Load 1 Florida office ?

[davekc]

Supply and demand are really the market forces. The rates between Detroit and Chicago on truckload vary by over $200 depending on which direction you are going???? Same miles, same freight??? Much like the NE. Smart carriers go in at well over $2 a mile, knowing the rates are low coming out of there or they bid high enough to run back part way empty. I completely understand that rates out of the NE are low, but the same argument for the excessive rates going in would apply. Simply put, supply and demand is more geographical than any other factors. Truckload is a far different business than expedite.

Ah yes. And then you have those nameless carriers that will get that rate, and then keep the return money and then leave the driver there realizing what the outbound freight is.
And then of course failing to mention this to the driver who is sitting somewhere doing extended rot time. Just amazing sometimes.

 

[idtrans]

So if I understand correctly a good rate leased to a firm is $2.50 pm then the truck gets 65% of that = $ 1.62 actual per mile to truck ? and then leaving at $1.50 which they don't even wanna pay is $.975 to truck to leave ? Or is there a for example $1.62 plus .80cpm FSC ? bringing the rate to $$2.42 per mile to go and the $1.775 to leave ? if so that that's good rates but I seriously don't see the 2nd scene playing often with what I could see off the NE sector ! But I could be wrong now.

 

[Rocketman]

So if I understand correctly a good rate leased to a firm is $2.50 pm then the truck gets 65% of that = $ 1.62 actual per mile to truck ? and then leaving at $1.50 which they don't even wanna pay is $.975 to truck to leave ? Or is there a for example $1.62 plus .80cpm FSC ? bringing the rate to $$2.42 per mile to go and the $1.775 to leave ? if so that that's good rates but I seriously don't see the 2nd scene playing often with what I could see off the NE sector ! But I could be wrong now.

Did these mean people force you to take a load that you considered to be too cheap? Is there any penalty to you personally one way or the other?

My suggestion would be that there are lots of loads available to you. Some will pay better than others. Personally I think you would find your time better spent looking for those better paying loads rather than crying like a little school girl on an internet forum everytime you see a cheap rate offered. My guess is that the agents in question are very capable of getting their freight moved. I would also guess that none of them (being truckload carriers) know that EO even exists.

 

[idtrans]

Thanks for such a intelligent CB radio reply.

 

[Rocketman]

Thanks for such a intelligent CB radio reply.

Lol...coming from you?

 

[purgoose10]

Are there any guidelines or general principles that expediters can can be articulated to help expedite understand the freight market, freight availability, pricing and movement? Brokers and carriers have all kinds of information about shippers and freight. What can the expediters who haul the stuff know?

Most is not in a book, it's years of doing it, working for Brokers, Agents, Freight company's etc, etc.
This is not something you can learn overnight and even the experienced people find it hard to keep up with. It changes daily. Now when dealing with a large shipper they want bids on certain runs and if they go over a certain amount of loads they want a rebate on the shipments. You can thank RCR for that new agenda. Carriers basically charge 15% of an LTL for FSC. ABF (when FSC first started) was first to anounce they made a profit from the FSC they charged their customers. If you were a shipper what would that tell you? UPS line trucks from Columbia SC to Atlanta GA. about 200 mi average $8-$10 thousand worth of revenue on that truck from small pkgs. Just think about all the country combined. 15 years ago when I started a small package service I ran small stuff on Busses overnight to Atl ga. to compete. Easy money till Greyhound found out. Like I said it changes daily. There is still a Ton of ways to make it in this business, but it take boots on the ground along with that telephone.

 

[idtrans]

Well I did ask a serious ? no answer yet on the rate leased to a company . Don't any of you drivers leased know if my break downs are correct or incorrect ? just wondering how they pay the mile and FSC? I get flat rates I don't worry about FSC . For example I pulled out of NE for $2.05pm all in and then got to better position and pulled in $2.50pm all in.

 

[Rocketman]

Yep...your right. If you were leased to a carrier at 75%, you would have been running for about the same as most "lease-on" dry box, general expedite freight straight trucks are running for. On the second load, you were running for a little bit better, but when you average the two out, your still in the range of a leased on straight truck.

So, I ask you...where is the advantage to running a t/t under your own authority, doing your own billing and collecting, marketing, load matching and compliance? Yeah, you get to keep that other 25%, but your spending part of it and earning the rest by doing all of the work?

You sir, are running cheap freight!

 

[idtrans]

Explain yourself better instead of making personal attacks. Could be more informative with your knowledge so we can all learn.

 

[JOHNCLARK]

Mr. E, Jump out of this conversation while you can!! Explanations hardly work here. We all know 1st to stay out of the NE, and if you dare go their you bes go in heavy($4.) at least to RT out. If your driver wants a load at that point which its not worth chasing take the .90 cents and be happy. If you don't take the freight, the broker is forced to raise rates at that point. Forever now this market is based on supply and demand. Too many people get into this industry eyes wide shut and have absolutely no idea what they are doing let alone can spell FREIGHT, have absolutely no idea how to negotiate, and drive rates into the basement. Just say NO! I enjoy freight rates at rock bottom prices. I know that you cannot operate at those rates and its just a minute before you drive those people out of the industry. Problem is another person is divising a unresearched business plan to enter into the industry to continue to make the same problems for all of us.

Mr Elliot does not control the market, you the owner,driver,operator, and dispatcher control the market and the rates. Do you really think his "independent office" is walking out with a $2 a mile contract in the NE and brokering back out for $.90 a mile? No, I know 1st hand the competitivness of the rates in the NE. they might be fortunate to make $.20 a mile if not break even some days or even a loss. But is it not the point of business to make a profit?

It takes me hours of hard work, 16hrs or more a day of my time spent negotiating rates and chasing down loads that are profitable and worth our time. It's not suppose to be easy. But Im great at it. As I never have kept everyone happy, I do have 30 trucks that have trusted me for almost 8 yrs now, especially not to send them to the NE cause we all know theirs crap freight their!

Why would anyone go into a area that has depressed rates in the 1st place?

 

[fastrod]

Mr Elliot does not control the market, you the owner,driver,operator, and dispatcher control the market and the rates.

For that to be true the owner, driver, operator and dispatcher would have to be the ones negotiating rates with shippers. There not. The carriers and brokers are the ones negotiating the rates and they are the ones responsible for cheap freight. One of two things is happening here. The carrier or broker is offering cheap freight rates to the shipper to get their freight and then offering it out to the O/O even cheaper and making some money on the load or they are getting good rates from the shipper and offering it out to the O/O at cheap freight rates and making a lot more money on the load.

 

[JOHNCLARK]

Nope, Thats wrong, the buck stops with the person that says "Yes I will take it!". We get excellent rates, most the time. And we take losses to move a truck. But that stops with me. I dont care what the shipper or broker says. They better renegotiate or take a loss cause Im NOT moving unless I get P-A-I-D! The simple truth of the matter is. Why are you depending on brokers in the 1st place? The only reasons that brokers exist is because its the easy way out. Does Load 1 use brokers to move their trucks? NOPE. They have brokers, but do NOT use brokers. Agents yes. Whats not to understand about a broker? Its the middle man stepping on the load to make a profit. Go direct with the shipper to make the money you want.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

For that to be true the owner, driver, operator and dispatcher would have to be the ones negotiating rates with shippers. There not. The carriers and brokers are the ones negotiating the rates and they are the ones responsible for cheap freight. One of two things is happening here. The carrier or broker is offering cheap freight rates to the shipper to get their freight and then offering it out to the O/O even cheaper and making some money on the load or they are getting good rates from the shipper and offering it out to the O/O at cheap freight rates and making a lot more money on the load.

But Fastrod....the carrier/broker negotiates the best rate they think is possible for that shipper in that moment of time...they "offer' it to the O/O and IF they turn it down...The O/O does have some control of the price with a simple NO....and send the 2 parties back to the table...IF more no's were heard and the freight was sitting, the prices would come up....

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Holy crap....JohnC and I agreed....LOL....WTG John....

 

[Slacktide]

So, I ask you...where is the advantage to running a t/t under your own authority, doing your own billing and collecting, marketing, load matching and compliance? Yeah, you get to keep that other 25%, but your spending part of it and earning the rest by doing all of the work?

You sir, are running cheap freight!

Explain yourself better instead of making personal attacks. Could be more informative with your knowledge so we can all learn.

Well the way I read what Rocket wrote it seemed clear what he was saying. Lets see if I can say the same thing differently so you can comprehend it.

You are running a truck under your own authority all the while thinking you are earning and keeping more $$ than a leased truck would for the same amount of work. The fault in that logic is you are doing more work than a leased truck is. Using already stated percentages of 25% / 75% heres the point. Figuring you and a leased truck were both awarded exact loads, the only difference being the 25% for having your own authority. When all is said and done you likely made the same or less than a leased truck.

The reasons that is the case boil down to a number of things.

1: time spent getting the load. Leased truck 5min.
You far more monitoring load boards.

2:Fuel discount programs.
Carrier based tends to get better discounts vs independent.

3: insurance discounts
Same as above reason.

4: Lawyer retainer / law suits chasing money.
The leased truck has their money in a mater of days and need not worry.
You, could be waiting 30-60 days at best.

So the remaining question is what is your time worth? For many the reduced headache is well worth the 25%.


Sent from my SCH-I500 using EO Forums

 

[JOHNCLARK]

The parties renegotiate if they hear NO! But their should not be parties (plural) involved. It should be you and the shipper negotiating. Unfortunately your piers that may not be on the same level as you are the ones tanking the rates. This is expedite. WE decide what the customers and for some what the brokers will pay. Never taking advantage, but charging what is fair for the truck.

 

[JOHNCLARK]

Holy crap....JohnC and I agreed....LOL....WTG John....

We better take it easy, people might start to talk!

 

[fastrod]

But Fastrod....the carrier/broker negotiates the best rate they think is possible for that shipper in that moment of time...they "offer' it to the O/O and IF they turn it down...The O/O does have some control of the price with a simple NO....and send the 2 parties back to the table...IF more no's were heard and the freight was sitting, the prices would come up....

I understand what you are saying but the negotiating is between the shipper and carrier, broker or agent. If these parties were not so busy driving the rates into the ground just to get the freight they would not have to offer cheap rates to the O/O. I operate a van with my own authority, deal directly with shippers, make my rate high enough to deadhead home after every delivery and have never had a problem getting my rate from a shipper. Kind of makes you wonder if the cheap freight rates start between the shipper and carrier, broker, agent or between the carrier, broker,agent and the O/O.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Too many fingers in the pie...??? What JohnC said..deal direct....like you do...

 

[jelliott]

It is really just simple supply and demand of a market. For example if your goal is to average 1.50 a mile to a vehicle and you know the average out of an area is .90 than you need to be charging at least 2.10 going into a market. If you are going into any area you should always try and price accordingly knowing the backhaul market.