Government Sponsored Healthcare

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
From yours and Daves posts it sounds like more of an insurance company problem? Doing whatever they want cancelling policies raises rates with no controls or rules....this be close?

I do have to admit I can always get into to seeing my doctor back in Bison SD....had so many blood tests thought I'd bleed to death(joking) it's different to say the least....moreover a doctor is a doctor anywhere....it's just a different path thru his door.
 

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
Well what gets me is most of the people around here that claim they free government healthcare run around with 20 inch rims on their Lincolns and Caddilacs, have a mouth full of gold teeth, and wear the newest shoes.

It reminds me of free lunches when I was in school. The kids whose parents had to pay for our lunches and the "free" lunches got made fun of by the free lunch kids because we wore hand me down clothes and ragged tennis shoes while they had all the latest expensive clothes. They also always had money for sodas and snacks, we were happy to get lunch. We walked home from school, they rode the bus. We got made fun of all the time for the things we didn't have. My dad always told me the reason they had what they did was because people like my parents paid for it. Welfare ,imo, is America's biggest enemy. It rewards laziness. Nothing more, nothing less.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Yes it is an insurance problem but not a lack of insurance.

Look I can go into a lot of detail about the problems but the thing is we should not run to the government for help every time something is wrong.

In the case of Robsdad, I understand where he is coming from and know what he faces but his solution can make things worst because we don't correct the real serious problems and just hand over the problems to get covered up and never solved. Make sense?
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Just can't change tracks that quick after 57 years of one style of government. And at least two generations of Anti American family background.
I'll let that rattle around for abit and see what comes out! Thanks greg
 
Last edited:

Robsdad

Seasoned Expediter
I guess I am an odd ball when it comes to the way I think but here goes. I cannot imagine this country without some form of county healthcare system. Diseases would run rampant in this country. We all have incomes, can you imagine someone that does not. Where would they go for help. I for one have a heart, sometimes to big. But I do believe that it is the responsibility of this country to take care of those who cannot work and make their own way. What some of you are forgetting we go to the far reaches of the world to help other people. But you argue you cannot help at home. It bothers me some people think that way. I hear a lot on hear about the politically correct right wing and conservatism. I guess we can all turn our head over the things that have taken place in this era of corruption in the White House. The overspending pork project spending could have taken care of a huge amount of health care to all Americans. Over 350 billion spent in Iraq. THREE HUNDRED FIFTY BILLION DOLLARS.
Sorry people we need change and it ain't McCain change either. I have had enough of the holier than now Right Wing to last me a LIFETIME.
 

Robbvious

Seasoned Expediter
I guess I am an odd ball when it comes to the way I think but here goes. I cannot imagine this country without some form of county healthcare system. Diseases would run rampant in this country. We all have incomes, can you imagine someone that does not. Where would they go for help. I for one have a heart, sometimes to big. But I do believe that it is the responsibility of this country to take care of those who cannot work and make their own way. What some of you are forgetting we go to the far reaches of the world to help other people. But you argue you cannot help at home. It bothers me some people think that way. I hear a lot on hear about the politically correct right wing and conservatism. I guess we can all turn our head over the things that have taken place in this era of corruption in the White House. The overspending pork project spending could have taken care of a huge amount of health care to all Americans. Over 350 billion spent in Iraq. THREE HUNDRED FIFTY BILLION DOLLARS.
Sorry people we need change and it ain't McCain change either. I have had enough of the holier than now Right Wing to last me a LIFETIME.

That's it, I can't just lurk here any longer.

Mr. Robsdad, perhaps you should do some research on what Medicare and Medicaid currently cost you, the taxpayer, before you rant about the cost of the war in Iraq. 30 Seconds into a google search, I found that Medicare alone cost 440 Billion in fiscal 2007 alone. FOUR HUNDRED AND FOURTY BILLION DOLLARS. IN JUST ONE YEAR.

The White House does not put pork into spending bills, your elected Congressmen and Senators do. The President's only function with the budget is to sign it into law or not. 5th grade social studies class stuff.

I've read several of your other posts, and I'm quite happy to know that my service here in Iraq (I'm currently at LSA Anaconda, a little way north of Baghdad) is useless and stupid, as you've so plainly stated. You have every right to be offensive and ignorant, and I proudly defend your right to do so. If you had an opinion based on facts and numbers and not pure emotion, I might be inclined to give a thought to what you've got to say. However, all I can suggest is that you enjoy your Kool-Aid.
 
Last edited:

greg334

Veteran Expediter
I guess I am an odd ball when it comes to the way I think but here goes. I cannot imagine this country without some form of county healthcare system. Diseases would run rampant in this country. We all have incomes, can you imagine someone that does not. Where would they go for help. I for one have a heart, sometimes to big.

OK you not the odd ball and I understand what you are saying. I had no job in 2003, and I lost my health care at the end of 2003. It got so bad I could not even get a job at McDonalds because I was a 'tweener' - someone who is between college and retirement. I struggled financially, tried to reach out to places like the United Way (which I gave them more than I have made expediting) and got nothing but 'can't help you' from them. When I got sick, I did see a doctor. I knew how to deal with the doctors, I knew how to work with them and I knew that if they won't help, others doctors will. When I got into this, I didn't have health care and because of my DOT I found out that I was diabetic. I still saw a doctor and I still found ways to get my meds, so I know it is possible to do (the only thing I didn't do was see a dietitian for a lot of reasons). This is not the first time I was without insurance and will not be the last. This may be your first time without insurance but there is hope.

But I do believe that it is the responsibility of this country to take care of those who cannot work and make their own way. What some of you are forgetting we go to the far reaches of the world to help other people. But you argue you cannot help at home. It bothers me some people think that way.

I am not saying we can't help people, what I am saying is that we need to make sure government does not help people or more importantly get in the way of helping people. The government’s responsibility should be limited and not limit our abilities to provide help. It has to come from the people to the people in order for it to be real help. You know that the government make a mess out of everything and if we are allowed to help others without fear of taxes or someone getting sued, then there would be more help from the grass roots of the country but it has to start with attitudes being changed and involvement. I was one of those who went over to a foreign country and helped out but got to tell you that all I have heard from friends who worked down in N.O. after Katrina, they would rather go back to Africa - attitudes matter.

I am getting off subject, sorry....

Look the thing is that it is not just about health care but the entire bigger picture. I mean that the root cuase for a lot of this mess is taxes - yes here we go again.... no really it is and when you look at the complicated mess the government has been causing with just the Health Care Savings Accounts, you can see what I am driving at.

I hear a lot on hear about the politically correct right wing and conservatism. I guess we can all turn our head over the things that have taken place in this era of corruption in the White House. The overspending pork project spending could have taken care of a huge amount of health care to all Americans. Over 350 billion spent in Iraq. THREE HUNDRED FIFTY BILLION DOLLARS.

Ok I sort of agree with you, but here is the thing of you expect change with Obama or any other dem, you are going to be very disappointed. See Robsdad, they are all the same... I mean that it don't make a bit of difference who you think is bad, the other party is just as bad.

What era of corruption in the White House? you talking about the Kennedy era? the Truman era? the Clinton era? Oh you must mean FDR's era, right?

If you are talking about Bush, you have fallen into that trap of mis-information because this administration has been so scrutinized by the press and the dems that there is no a chance of being the anything but business as usual with the WH - I mean what they have been doing is the same thing all other administrations have been doing and it ain't going to change.


Pork? My God read how much some of the Dems put into bills and Bush would not veto a thing – and this is under a republican congress.

As for Iraq, you should be more concern about Social Security and the debt we have incurred with that program. You should be more concern with the fact that we will leave Iraq one day but Social Security will be with us for a long time.

Also you should be concern with the tax system in this country, forget about Iraq because unless we change our tax system soon, we won't be producing the revenue as a country to sustain our debts let alone our budget.

You should be concern with the government and their meddling with the economy and the stuff like lowering interest rates at the expense of our debt or a stimulus package that is being funded by Chinese money just to buy more Chinese stuff - I am told I am getting $1200 from the government but even though I am in need of the money, I will be writing a check to the treasury department to give it back.

Sorry people we need change and it ain't McCain change either. I have had enough of the holier than now Right Wing to last me a LIFETIME.

OK where is this change going to come from? Obama? Hillary? Not those two.. it has to come from you.. it has to come from you who tells your representative that they need to change or else. The president means nothing; he is nothing and until people get that we are going to be in the same mess all the time. It is the people who you vote for from your state that matter, Obama knows this, Hillary knows this and McCain knows this.
 

Robsdad

Seasoned Expediter
Mr. Robbvious
I am not ignorant. You sir are there because you chose to serve. You were not drafted, this is a career you have chosen. I cannot help it nor can you that your commander and chief (the ignorant one) chose to send you there. I would feel much more secure if you were home in the US to protect our borders. I and many Americans could really give a shi* about Iraq, Afghan or any other part of the world. You see our country started with nothing more than a group of people who wanted to be free. They banded together and won their independence, without the help of others. It is time the rest of the world learns to fend for themselves. I am glad you have read my posts and know how I and over 50% of Americans feel about this war. You see, what you read from me is how I feel and have no quams about anyone knowing it. I do not hide behind the bush (can't believe I typed a curse word on here) and lie to anyone for the sake of big business and to cover my daddy's screw up. This war is wrong. I respect you for going were you were ordered and doing your job. It is not you that these post are aimed at. It is the corrupt and ignorant White House, congress and 0 senate that sent you there. Medicare cost us $449 billion you say. The money wasted in Iraq would have went a long way to pay for that. I believe in taking care of your own. Not a towel head from sand country. Stay safe. No Kool-Aid for me sir. That is a right wing drink.
 

copdsux

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Should I feel guilty? Come May 1, I will be enrolled in Medicare. I have been looking forward to having this coverage available to me, ever since my hospitalization, over Thanksgiving, for emphysema. As you may know, this is a progressive disease, brought on, usually(90%) by smoking.

I quit 4 years ago; you should do the same.

So, in the opinion of EO members, should I feel guilty that I will be relying heavily on Medicare, & a supplimental policy to cover the costs associated with the downward progression of this illness?
 

Robsdad

Seasoned Expediter
No you should not feel guilty. You should be proud that it is something you are entitled to. After all you have been told your entire life it would be there to protect you. But for some reason the younger sect has been informed that theere will not be enough money there for their Social Security so they could give a shi* about the ones that have paid it in for a lifetime. It is not the older citizens of this country that mis managed the Social Security System. It was both parties elected officials that did this to this system. It was a well designed system. But our elected pulled an sneak attack on it. Never feel guilty for anything you believe in.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
You know many of us at my age know that SS is a slush fund and they have to borrow to make ends meet right now.

I do not mind people who retire, who are truly disabled and who need some help to use the system but I do mind seeing people my age (and a lot younger) using the system, like my brother-in-law, for no real true reason and I do mind people thinking that they deserve the money.

Most don't get the fact that most of the money is lost in the black hole of government management. I think that in the welfare system it is for every dollar that goes into the system, a person ends up with 15¢. With SS system, I read it is somewhere around 20¢ for every dollar. Can you imagine if we have real reform, maybe even going to a private management system how much more money would get to the people.

My solution is simple, replace the tax system with the Fair Tax, that will allow me to keep more of my money and invest it. It will allow me to spend more and let them collect more taxes. Let me decide on how I want to invest it without the worry of taxes or anything else. Keep the present system in place with age cutoff, let it be 1960 and phase it out. I have no complaints about the money going into the system, but I want to see it end without cutting people off.
 

Robsdad

Seasoned Expediter
Greg:
I agree about I do not want to see anyone cutoff. But if we as citizens fail to do something about the local state candidates we send off to the black hole it will never change. In Kentucky we have two Republican Senators. Both are pork barrel spenders. I hope someone will run against them that gets it. But none ever challenges them in the party so incumbent business as usual here we come. I hate it but what can you do when you have but two choices only one in you region. The dems have not put any one on the block that is a viable choice. I hope it isn't this way in every state but it sure is here.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Greg:
I agree about I do not want to see anyone cutoff. But if we as citizens fail to do something about the local state candidates we send off to the black hole it will never change. In Kentucky we have two Republican Senators. Both are pork barrel spenders. I hope someone will run against them that gets it. But none ever challenges them in the party so incumbent business as usual here we come. I hate it but what can you do when you have but two choices only one in you region. The dems have not put any one on the block that is a viable choice. I hope it isn't this way in every state but it sure is here.

OK, here is the deal - the problem of having life senators is called the 17th amendment. This is where the states lost the right to select their representatives. I used to be before the 17th amendment that the states selected who they sent to Washington, a form of a balance through the election of the state level representatives. This needs to be repealed because the states should control the senate and the people should control the states.

BUT there may be other means to control senators. Seeing my state has two useless senators too, Levin and Stabanow, we suffer a lot. Levin has done nothing to bring hope or help to our state, he has pretty much chased Bush about Iraq while he chairs the arms forces committee and can help us. We can recall him and I think there is one underway, it takes 30% of the vote to recall him and if I remember right he can't run for his seat until the next full election.

Also when you talk about pork barrel spending, I am wondering how much of your money returns back to the state?
 
Top