Big Truck I work on Hino trucks. I'll answer any questions I know the answers to.

[Ralf]

Hi Greasytshirt.
would love your input regarding my new to me second hand service truck. Previously had 2001, 6speed Hino with s05c, constantly overloaded at 5800kg, brilliantly reliably little bus, no race car and liked a drink but hats off for reliabilty!! Moved it on with near 400000km only servicing & one set of front brake pads and radiator top tank. Still not using oil or any oil leaks.
Bought 2004 hino so5ct 6speed, with 150000k one owner, in the first 5000km. i have had to dip in to my pocket for water pump, raditor, lift pump & set of springs & shackles. I am concerend about an engine noise (tap tap / knock knock). I have done oil analisys after 1000km and now again after 5000km since oil change = clean & good. The noise is mostly there but seems to change in loudness, some times more pronounced when under full load and hot (summer just started here).
Also noted when engine is cold and intially driving slowly at low rpm along driveway the engine ecu seems to siginficantly change / alter the engine note depending more so on throttle position ( does not seem to be so much load related). There is also a certain iregularity a bit like hunting but not quit, whilst this change of note is going on. If engine is cold / slightly warm and you run it at say 800 - 1000 rpm no load it some times runs in a sort of irrregular (not missfiring) pattern. I presume that the ecu is somehow doing this. I have had a couple of other mechanics have a listen to this but no clues. Another thing that i find a bit unusual is that, we have a slow steep hill climb which i take every morning, the previous truck with s05c would climb very easily at 800-1000rpm in first gear and respond to throttle increase.
This truck struggles unless i am in boost range say 1200 - 1400 rpm, if under this rpm then it will drop back just above idle and just manage to not stall. I am presuming that is due to lower compression in turbo engine and therefore less torque at low rpm??
My Weight 6500kg
Ps my first go at this forum and not a forum man usually.
Thanks re ralf

 

[tom]

Hi greasytshirt,
What a great forum.
We have 268 2011, using DXII. I don't see BCU besides other modules, so I assume it does not have one.
it has active p200c (we had DEF quality DTCs, replaced NOx sensors, then the problem seemed to be solved, but next day truck barely made it back to the shop with "too frequent regens" MIL, 10 bars of soot. had that number dropped to have it manually regenned. The issue was that I couldn't locate PDR out temp to monitor during regen. Data Monitor for ECU had only PDR (IN) temp and the one like exhaust temp before SCR (or some other). so I used these two to make sure its not gonna bake. So, had regen done and those to temperatures didnt go above 1,200F.
But afterwards I got that active P200C. Seems like no soot in the pipe.
I tried to delete max numbers in system protection data and did a reset for DPR related memory in customization, but active code is still there. As I understand it still has information somewhere in ecu memory.
can you please tell me how to delete this code. and maybe you can suggest something in this situation.
Also, we are going to order repair manuals at hino website. looks like they have a couple for every year and they are not cheap. what do you think would fit 2011-2015 trucks the most?
Thank you,
Tom

 

[Shawhawk]

Hello, i have 2011 Hino 338, i've been doing the manual regen for about 2 hours now and for some reason it wont stop, back then it usally take 30 min but this time it wont stop. Code that i saw is p141f. Please advice thanks

 

[greasytshirt]

Hi Greasytshirt.
would love your input regarding my new to me second hand service truck. Previously had 2001, 6speed Hino with s05c, constantly overloaded at 5800kg, brilliantly reliably little bus, no race car and liked a drink but hats off for reliabilty!! Moved it on with near 400000km only servicing & one set of front brake pads and radiator top tank. Still not using oil or any oil leaks.
Bought 2004 hino so5ct 6speed, with 150000k one owner, in the first 5000km. i have had to dip in to my pocket for water pump, raditor, lift pump & set of springs & shackles. I am concerend about an engine noise (tap tap / knock knock). I have done oil analisys after 1000km and now again after 5000km since oil change = clean & good. The noise is mostly there but seems to change in loudness, some times more pronounced when under full load and hot (summer just started here).
Also noted when engine is cold and intially driving slowly at low rpm along driveway the engine ecu seems to siginficantly change / alter the engine note depending more so on throttle position ( does not seem to be so much load related). There is also a certain iregularity a bit like hunting but not quit, whilst this change of note is going on. If engine is cold / slightly warm and you run it at say 800 - 1000 rpm no load it some times runs in a sort of irrregular (not missfiring) pattern. I presume that the ecu is somehow doing this. I have had a couple of other mechanics have a listen to this but no clues. Another thing that i find a bit unusual is that, we have a slow steep hill climb which i take every morning, the previous truck with s05c would climb very easily at 800-1000rpm in first gear and respond to throttle increase.
This truck struggles unless i am in boost range say 1200 - 1400 rpm, if under this rpm then it will drop back just above idle and just manage to not stall. I am presuming that is due to lower compression in turbo engine and therefore less torque at low rpm??
My Weight 6500kg
Ps my first go at this forum and not a forum man usually.
Thanks re ralf

Are you in Australia? Canada?
Does it have an inline pump, or common rail? I'm assuming inline. I'd start by checking the ENTIRE low pressure fuel system (the supply side) for debris, obstructions, or air leaks. Adjust the valves. Replace all fuel filters. Check boost sensor hose for leaks (or just replace it). Make sure prestige actuator on back of injection pump is not leaking. If no improvement I'm assuming you've got an injector going south.

 

[greasytshirt]

Hi greasytshirt,
What a great forum.
We have 268 2011, using DXII. I don't see BCU besides other modules, so I assume it does not have one.
it has active p200c (we had DEF quality DTCs, replaced NOx sensors, then the problem seemed to be solved, but next day truck barely made it back to the shop with "too frequent regens" MIL, 10 bars of soot. had that number dropped to have it manually regenned. The issue was that I couldn't locate PDR out temp to monitor during regen. Data Monitor for ECU had only PDR (IN) temp and the one like exhaust temp before SCR (or some other). so I used these two to make sure its not gonna bake. So, had regen done and those to temperatures didnt go above 1,200F.
But afterwards I got that active P200C. Seems like no soot in the pipe.
I tried to delete max numbers in system protection data and did a reset for DPR related memory in customization, but active code is still there. As I understand it still has information somewhere in ecu memory.
can you please tell me how to delete this code. and maybe you can suggest something in this situation.
Also, we are going to order repair manuals at hino website. looks like they have a couple for every year and they are not cheap. what do you think would fit 2011-2015 trucks the most?
Thank you,
Tom

It does have a BCU, and it has an active code. You have to sort this out first. Possible CAN error. Check connector at bcu and the bulkhead connector box on firewall for moisture and corrosion. Using engine customization menu, change soot amount to 2.2. start engine, connect to bcu, then you can see exactly what burner is doing (except for out, that doesn't translate realistically). You have a burner issue. Common causes are bad fuel injectors, sooted igniters, a clogged nozzle, or a bad flame temp sensor. Do not regen if soot over 8-12, have it baked instead.

 

[greasytshirt]

Hello, i have 2011 Hino 338, i've been doing the manual regen for about 2 hours now and for some reason it wont stop, back then it usally take 30 min but this time it wont stop. Code that i saw is p141f. Please advice thanks

There's a burner fault. See reply above this one.

 

[greasytshirt]

For both of you with burner faults: go to dealer. Get a flame temp sensor, an atomizer nozzle, and one igniter. Remove right fender. Remove igniters (spark plugs). One will be worn. Replace it. Clean the schmoo off of the other with brake cleaner and rag. Remove flame temp sensor. Take the big braided hose off and blow compressed air into the hole. Also blow out nozzle and igniter holes. Reinstall everything. Do NOT twist the little braided line going to nozzle or you will it up permanently. Use a backing wrench while tightening it to prevent this. If it still won't regen you need an actual diagnosis. There are a multitude of reasons they won't regen but these are the most common. Then have the injectors evaluated and replaced (all of them at once) if they're bad. Don't leave the exhaust brake on all the time. Use it if you need it then turn it off. Also avoid long idling. If you're idling in a truck stop all night you're gonna have problems.

 

[tom]

Thanks a lot.
We gonna do all of that tomorrow. Should have all parts ready.
Btw, when i was monitoring burner data, Exhaust Temp DPR Outlet seems to show inadequate signal (in a range of -495F - 1200F constantly dropping). I'll try to attache a graph. Is there a sensor at all, or it is faulty?
Also, how do you convert burner event log to exel. Can you share with that technic? do you sort it by event name and just have numbers graphed along trip hours?
Thanks again,
Tom

 

[tom]

 

[tom]

ok. I missed it. you already mentioned outlet temp.

 

[greasytshirt]

Thanks a lot.
We gonna do all of that tomorrow. Should have all parts ready.
Btw, when i was monitoring burner data, Exhaust Temp DPR Outlet seems to show inadequate signal (in a range of -495F - 1200F constantly dropping). I'll try to attache a graph. Is there a sensor at all, or it is faulty?
Also, how do you convert burner event log to exel. Can you share with that technic? do you sort it by event name and just have numbers graphed along trip hours?
Thanks again,
Tom

Those readings are because of a translation error in DXII. DPR outlet temp doesn't matter to the BCU, but it plays a role in fault detection in the engine ecu. There is a sensor. It's not bad. You can ignore this one.

 

[greasytshirt]

Thanks a lot.
We gonna do all of that tomorrow. Should have all parts ready.
Btw, when i was monitoring burner data, Exhaust Temp DPR Outlet seems to show inadequate signal (in a range of -495F - 1200F constantly dropping). I'll try to attache a graph. Is there a sensor at all, or it is faulty?
Also, how do you convert burner event log to exel. Can you share with that technic? do you sort it by event name and just have numbers graphed along trip hours?
Thanks again,
Tom

There's an excel macro that we use.

If you monitor an event and save it in .txt, I can graph it.

You want to graph the following, in order: Engine speed, engine torque, Burner inlet temp, flame temp, burner outlet temp, target burner outlet temp, atomizer air pressure, atomizer fuel pressure, atomizer nozzle pressure, burner state. Record the entire regen, plus like 30 seconds of it at idle at the end.

 

[tom]

Had all elements cleaned up yesterday. That's how it looked like

After cleaning a nozzle I sprayed cleaner through it and had it sprayed nicely through each hole, so I assume the nozzle is ok.

 

[tom]

Afterwards did a regen, saved process data as you told me in txt. I'll try to send it to you.
on the graph exhaust was already warm. but when SCR was still cold nozzle pressure was -2 then jumped to 45-46 psi and warmed up burner and kept it around 750F

 

[tom]

Can't figure out how to send the file.
But the bad thing is that there is lots of soot in the pipe after the driver got confused and took the truck for a long trip last week
so I guess we'll have to replace DPF
As for now there is still P200C present, although max out temp in system protection data is under 1100F (since we had it previously reset)
BTW during burner test I checked the spark as well. observed it for 4-5 minutes, looks pretty good

 

[greasytshirt]

Had all elements cleaned up yesterday. That's how it looked like

After cleaning a nozzle I sprayed cleaner through it and had it sprayed nicely through each hole, so I assume the nozzle is ok.

Generally speaking, it's not advised to tough the tip of the nozzle at all, lest one mash carbon into those tiny holes. During regen or Scr warm-up, 40-50 psi at nozzle is good. So you're good there.

750 during Scr warm-up is good.

You need a DPF, no doubt. Pull it out and make sure it didn't slide out of its can.

Those codes can be reset if you go to inspection menu > DPR check> reset all Dpr items.

Do you remember how high the max Dpr outlet temp got?

 

[greasytshirt]

Since you have DX...

Warm up engine all the way. Turn off all accessories. In engine diagnostic menu set data monitor for these items in this order. Engine coolant temp, engine speed, injection quantity. I think. First two items might be reversed. Do it twice for me lol.

Use activation test to set rpm to 1500. Start data monitor. Run at 1500 for 9 min. Idle for one min. Save to desktop, email to me if possible.

If graphing is an issue, look at rpm. How much does it deviate from 1500? Watch it closely. 1490-1510? Less deviation than this, or more? What is the injection quantity? Coolant temp needs to be at least 176 when doing this.

Edit:

Ignore deviation caused by air compressor tuning on and off.

 

[greasytshirt]

That amount of crap built up on everything is pretty normal..

If you've got everything still off, unscrew big braided line from the front of the burner. It may be stuck. It may even need to be heated with a torch to free it. Blow out the cavity in the front of the burner with compressed air. There's often a bunch of schmoo built up in here and it'll restrict airflow from the combustion air valve (CAV, on the other end of that hose).

Remove igniters, nozzle, flame temp sensor when removing this line so no parts get decapitated.

It's recommended that igniters and nozzle are cleaned every 75k, and the nozzle, flame temp sensor, and any igniters with worn tips are replaced every 150k.

If igniters are regularly carbon short-circuited, suspect bad injectors, excessive exhaust brake usage, exhaust brake set too high (important), and excessive oil from crankcase breather/worn out air compressor/ worn out turbo.

Sent from my XT1585 using EO Forums mobile app

 

[greasytshirt]

And tighten the igniters to 20 lb/ft. I see them under torqued frequently. The gap between igniter tips is supposed to be between 2.5-3.5 mm.

Sent from my XT1585 using EO Forums mobile app

 

[tom]

Had that burner cavity blown out with the air.
When doing injection quantity test engine speed stayed pretty much around 1492-1508 rpm all the time.
injection quantity was going between 8.2 and 9.8.

For the max DPR out temp before we had sys.protection data reset, it was in 1780sF

Also, checking exhaust brake adjustment, I had engine at 980rmp applying the trigger.
The result on injection quantity was 6.5-7.5 before and 15-16.5 after. And you said it needs to be at difference of 12-14
So, I suppose, we'll need to adjust that too.