Yet another bus crash

xmudman · Jun 27, 2011

This one happened on the PA turnpike near Donegal, about 45 miles east of Pittsburgh.

Driver Killed In Turnpike Tour Bus Crash ID'd - News Story - WPXI Pittsburgh

Once again, an early morning crash involving a driver who'd been rollin' all night. Only he was killed, but 23 passengers were injured. Small NYC bus company. Let's see how this one develops....

Safety Management System (BASICs) don't look so hot either

http://ai.fmcsa.dot.gov/SMS/Data/Ca...=z6gBx8xTJ8sWQExq0z0RbmadAH4Di+AGGaMwv4VgDvw=

Turtle · Jun 27, 2011

In 2009:

In Pennsylvania alone there were 631 commercial bus crashes; 458 of them caused injuries, and 6 were fatal.
In Pennsylvania, there were 414 school bus crashes in 2009. Of those, 233 caused injuries, and 4 were fatal. However, of those killed in the school bus-related crashes, the four who died were the drivers or passengers of the other vehicle involved.

Nationally there were 221 fatal bus crashes in the U.S. (5% of total fatal crashes); 89 involved school buses, and 77 involved transit buses. More than 10,000 were injured.

It happens a lot more than people realize. At least the numbers are heading in the right direction.
Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, Large Truck and Bus Crash Facts 2008, January 2010

copdsux · Jun 27, 2011

A former NC State basketball player(championship team from '83) was killed today, outside Raleigh. He was the driver.

Mike

mcavoy33 · Jun 28, 2011

But how many of these crashes happen in PA? I'm new to PA but the PApike or whatever its called is the worse toll road in the world as far as I'm concerned. Don't even get me started on the ramps.

I can't believe they make people pay to drive on these roads.

skyraider · Jun 28, 2011

There were 47,000,000 minnows killed last year by a larger fish too.

usaf6186 · Jun 28, 2011

mcavoy33 said:
But how many of these crashes happen in PA? I'm new to PA but the PApike or whatever its called is the worse toll road in the world as far as I'm concerned. Don't even get me started on the ramps.

I can't believe they make people pay to drive on these roads.

PA turn pike is not the worst toll roadsin the world. Mexico toll roads are far worse. Was going along at about 80 MPH until I saw cows grazing along the side of the road. That slowed me down some. Toll roads in Porto Rico are noting to write home about either. Jerry Lee

mcavoy33 · Jun 28, 2011

usaf6186 said:
PA turn pike is not the worst toll roadsin the world. Mexico toll roads are far worse. Was going along at about 80 MPH until I saw cows grazing along the side of the road. That slowed me down some. Toll roads in Porto Rico are noting to write home about either. Jerry Lee

I was exaggerating when I said world. I've never been to Mexico, Puerto Rico or any of the parts of the world that would obviously have bad roads.

xmudman · Jun 28, 2011

The PA Turnpike is an old road. It opened in 1940 between Carlisle (Exit 226) and Irwin (67), with NO speed limit; signs warned motorists to slow to 90 for the curves

. On two-ply tires, no less!

Pearl Harbor put the brakes to that.

In the intervening years, improvements have been made. There are five tunnels now, all double-tubed; at first there were eight single barrel tunnels. There are truck lanes in the mountains, and three lanes per direction near the cities. Just the same, things are far from perfect:

1. Like every road in Pennsylvania, the pike operates under the same motto: Jugiter sub molior, or "perpetually under construction";

2. It's still tolled, even though the tolls were supposed to be rescinded when the construction bonds were paid off; and

3. The tolls are expensive, and are automatically raised at the beginning of each year.

So, considering the fact that the Turnpike was built on an old Pennsy Railroad right-of-way, with inspiration from H-tler's Autobahn, it isn't as bad as you might think.
Besides, I remember when 80 was a helluva lot worse!

xmudman · Jul 1, 2011

Bus company involved in this crash shut down:

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/Mr-Ho-Charter-OOS.pdf

AMonger · Jul 1, 2011

mcavoy33 said:
But how many of these crashes happen in PA? I'm new to PA but the PApike or whatever its called is the worse toll road in the world as far as I'm concerned. Don't even get me started on the ramps.
I can't believe they make people pay to drive on these roads.

Hey, look at I-70 between Ohio and the turnpike! Check out those ramps! That has to be illegal.

xmudman · Jul 1, 2011

AMonger said:
Hey, look at I-70 between Ohio and the turnpike! Check out those ramps! That has to be illegal.

We have a lot of older roads here in PA, and in the Northeast in general. You think 70's bad? Try I83 near Harrisburg! 83 is fairly decent in MD but when you cross into PA, it's bumpy, narrow, etc. They're working on it, but the worst part is right in the city (Hbg) where you go from 4 lanes to two in less than a mile.

A lot of these old roads got grandfathered in because there's no space to widen them without encroaching on neighborhoods, etc. I guess out in the midwest, there's a tad more space...

BigBusBob · Jul 3, 2011

Bus Crashes always make big news... but nothing is ever done to change the driving laws. What so many don't realize is that the safety regulations regarding tour busses are very strict, but some slip thru somehow- just like trucking co.'s.

I've said it time and time before, 10 hours to drive. However 8 hours is enough time to get rest when you're hauling human lives?? How often do you think a tour bus drive actually gets eight hours of sleep? How about six hours of sleep? In many cases, 4 to 5 hours if your lucky when the day is all said and done. FMSCA thinks there's not enough bus accidents to warrant any rule changes versus truck drivers.

The DOT should be doing more random log book checks with passenger tour busses- loaded or not... it should be done. But instead? They're chasing truck drivers off of entrance ramps or hanging out at a scale house doing random checks of trucks that sometimes are in better shape than their own DOT cars!!

Random DOT audits of small bus co.'s and big bus co.'s should be done.

Instead, they're out chasing drivers out of rest areas that have to be closed down because the state governments can't seem to realize that they'd save money if they would simply unplug the power and shut off the water to the rest areas...
Due I'm sure to dirty politics behind closed doors of the lawmakers.

Make tour busses have generators, make them use special toilet chemicals.
Leave trucking alone. And I'm a tour bus driver and truck driver saying this!!!

That's my 2 cents.

Triple B.

cheri1122 · Jul 4, 2011

It's not about safety, it's about politics: DOT isn't going to keep a bus full of passengers waiting at the roadside while the bus/driver get inspected.
One [or more] of those passengers might well have some political clout [like a Congressman for a neighbor] and the fallout could get ugly, right?

Much easier to grab the truck driver instead, it's just one person being detained.
The way 'safety' gets used to cover for political and revenue enhancement is infuriating - but only to those of us who are negatively impacted by the charades. Everyone else has their own axe to grind.