Will the USA survive Obama?

[aristotle]

What will America look like after 4 years of the Obama wrecking crew? This is the most radical left-wing politician to ever win the presidency. Add to that, he has liberal Democrat majorities in both houses of Congress. I fear the damage he will do will be permanent and irreversible. It's Hallelujah Time for socialists!!

Folks, we are at a fateful moment in American history. If Obamacare gets passed in any form, we are toast. Our economy cannot sustain Obama's grandiose schemes. Let us hope this mad stampede toward socialism can be stopped. After nationalizing the healthcare industry, what's next? Transportation?

 

[Pilgrim]

Apparently, American conservatives aren't the only ones concerned about the debt level in the US and other major industrialized countries.

"Société Générale has advised clients to be ready for a possible "global economic collapse" over the next two years, mapping a strategy of defensive investments to avoid wealth destruction."

Société Générale tells clients how to prepare for 'global collapse' - Telegraph

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Yes...the USA will survive...But probably not in the way you guys want it to be....the whole society is changing and confused...nothing stays the same...What you had is disappearing and morphing...in the next 200 years if you were able to come back...you'll not even recognize what you left behind...BUT then again maybe it'll morph back to it's roots...

Me?
I like the Constitution, I like less government and the right to self determination...

But big institutions have also proved they can't be trusted and must have some government controls....

 

[aristotle]

Yes...the USA will survive...But probably not in the way you guys want it to be....the whole society is changing and confused...nothing stays the same...What you had is disappearing and morphing...in the next 200 years if you were able to come back...you'll not even recognize what you left behind...BUT then again maybe it'll morph back to it's roots...

Me?
I like the Constitution, I like less government and the right to self determination...

But big institutions have also proved they can't be trusted and must have some government controls....

OVM... we are in much agreement here. America is changing with Obama's big push to the Left. Less government is better government. Once government seizes control of any aspect of our lives, they will never relinquish that control. In one fell swoop, Obama intends to bring one-sixth of the US economy under his control. It is the biggest power grab imaginable. Where is the outrage?

It won't take very long, at this pace, for America to become something almost unrecognizable. It is being reshaped in Obama's image. HELP!!

 

[OntarioVanMan]

OVM... we are in much agreement here. America is changing with Obama's big push to the Left. Less government is better government. Once government seizes control of any aspect of our lives, they will never relinquish that control. In one fell swoop, Obama intends to bring one-sixth of the US economy under his control. It is the biggest power grab imaginable. Where is the outrage?

It won't take very long, at this pace, for America to become something almost unrecognizable. It is being reshaped in Obama's image. HELP!!

It takes more then one man to do what is happening...
Clearly Joe Public is being very submissive for allowing this to happen...
as you said...Where is the outrage?

 

[aristotle]

America's autopsy shall read: Death by apathy. I am serious... the United States will not long continue in its present form unless there is a resurgence of individual rights. Respect for individual autonomy is all but gone. We must conform to government's whims or be incarcerated. Freedom. What freedom? We had a nice run for a couple hundred years.

 

[greg334]

But big institutions have also proved they can't be trusted and must have some government controls....

I absolutely don't agree with this. We need to go back to the regualtions we had and to apply the ones we have.

The big institutions should not be there in the first place if it has not been for the government losing its grip on reality. The cure is not to hand put more controls on them but to revert back to the system that was put in place that prevented them from growing BIG.

We would not have the Citi situation under the previous banking and anti-trust laws. We would not have the Comcast or the GE with these anti-trust laws and an FTC that did more than just be a bunch of talking heads to agree with each and every merger. We have a problem with our media and the take over of our media by the few would not happen when there were diversification laws in place that meant one TV station, one radio station and one newspaper.

The controls that are being talked about are nothing like what is needed. Just the home mortgage issue is one perfect example - the law is clear no lender is allowed to lend beyond the appraised value of the property but a large portion of the loans we, the tax payers ended up with, were based on 105 to 120% of the real value of the property when the loan was written and it is those loans we will never recoup the cost. Congress, the regulators and others seem to have helped with with this, both before and after the 'crash' by allowing it to happen without any accountability. The people, the FOO are making millions on these things and again because our congress are in bed with these people, they allowed another bad thing to happen - financial waivers that allowed them to retain stocks and be a part of the same companies that recieved money from us, the taxpayers.

 

[aristotle]

BIG government is a parasite that consumes its host.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

I absolutely don't agree with this. We need to go back to the regualtions we had and to apply the ones we have.

The big institutions should not be there in the first place if it has not been for the government losing its grip on reality. The cure is not to hand put more controls on them but to revert back to the system that was put in place that prevented them from growing BIG.

We would not have the Citi situation under the previous banking and anti-trust laws. We would not have the Comcast or the GE with these anti-trust laws and an FTC that did more than just be a bunch of talking heads to agree with each and every merger. We have a problem with our media and the take over of our media by the few would not happen when there were diversification laws in place that meant one TV station, one radio station and one newspaper.

The controls that are being talked about are nothing like what is needed. Just the home mortgage issue is one perfect example - the law is clear no lender is allowed to lend beyond the appraised value of the property but a large portion of the loans we, the tax payers ended up with, were based on 105 to 120% of the real value of the property when the loan was written and it is those loans we will never recoup the cost. Congress, the regulators and others seem to have helped with with this, both before and after the 'crash' by allowing it to happen without any accountability. The people, the FOO are making millions on these things and again because our congress are in bed with these people, they allowed another bad thing to happen - financial waivers that allowed them to retain stocks and be a part of the same companies that recieved money from us, the taxpayers.

You know much more about this Greg then I ever will..If it worked back then..I agree with ya...and my idea would be wrong.

 

[FIS53]

With the Fed going more socialist one thing you might see over the next 4 years is a thing called downloading. This is where the Fed takes some of the things it is responsible for paying and instead downloads it to the states. Then it'll take a larger share of some social program (such as health care for social security recipients). The states will then download some of their payables to the municipalities thereby allowing them to pay for the increase costs of the Fed downloading. The result is higher property taxes along with more user fees and other such goodies.
Rob

 

[OntarioVanMan]

With the Fed going more socialist one thing you might see over the next 4 years is a thing called downloading. This is where the Fed takes some of the things it is responsible for paying and instead downloads it to the states. Then it'll take a larger share of some social program (such as health care for social security recipients). The states will then download some of their payables to the municipalities thereby allowing them to pay for the increase costs of the Fed downloading. The result is higher property taxes along with more user fees and other such goodies.
Rob

Hey!! That is what Canada did years ago...It didn't work they've been backtracking ever since...
Mike Harris had the right idea but went overboard....

There are some services of government that aren't possible to make a profit on because well they are just that a service....Like say when Ont privatized the DOT as in road plowing and salting...for contractors to make a profit they cut services and the quality dropped..evem though the government had high paid inspectors the response time to storms is terrible.

 

[FIS53]

Mike never finished his thing at all. Never mind going overboard. He was right on with revamping health and education. Those two institutions needed a lot of reworking and cost controls. No OVM he was doing the right thing and stopped WAY too soon! I defiinitely liked the common sense revolution and wanted it to continue as we saw a lot of changes for the better!
Rob

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Overboard see post #11....DOT

I agree Rob...he took the old dinosaur institutions head on ..the vacuum of taxpayers dollars
..but as you say he weakened...

 

[FIS53]

As I said above I think the US govt is going to see the costs and do the downloading. It might be done a little differently than the canuck method but we all know something has to give in the coming years (only 3 left). So the Feds will be looking at ideas and the only other one is a larger tax base or increased direct taxation. That means increased income tax, increased property tax, increased sales tax and higher fees across the board for all govt services, facilities etc. Norway and Sweden are leaders in income tax collection with over 55% of your income going to the govt plus other taxes they pay it makes for a small left over income. Beware moves to close off taxable deductions in the coming years.
Rob

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Rob..they've sure dug themselves into a hole down here....These Americans have not seen the level of taxation that they are probably looking at...There is going to be some POed people around...

 

[FIS53]

You think so? hehehehe you bet! They're in for some surprises down the road, although I believe many are figuring it out and are trying to figure out how to counter. My third party idea is sounding better all the time!.
Rob

 

[OntarioVanMan]

You think so? hehehehe you bet! They're in for some surprises down the road, although I believe many are figuring it out and are trying to figure out how to counter. My third party idea is sounding better all the time!.
Rob

Rob...3rd party? These guys are set in their ways...a 3rd party scares the beejeevees outta them! But it would be the best thing since Sonny and Cher!!
They use the same old excuse.."it'll split the vote" Well DOH dummy..that is the whole idea! *LOL*