigilante attacks against random black people in retaliation for these random police killings? This could be the case unless somebody steps up and shows some leadership on a national level, and so far Barack Hussein Obama is MIA.

 

[Ragman]

.....and so far Barack Hussein Obama is MIA.

How did i know this situation was going to be dumped on Obama?

This is a problem that has been brewing for decades, including every Republican administration.

To blame Obama is absurd.

IMO, of course.

 

[Yowpuggy]

Mitt Romney: Obama to blame for high gas prices.

 

[Turtle]

One other thought: what happens when the white militia wackos start their own vigilante attacks against random black people in retaliation for these random police killings?

Pretty much the same thing that's been happening to those and similar groups every since the famous Supreme Court Dred Scott decision in which Justice Roger Taney said in 1857 that the black man has “no rights which the white man was bound to respect.”

The 14th Amendment basically passed to void and nullify the Dred Scott decision, so we'ved moved past that in our official statements of the law, but what has happened since the 14th Amendment is that it gets very largely ignored by the courts, or twisted around so that it protects corporations instead of protecting disadvantaged minorities. And over time, even though the doctrine of Dred Scott has been wiped away on paper, the habit of thinking in terms of a two-tiered society becomes very deeply ingrained.

 

[skyraider]

This whole mess began around the early 1600 hundreds. So we or them or whomever way back then left the good old USA with a curse that is deeply entrenched in our culture. How do we fix it? Let me know....................meanwhile, many may perish with this on going curse, imho.

 

[brokcanadian]

Fire all the politicians and elect those that understand the constitution.

That would require people to take responsibility for their own selves, so yeah, won't happen.

When will people realize government can't fix anything? And why would they feel the need to when their lives are not affected by regular people's problems?

 

[Pilgrim]

How did i know this situation was going to be dumped on Obama?

This is a problem that has been brewing for decades, including every Republican administration.

To blame Obama is absurd.

IMO, of course.

Not blaming Obama or dumping the situation on him, just saying he's not doing anything significant to put an end to this race-based violence.

To blame the cops is absurd.

 

[brokcanadian]

Originally the US was supposed to be a bottom up, people then states then federal system...think real change would take a rollback of people's attitudes (couple hundred years worth)

From outside it looks like people have problems and are turning to their "leaders" to fix it. How about any police officer who is not a member of Oath Keepers gets the boot?

Sorry to butt in, the constitution of the United States as it was originally intended is the greatest document for freedom of individuals ever conceived, as an outsider I hate to see stuff like this going on

I'm afraid of further loss of freedoms over there to "solve" what's going on might spread

 

[Turtle]

From outside it looks like people have problems and are turning to their "leaders" to fix it.

Looks like that from the inside, too. It's the cradle-to-grave nanny state mentality, i.e., it's the government's job to protect us.

 

[Turtle]

Not blaming Obama or dumping the situation on him, just saying he's not doing anything significant to put an end to this race-based violence.

Not truuuuu! Just today he is urging Americans to tamp down inflammatory rhetoric, saying that, "Everyone right now focus on words and actions that can unite this country rather than divide it further."

Oh, wait, you said "significant." ... Sorry. My bad. Never mind.

 

[Yowpuggy]

Of course, the Obama administration can’t do anything without conservatives claiming the sky is falling.