Reefer Units

BIGDOG · Jul 28, 2005

We know this question is old but would really like a response from
someone who is currently running a T-val reefer. We are presently
running WG drybox but have a T-val on order. It is a big additional
expense for a reefer unit which is ok if it will pay for it's self and create a better bottom line. Is there enough of a demand for this unit running at apprx. 80% of the year to justify the additional
costs. The reason we are asking is there seems to be many negative
posts on this. Would really like to hear from someone who is currently running this type of unit. The one we have ordered is currently a "C" due to weight but could be upgraded to "D" with additional tag. Thanks in advance for any imput.

Bigdog
<<<passing side suicide>>>>>

Glen Rice · Jul 28, 2005

You will not regret going Reefer T-Val. Your revenue will be outstanding and your load opportunitys will be greater also. This is not a mistake spending the extra money. If you get out there and run your revenue will be over 200 for the year. Of course thats if your a hustler. If you want to go home all the time and aren't really serious about making money then you might as well stay in your dry box. Good luck..

davekc · Jul 28, 2005

To BigDog's post
I didn't want to get too repetitive with another thread so I sent you a PM.

Glen, I believe he is looking for someone currently running in that capacity. I sent him a reference.

Davekc
owner
21 years

Big Redd · Jul 28, 2005

The demand for T-Val is getting bigger everyday. If you do not mind running on the east coast its even better. Add to that the fact that we are the only game in town and that FDA is making more and more drug companies have a paper trail.I went into T val in December and it has been the best move I made.Would recomend putting on the tag as it will give you more oppertunities for work.Good luck.

BIGDOG · Jul 28, 2005

Thanks Glen for your imput. We like to think of ourselves as husslers and stay out a couple months at a time, this is part of the reason for a new truck.

Thank you Dave for your response we haven't read it yet but will asap.

Big Dog

tec1959 · Jul 28, 2005

BIGG REDD hi can you please tell me alittle more about a T-Val,I'm not sure i know what that it is besides a reefer,I use to drive a super D unit and just wanted to know more...Thanks

Tec1959

Big Redd · Jul 30, 2005

ok,long story short. There is a reg. that tells drug companies that they need to have a paper trail on their product.This reg did not used to be enforced on the drug companies. The FDA started to enforce the rules. Tempeture validated (T Val) gives the drug companies the paper trail.
Inside your box are a series of probes that record the temp at different parts of the box. Each one about 1/3 down the length of the roof. The probes are attached to a data recorder which records the temp in the box. The recorder can be set to record in degrees F or C.It can be also set for the time it records 15min, 20 min etc. When the load is delivered you print out a copy of the tape and it gets faxed to shipper or whoever is waiting for it so they can show they maintained the proper conditions for their product.
The up side is that companies pay alot for that print out.for example I have a 50 mile hop on Monday that pays me about 400.00. Kinda hard to turn that down. If you are sinking the money into a reffer anyway its worth the extra, at least it has been for me. I suppose if there is a down side it would be maintainance. The unit has to be T Val certified twice a year by the carrier, the data recorder has to bee checked and possibly recalibrated once a year and the reffer is inspected and serviced twice a year. Yes this cost in money and down time but I do not worry about my unit letting me down. So it's really a good thing.
Bottom line there is a demand foe T Val equipted units and the demand is growing. I have no regrets. Hope I answered your questions.....Redd

ATeam · Jul 30, 2005

>The demand for T-Val is getting bigger everyday. If you do
>not mind running on the east coast its even better. Add to
>that the fact that we are the only game in town and that FDA
>is making more and more drug companies have a paper trail.I
>went into T val in December and it has been the best move I
>made.Would recomend putting on the tag as it will give you
>more oppertunities for work.Good luck.

Big Redd,

I'm so pleased to read your reply. I believe T-Val reefers to be very much worth the investment too. My wife and I have done the research as best we can without actually running T-Val ourselves. We have several friends in FedEx WG that are running T-Val and they have no complaints about the revenue. They do complain about the time and deadhead it takes to remain T-Val certified, but even with that, it is still worth it in their view. We have a T-Val reefer unit on the way for our new truck, fully expecting it to pay for itself and more.

Since you're one that is running T-Val now, I'd love to hear your response to DaveKC's consistent negative posts about the value of reefers. His most recent reads, "Your situation is not that uncommon, and validates many posts with regards to buying trucks with reefers ect. Investments of that type have to pay for themselves or there is little reason to invest in them."

He once ran reefers years ago but offers little more than antedoctal evidence to support his views today. I'm not asking you to reveal any trade secrets or personal information, but I believe it is a disservice to talk down reefers as a matter of course. Clearly people are out there making money with them. What say you, Big Redd? Is it really true that a reefer can be a profitable addition to an expediter truck?

ATeam · Jul 30, 2005

Inside your box are a series of probes that record
>the temp at different parts of the box. Each one about 1/3
>down the length of the roof. The probes are attached to a
>data recorder which records the temp in the box. ....

Allow me to add, there is the cost of the reefer itself, and over and above that the cost of the T-Val recording and communications equipment that makes T-Val possible. The extra gizmos will add $500 to $1,000 to your reefer cost, depending on the number of probes, quality of equipment, and equipment features you choose. That's not a lot of additional money given the additional high-revenue that equipment makes you eligible to haul.

tec1959 · Jul 30, 2005

BIGG REDD thanks that helps me alot i was just wondering about the new T-Val.And also A Team i ran a reefer back in the 90's with Roberts Express And then with Fedex CC and as i can see reefers make a big difference in pay as to a regular "D" unit.I know things have changed some...

RichM · Jul 30, 2005

Why is the A Team taking potshots at Dave. Dave has verifable 20 years experience, A Team has never owned a truck,been in this business for maybe 2 years but A Team puts dave down.Makes no sense.

greg334 · Jul 30, 2005

I worked at Pfizer in R&D and one thing I know that is critical with some of the shipments of pharmaceuticals and chemicals was humidity.

Is humidity recorded too?

As a side note, I think it is funny talking about the amount of effort in shipping pharmaceutical products with these trucks but the drug reps will let their samples in the trunks of their cars on hot days, practically ruining the drugs.

Big Redd · Jul 30, 2005

You know at this years four star weekend in Fla. I had several people tell me they would not run a reefer because they are always breaking down and can not be depended on. I have been in this buisness for 20 years and the equipment today is a whole lot different than it was then. As I said the maintaince and the certification is a two edged sword it cost you time and money but you make money in the end.I am not taking shotsd at anyone but things do change and often for the better.
I'll tell you this that reefer got me through the slower time in the spring and the T Val only made it better. The load pays are enough to offset the deadhead and still put money in my pocket after expenses. If you don't mind going anywhere the demand is out there, more on the east coast than perhaps the mid west but when you consider the big picture it all is working out....Redd

Big Redd · Jul 30, 2005

No humidity is not recorded. It is my understanding that the information that is recorded is pretty much set up by the FDA spec as to what they require ...Redd

ATeam · Jul 31, 2005

>Why is the A Team taking potshots at Dave. Dave has
>verifable 20 years experience, A Team has never owned a
>truck,been in this business for maybe 2 years but A Team
>puts dave down.Makes no sense.

I'm not taking potshots at DaveKC the man. I respectfully question the validity of the points he makes. There's a difference.

In the case of White Glove and reefer experience, my two years as a WG driver trumps his numerous years as a non-WG expediter. Like DaveKC, BigRedd has 20 years experience too. Big Redd says reefers work well for him. Who are we to believe? They can't both be right, can they?

Acutally, they can. If you run with Panther II, which DaveKC does, a reefer would be a foolish investment. Panther II has nowhere near the reefer freight FedEx CC does, if it has any at all. But if you are with FedEx, there is lots of reefer freight to haul.

Let's lighten up a bit on this reefer issue, can we? Some people make money with reefers, some don't. The same is true of any expediter truck in any configuration. There is more than one way to run a successful expediter business. Just because someone is not doing it the way you do, it does not follow that it is wrong.

jackdixon_2000 · Jul 31, 2005

Hey there Big Red, too bad we didn't meet up at Amelia Island a couple weeks ago, but then maybe we did? I am one of the 5 yr winners that came up near the end of the awards. The one that needs a haircut lol

As far as T-Val, that extra $1500 or whatever should be easily recovered. But then a previous poster stated they only did 3 T-Val loads in 6 months. I have one friend that does great with his T-Val E unit though.

I am inclined not to go T-Val or White Glove, but thats just a personal choice. I prefer to do a bit more driving and a lil less complication. I do have a reefer and liftgate so still do about 20% White Glove out here on the west coast. Maybe someone could tell us how they do with T-Val out west?

I know some newbies like to see real world numbers so I will share what my truck did this week in Calif. with my Co-driver going out solo
This was a well above average week, though. As a solo I am satisfied with $2000 gross a week. That works for me being that I paid $41,000 cash back in November and have no payments.

Tuesday July 26 Took an Envirotainer from S San Francisco to Los Angeles (reefer 55-65) 437 miles $972.15

July 27 White Glove Los Angeles to Azusa (reefer 68 to 72) 39 miles $233.74

July 28 Another Envirotainer Ontario to Carson (reefer 55-65) 66 miles
$500

July 28 Surface expedite Los Angeles to Chula Vista 124 miles $202.90

July 29 Air Expedite San Diego to Otay Mesa 29 miles $203.72

July 29 Etiwanda to Hawaiian Gardens (lift gate 6 @ 1200#) 55 miles $293.80

July 29 White Glove Anaheim to Ontario 22 miles $202.93

July 30 Air Expedite Ontario to Azusa 22 miles $323.70

July 30 White Glove El Segundo to W Hollywood 90 miles $700.00 cancelled Customer could not accomadate an E unit and would require unloading the E and making 2 trips with my truck. 30 miles after dispatch customer refused to pay additional charges. Dry run pay $129.60

July 30 Dispatched for another Envirotainer (reefer 55-65) From S San Francisco to Oakland to Fremont to Oakland 91 miles $876.82. 380 miles d/h from L.A TO S.F. Picks up tomorrow morning Aug 1 about 70 miles from my house

This information for entertainment purposes only, not meant to imply anything. Just that it is not as dead out west as many people like to convey. Also, what a reefer can do for you out west. Reefer use back east is much less frequent for me but again I am not White Glove

Oddometer reading leaving home Tuesday 480,408
oddometer reading in front of the house today 482,102

Thats it, hope someone finds it interesting

truckerbse2 · Jul 31, 2005

Big Dog, I know you wanted a reply from someone who is T-Val'd, however, I think you should ask a few other questions. I was in your shoes 8 months ago and because of units already t-val'd I made the investment and your right, it is a big one. Ask some more questions of FDCC. The big one is will you be able to T-Val right away. If you can, go for it, you will do well, although I would definitely go D unit. You are already making a large investment, might as well maximize it. We are an E unit and we actually do a lot of C and D loads, reefer and otherwise. We have had our unit on now for 5 months. We have not been allowed to test for T-Val because they are concerned about flooding the market for current T-Val contractors and because they have made a rule a month ago stating they wanted a unit to be on for 6 months to see that the operator knows how to run the unit. There is Temperature control loads that do not require reefer.
Next, these rules may only apply to E units, I do not know. Ask FDCC, not other drivers. The rules have been changing daily. I have talked to D units that are doing absolutely fabulous....I mean on track to gross $300,000 or better. They are of course already T-Val's. Finally, I don't know if you are already cleared or not, but if you are you will have better luck and they will probably bend the rules to accomodate you. If you are doing well on surface and they will allow you to T-Val and to get your clearance you will probably do quite well. I wish you the best of luck.

truckerbse2 · Jul 31, 2005

I totally agree with what you are saying all the way through this message. I do have one question that I would like an opionion on. My husband and I happen to be one of those reefer teams not making much money, while those around us are thriving. We feel our investment was a bad one. We ran express for over a year and did wonderfully. I understand things run in cycles and some of it is being in the right place at the right time, however, I cannot be that unlucky. We are doing less revenue wise than we did with a dry box on express. We are an E unit. Our friends on express are doing even better than last year. Also, I have been told by the T-Val testing people that we must have the unit on for 6 months before we will be considered for T-val testing and that even then it will probably be several months before they can get us in. The reason they give is that they do not want to flood the market with T-Val certified trucks in order to protect current T-Val contractors. Another reason for the 6 months is to be sure that the operators know how to run the reefer unit. While I agree with both concepts, this was not what was presented to us when we first started talking to FDCC about purchasing a reefer. In fact when we were bringing it to Union Town to sign on we were told that if we wanted to test for T-Val we needed a NIST test. We did that on the way in so we were ready. Still we have been put off. I was only given the info on the 6 month wait 4 days ago and told that had been put into effect just a month ago. Now I'm being told to wait for our 6 month mark to get on a list that is now several months long. Have you heard anything like this or are we being jerked around??

ATeam · Jul 31, 2005

>I totally agree with what you are saying all the way through
>this message. I do have one question that I would like an
>opionion on. My husband and I happen to be one of those
>reefer teams not making much money, while those around us
>are thriving. We feel our investment was a bad one. We ran
>express for over a year and did wonderfully. I understand
>things run in cycles and some of it is being in the right
>place at the right time, however, I cannot be that unlucky.
>We are doing less revenue wise than we did with a dry box on
>express. We are an E unit. Our friends on express are
>doing even better than last year. Also, I have been told by
>the T-Val testing people that we must have the unit on for 6
>months before we will be considered for T-val testing and
>that even then it will probably be several months before
>they can get us in. The reason they give is that they do
>not want to flood the market with T-Val certified trucks in
>order to protect current T-Val contractors. Another reason
>for the 6 months is to be sure that the operators know how
>to run the reefer unit. While I agree with both concepts,
>this was not what was presented to us when we first started
>talking to FDCC about purchasing a reefer. In fact when we
>were bringing it to Union Town to sign on we were told that
>if we wanted to test for T-Val we needed a NIST test. We
>did that on the way in so we were ready. Still we have been
>put off. I was only given the info on the 6 month wait 4
>days ago and told that had been put into effect just a month
>ago. Now I'm being told to wait for our 6 month mark to get
>on a list that is now several months long. Have you heard
>anything like this or are we being jerked around??

I can't comment on every item you raise but regarding the move by FedEx CC to not over-expand it's T-val fleet, that's a fact. Letters have been sent out explaining it. If you have not seen the letter, your contract coordinator should be able to provide you with a copy.

davekc · Aug 1, 2005

>>Why is the A Team taking potshots at Dave. Dave has
>>verifable 20 years experience, A Team has never owned a
>>truck,been in this business for maybe 2 years but A Team
>>puts dave down.Makes no sense.
>
>I'm not taking potshots at DaveKC the man. I respectfully
>question the validity of the points he makes. There's a
>difference.
>
>In the case of White Glove and reefer experience, my two
>years as a WG driver trumps his numerous years as a non-WG
>expediter.
======================================================
Correction
You have no clue as to what experience I have with regards to reefers or WG. If you did, that wouldn't be the statement you would make.
Congratulations on your two years driving.

Davekc
owner
21 years