Democrats???

[LDB]

Three new threads in the loading dock very clearly show how incredibly bad the democrats and mainstream media are for our nation. Amazingly, even when it's so clear to see, so many are blinded by their hatred of Bush that they can't think rationally. Anyone who can read "Why high gas prices" and remotely consider voting for almost any of the democrats, and a few of the republicans has a defect in their information processing system somewhere. "A sincere thank you from the middle east" is another indictment including some members from the right side of the aisle as well. "A biker's story" is a good indicator of what to expect from the media. Yes, it's a humor piece, but it's not too far off from how those whose hatred of the right clouds everything they do. Why high gas prices? For the reasons already given in that thread and soon to be multiplied when Obama the great taxer, foolishly called changer, is elected.

 

[tallcal101]

Leo,it ws the media that did'nt have the b***s to take w on when it was obvious to just about anyone not blinded by their Foxy agenda that we were going down a the road to ruin.They rubber stamped the GOP elected majority in the Congress and the Executive for fear of being "unpartiotic". The press's obligation is to represent and report what is occuring,freely,and that includes putting patriotic fears aside,something you seem to have a problem with.

The bottom line is we got to where we are after 8 years of a failed GOP led disaster. Blame who ever makes you feel warm and fuzzy and right. Your guy led us to the brink,and no amount of Foxy blither about the media,about Obama or about Democats in geneal will change that.But keep at it Leo,I'm sure there are mountains of rational to support your scewed and very vived,imagination (opinion)

 

[Dleprechaun]

Three new threads in the loading dock very clearly show how incredibly bad the democrats and mainstream media are for our nation. Amazingly, even when it's so clear to see, so many are blinded by their hatred of Bush that they can't think rationally. Anyone who can read "Why high gas prices" and remotely consider voting for almost any of the democrats, and a few of the republicans has a defect in their information processing system somewhere. "A sincere thank you from the middle east" is another indictment including some members from the right side of the aisle as well. "A biker's story" is a good indicator of what to expect from the media. Yes, it's a humor piece, but it's not too far off from how those whose hatred of the right clouds everything they do. Why high gas prices? For the reasons already given in that thread and soon to be multiplied when Obama the great taxer, foolishly called changer, is elected.

Is the truth really so easy to see LDB? Because you apparently have not seen it yet. I agree with you that the mainstream media is bad for this country, but not for the reasons you think.
Chances are, your personal political beliefs come from the same mainstream media that you just denounced.
Both parties are the same. Their differences are only skin deep to make us feel like we really have a choice come election day. They are both part of and under the control of the federal reserve and the New World Order. If you are truly against the mainstream media, as you have stated, you should have no problem watching these two videos.
Aaron Russo's America freedom to fascism
freedom to facism - Google Video
And the real reason why gas prices are so high. Keep in mind that this was created well before our current fuel prices!!!
The Shocking Truth about Rising Gas Prices

 

[greg334]

Leo,it ws the media that did'nt have the b***s to take w on when it was obvious to just about anyone not blinded by their Foxy agenda that we were going down a the road to ruin.They rubber stamped the GOP elected majority in the Congress and the Executive for fear of being "unpartiotic". The press's obligation is to represent and report what is occuring,freely,and that includes putting patriotic fears aside,something you seem to have a problem with.

Tallcal,
Now stop that…silly… you’re sounding like a moveon.com robot…

The fact is that this country’s press has been the most vicious and vile press in the last 8 years than in the last 100 years and their hatred towards the president is noticed all over the world – maybe the real reason for the world to look down upon us?

If you want me to name off a lot of issues where they have been focused on tearing down the administration, I can but I won’t right now. However I will say that when the press takes it upon themselves to decide for US, the people what we need to know and not know at the same time believing that they are above the law by printing half truths or articles lacking facts, we have serious issues in this country. Even the NYTs with printing of classified secrets, it should have been shut down and the editors arrested, the constitution does not put them above the law and if we the people can’t do it, the press can’t either.

Remember that you look at things one sided, through the eyes of the 60’s and early 70’s where the press was the heroes of the country and sided with you on issues you felt important.

The other thing is Fox, (like your foxy tag there) seems to be the most balanced out of the media outlets. Even Hillary made the comment that they allowed her to speak without a deflection. Which brings me to remind you that the media is selecting the president for us, Obama is their guy.


AND the presses obligation is to report the news, nothing else. They are protected to a point that they are not to be hindered with the truth, but as I said they think they are above the law. The founding fathers never intended to have an institutionalized press that is a form of an exclusive club and like the exclusive ‘artists’ club, membership is only ‘granted’ by the standing member – the intent was to have citizens and professionals alike protected to print (or convey) the news to the people. The present traditional journalists have been fighting the citizen journalist to the point that some want to have laws to protect the institution - if you don’t believe me, you need to read what great journalists, like Brian Williams say about things. With this I got to remind you Tallcal that patriotism plays an important part but is highly ignored in this country – the oath a journalist takes is not to the country but to the world which is not right. The world does not grant them the right to operate, that is only protected by our country.

The bottom line is we got to where we are after 8 years of a failed GOP led disaster. Blame who ever makes you feel warm and fuzzy and right. Your guy led us to the brink,and no amount of Foxy blither about the media,about Obama or about Democats in geneal will change that.But keep at it Leo,I'm sure there are mountains of rational to support your scewed and very vived,imagination (opinion)

The bottom line is that you don’t see the bigger picture. CONGRESS is the failure, not the administration and you need to look at who is doing what.
The sad thing is you have fallen for Obama being the Messiah; the savior of the country but again being fooled is a hard thing to admit, isn’t it? I am not fooled by McCain (or Obama for that matter), I already know who McCain is, I wrote enough about the guy in the negative and I know what he has done - I am not a fan of his BUT the problem is unless you know what you are reading and can take an objective point of view, you can’t see what Obama is really all about. FOX news didn’t tell me who he is or what he has said (I don’t even watch fox by the way, I like the BBC which is really more liberal than CNN). I can pick out a lot of the socialist/Marxist/Leninist cr*p thanks to your good friend Lenin and his schoolbook of Marxism …oh and Marx and Engles and a number of others who wrote, acted and spoke just like Obama helped a lot.
Can’t change the leopard’s spots.
Sorry Dude, if you want to see a return of the Soviets and that style of government, just vote for Obama… go ahead make Lenin proud, use your vote to kill off the middle class and make us all poor …..subjugate all of us for the betterment of the few. . So you say he has a plan, read his plans, they are repeats of other plans in the past, even stealing from Bush, claiming that his ideas are better. What a great guy, stealing from someone you loath, says a lot about his character and integrity. WOW, great the guy has an idea, well stay a senator; introduce a bill and work to get it passed to prove that you can do something for your state first before you can do something for the country – which he has not done yet. Obama is the downfall of the country, McCain can be but he will not get far because of the hatred of the press towards anything republican.

 

[layoutshooter]

We have been heading for the "BRINK" since Roosevelt. Socialism is the curse. The current problems in the Middle East started back during Jimmy's rule. No president even came close to handling the problem. This one tried but had no idea how. We also tied the hands of our troops and stopped them from fighting. I know this, my son and nephew told me stories of not being able to return fire from mosqes. Stories about having to release captured terrorists because a US congressmen or senator said that they were on our side. Told stories of killing or capturing europeans from former Soviet Bloc countries. ETC. My political views come from no news network. They come from 20 years of seeing what really went on, not what you saw on the news. By the way, remember Slick Willies Peace dividend? When we gutting our military and intel services? Well, you reap what you sow. The weak are always attacked. As to change, there has to be a change, terms are up. We need the same term limits on senators and congressmen. Obama represents the old school socialism. Staight out of Marx,Lennin,Carter,Clinton,Reagen,Kennedy etc etc etc. Remember this so called conservitve pushed through the biggest socialist program since Medicare and Medicade. The perscription drug benifit. To have change we would have to have a REAL capitolist in office and in both houses of congress. Not going to happen. Obama will finish us off. You WILL lose all of what little freedom you have left. Mark my words on you calender. He WILL kill even more US citizens than the terrorist or Bill Clinton combined. I fear a civil war or revolt is that Hitler wanna be is elected. Layoutshooter

 

[layoutshooter]

By the way, I can and will back up anything I say. I will expose the lies told to you by the news media during the entire time that I was involved in the so called "Cold War". YOU WERE LIED TOO!!! Many good men and women died because of those lies. I am talking in the thousands or more. That is not even counting the millions killed by the socialists in Russia, China etc. And least we forget, there were thousands of un-warrented home invasions in THIS country during Bill Clintons rule. All looking for guns that he did not like. NO arrests ever made. The AFT broke into homes, ransacked them, then left. Layoutshooter

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Layout this is for you: From The Constitution Of The United States

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”

 

[LDB]

And yes...I am a Canadian

I thought I remembered you becoming a U.S. citizen earlier this year or is my mind playing tricks on me again?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

I thought I remembered you becoming a U.S. citizen earlier this year or is my mind playing tricks on me again?

April 16th 2007 I became a legal American Resident....I have to wait 3 years to become eligible for citizenship. By DHS rules I am not supposed to express my opinions if THEY deem them anti government or disruptive to America...They could toss my butt out for the above...nice Eh?? Another part of the small print in the Patriot Act. IMO this act is the most dangerous piece of legislation ever created and in the wrong hands threatens every Americans liberties and rights.
It is illegal to impersonate an American. punishable by up to 5 years in prison.

 

[copdsux]

OVM: Do the regulations list what actions would constitute "impersonating an American"?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

OVM: Do the regulations list what actions would constitute "impersonating an American"?

I'll give you an example, the night I was admitted to the U.S. and after a 2 hour process to stamp my passport and enter the info from the Embassy to the DHS computers. My wife jokingly said after the passport was stamped..."I finally have my little American" the officer closest to her tapped her on the shoulder and informed her of her violation and he could charge her for even hinting I was an American when in fact I wasn't....kinda put a damper on the whole thing...because regardless of what I said above I was feeling pretty proud to be here! I endured a lot of misery and frustration thru the whole process to hopefully be a future American and help this country be as great as it can be!!

 

[OntarioVanMan]

OVM: Do the regulations list what actions would constitute "impersonating an American"?

To answer your question....I think wearing a Democratic Party Pin would qualify!!!

 

[greg334]

I'll give you an example, the night I was admitted to the U.S. and after a 2 hour process to stamp my passport and enter the info from the Embassy to the DHS computers. My wife jokingly said after the passport was stamped..."I finally have my little American" the officer closest to her tapped her on the shoulder and informed her of her violation and he could charge her for even hinting I was an American when in fact I wasn't....kinda put a damper on the whole thing...because regardless of what I said above I was feeling pretty proud to be here! I endured a lot of misery and frustration thru the whole process to hopefully be a future American and help this country be as great as it can be!!

Thank you US customer and Immigrations for your rotten attitude towards citizens.

OVM, the patriot act is a complex thing but with other laws and acts, there are always something wrong with it. It has not taken one right away or caused the massive round up of people in the country. Some of the stuff in it, I don't only agree with but I promote, like when an organization is working with a terrorist group, they need to be shut down or then people come here and commit crimes, they don't need a trial to determine if they can stay but after they serve their punishment, they get deported regardless what their situation is.

There are other parts of the act that are being ignored, like the wire transfer laws and the banking laws - which both allow invaders to open up bank accounts, hold credit cards and to send money overseas in large amounts- all of which is slightly illegal. But the DoJ and the IRS will come down hard on people who take $5000 out of the country for vacation or to purchase something. I correct myself, this is where the patriot act takes our rights away by allowing invaders to get away with things we get scrutinized on.

Remember we have had pretty fair immigration laws in the past and at one time one didn't just appear and expect to be allowed to stay but rather one must prove that they are worthy of being here and being a part of society. We lost all of this when Kennedy proposed reforms to our immigration laws in 1965 and got them passed. Since that time, things have gone downhill and residency seems to be more of a right than a privilege.

My grandfather by the way waited 7 years to become a citizen.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Immigrants are supposed to add to our society not take away from it...I for one believe in strict scrutiny of potential new citizens...For some considering the country they have left, should be kissing the ground when they arrive!!! To be allowed into ONE ( hehehe) of the greatest countries in the world....

 

[layoutshooter]

Yes, that is part of the constitution, and yes that is OUR right. It has to be done the right way. By ammending the consitution. Not by the courts or just doing things cause you want too. Socialism has failed everywhere it has been put in, including Canada. It will fail here. It is deemening to the human soul. We used to play a really fun game in England. They were so used to getting things from the government that they would line up to get what was thiers. 3-4 of us would form a line, just stand there, and within a few minutes there would be 20 or 30 lining up for the bennies. I saw the restrctions on meds and med care. Get cancer over 60? BYE BYE, under 15? BYE BYE. Let us not forget the 20 years waiting list for hip replacements. I don't claim that we are the best in the world. We are better than any place I have been. I believe in self determination. NO man, NO government can rule or subject me. I was born free and I will die free. When you become a citizen you may say as you wish. You can now. Thanks to the millions like me that made sure that you can. Try that in China, Russia, etc etc etc. Obama is owned by Move On.Org. A vile bunch. Read what they want, that is what you will have. I only know what I know. In my 20 year career I saw the Dems do everything that could to destroy our ability to protect ourselfs. I saw Nixon, not the most honest man we ever had in the office, put in the most RESTRICTONS on the intel services to insure protecton of individual rights. To the point where we could not even do our jobs. OVM, if you want socialism, you will have to fight me. If you want the benifts that capitolism provides, that freedom allows, welcome to the club. You to can have the right to suceed or fail on your own merit. What a great concept. You take control of you own life. Do not give that control to the government. By the way, why did one of your prime ministers have to bring his mother down here for treatment that she would not have lived long enough to get up there? Layoutshooter

 

[greg334]

We tend to either forget the past or ignore history all together.

I see Obama and many in the congress want to control industry and every aspect of our lives. This all goes back far beyond Wilson with the influx of immigrants into the US from Europe who see a need to spread the same ideals that forced Europe to change in 1848. Not saying Immigration is bad but the thing that is a mitigating factor is the spread of ideas and concepts that even today are looked at as the enlighten path to a Utopia for most.

Even today, we have people like Maxine Waters saying "And guess what this liberal will be all about? This liberal will be about socializing--would be about, basically, taking over and the government running all of your companies." which repeats Wilson and Roosevelt's feelings towards the people by limiting and regulating commerce.

Below are some quick comments/quotes to ponder about and compare to today's candidates. These are all about the National Recovery Administration (NRA) which was for the most part the most intense legislation that regulated every aspect of industry in the country down to micromanaging content of food products and setting prices on local levels. If there is one piece of legislation that can be used to restrict people's rights, it is this one which pretty much made bartering between two people illegal.

"At this remove in time from the early days of the New Deal, it is difficult to recapture, even in imagination, the heady enthusiasm among a goodly number of intellectuals for a government planned economy. So far as can now be told, they believed that a bright new day was dawning, that national planning would result in an organically integrated economy in which everyone would joyfully work for the common good, and that American society would be freed at last from those antagonisms arising, as General Hugh Johnson put it, from “the murderous doctrine of savage and wolfish individualism, looking to dog-eat-dog and devil take the hindmost." -Clarence B. Carson, Historian/Hugh Johnson head of the NRA

"There is no choice presented to American business between intelligently planned and uncontrolled industrial operations and a return to the gold-plated anarchy that masqueraded as "rugged individualism."...Unless industry is sufficiently socialized by its private owners and managers so that great essential industries are operated under public obligation appropriate to the public interest in them, the advance of political control over private industry is inevitable." - Donald Richberg head of the NRA

"We seem to be a long way off from the kind of Fascism which Mussolini preached in Italy before he assumed power, and we are slowly approaching the conditions which made Fascism possible.” - 1936

AND

"The NRA was discovering it could not enforce its rules. Black markets grew up. Only the most violent police methods could procure enforcement. In Sidney Hillman’s garment industry the code authority employed enforcement police. They roamed through the garment district like storm troopers. They could enter a man’s factory, send him out, line up his employees, subject them to minute interrogation, take over his books on the instant. Night work was forbidden. Flying squadrons of these private coat-and-suit police went through the district at night, battering down doors with axes looking for men who were committing the crime of sewing together a pair of pants at night. But without these harsh methods many code authorities said there could be no compliance because the public was not back of it." -1944

John T. Flynn, journalist/writer

"I raise my hand in reverence to the Surpreme Court that saved this nation from fascism." - Governor Huey Long after the supreme court said the NRA is unconstitutional.

To me, and maybe it is just me but the rhetoric of someone who is called Obama reflects the same attitude and position that this country is a bad country and only the enlighten need to fix it. Like Obama, many of these people who were proponents of the New Deal and Wilson's dismantling of the constitution are a clear indication that we are not just voting for change but to return to a time where the government can't be questioned at all.

Remember that the words Planned Economy have popped up a lot in the 30's and again today it has been quietly talked about in a different form. What a planned economy simply is a socialist concept that the state controls the economy for the betterment of the people. The Soviets used it and look at their freedoms and rights. Remember in order for this to happen, you have to give up your basic rights and subjugate yourself to the state - sound familiar?

It was socialism in 1933, it is again in 2008.

VOTE FOR OBAMA - MAKE LENIN PЯOUD

 

[layoutshooter]

OVM, please explain something for me. I am not trying to be a smart *ss, I want to try to understand where you are coming from. Just why did you move down here? If you want Canadian style health care etc, why move here? You knew coming in that we did not have a socialised health care system. Just what is it you want? Again, I am not trying to be a smart *ss, I just don't understand. Layoutshooter

 

[OntarioVanMan]

OVM, please explain something for me. I am not trying to be a smart *ss, I want to try to understand where you are coming from. Just why did you move down here? If you want Canadian style health care etc, why move here? You knew coming in that we did not have a socialised health care system. Just what is it you want? Again, I am not trying to be a smart *ss, I just don't understand. Layoutshooter

To answer your first question about that PM....Because If you have the extra funds it's a freedom of choice to PAY for your own healthcare when you don't want to stay within the system. Is that not freedom of choice and self-determination? One can save your funds and get the care you want.

I knew and so did my wife (an American ) with resident status in Canada what we gave up....We didn't move back here for anything in particular and expect nothing in return...I..We did move here to improve our retirement situation, We had an opportunity to buy my wifes mother's place because the trade-off is it's cheaper to live in SD and retire then back east whether East Canada or Eastern U.S. Knew we had to pay for healthcare and that really wasn't a factor. I didn't come from an oppressed country or living in poverty. Hope your not ticked because I didn't come here to sponge off your system. We came here to improve this country...

I can't remember sporting a Canadian style system healthcare...just MAYBE some improvement on what exists....improvement as in not so confusing and all over the chart...But again just learning whats it all about I COULD even change my position om that as well....I read well...shooter...keep talking like Greg and my vote just might make your side of the table....the clocks ticking...less then 2 years till I can vote.

 

[copdsux]

I guess I'm one of the fortunate: My ancestors were within 50 miles of where I am right now in the 1740's. They came down the "Great Wagon Road" from the Lancaster, PA area.

No references, at all, regarding passports, or immigration, in any of the surviving family bibles, or documents.

Mike

 

[layoutshooter]

Thanks OVM, I understand more now. Please don't ever take things I might say personal, I just feel strongly about my freedom. A little backround on my family. I am only second generation in the US. My Mom and Dad where the first native born. My Mom's side was Chech and Polish, my Dad's Italian. My Granddad on my Mom's sides hated the US. He loved the idea of Comunisum. He hated his life, rich people, no chance to ever really make it in life. He died a bitter lonely old man. He had over $300,000 in the back and b*tched till the day he died about how the government was out to get poor people like him. How they should pay for this and that and why should he ever have to pay for anything. He rarely smiled. My Italian Grandad was the 180 the other way. He love the US, what a great place. You were allowed to do as you please. The Italian side would not even allow the kids to speak Italian, it was not American and we were Americans now. He was killed in a coal mine 6 months before he retired. He was a very happy man till his death. He had little money. I had 3 uncles and my dad serve in WW2. I had 6 cousins of my dad I never got to meet, killed in action, to give me my freedom. I spent 20 years serving. My son is career military, been to Iraq once, decorated twice while over there. My newphew is in the army. He has been to Iraq as well. He is up for a Bronze star for valor. Both of them want to go back, they know how important this fight is. They know our very way of life is threatend.
Maybe this explains a little why I get so gull darn mad when I see people who want to give away what has cost our family much. I have never met a happy liberial/socialist. They always see the dark side of life. I see only great oppertunity in the problems we have. What a great time to be alive. The chance to invent new power sorces, new forms of transportion. New drugs to cure/eleminate maladies. New ways to use land to improve everyones life. The chance for everyone to get ahead. Not the government do it for us. Layoutshooter