gas vs. diesel

jg · Jun 9, 2004

Any significant differences in driving/maintenance expenses between
gas (GMC) and diesel (Ford) vans?? I've already calculated differences in purchasing price of both vans and types of fuel and assumed 5 extra mpg for a ford diesel. Figured GMC at 16mpg, Ford diesel at 21 mpg.
How about oil changes, filters, other maintenance costs??? Are the mpg numbers close to reality?? Thanks.

Glen Rice · Jun 9, 2004

Well here goes, everyone has a different opinion, and this is mine. I would buy diesel over gas everyday of the week. Fuel costs is only part of the reason. Maintenance, reliability, resale, cost per mile has always been in favor of diesel. The down side is initial cost. Can you afford the purchase price up front? I hope the answer is yes. Downside, always try to buy quality fuel, and carry extra fuel filters and filter wrench with you at all times.. And remember to religiously service that diesel on time every time. You will have years of trouble free service.. Best of luck and keep us posted what you decide.

Lawrence · Jun 9, 2004

I know Terry will have some facts & figures on this topic. I was always a pro-gas guy - I just didn't like eating that $5K upfront fee.

However, times have changed.

I think with current gas prices - that extra 5 -8 miles per gallon may quickly justify the extra $5K.

Lawrence,
Expediters Online.com

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tazman · Jun 9, 2004

Hi JG,

You better get your calculator out and check the batteries....

If you are looking at a 6000 V-8 Gas GMC vs. Ford E-350 with a Powerstroke.....16 and 21 are a stretch..................

The new Ford 6.0 V-8 is seeing about 14-16 with my customers ....
GMC and Chevy about 12 (loaded ?????)

No offense but...let's be realistic...

Frank in Pa.
"The Beast in the East"

tazman · Jun 9, 2004

Hi Lawrence,

I have a spreadsheet that I provide my customers on the time to recoup a diesel vs. gas engine....
I use 9MPG for gas and 12MPG for diesel....

Given today's prices and assuming a $4800 (Powerstroke or Duramax) upcharge for the diesel truck.....at 100K miles per year...you would break even on the diesel in about .57 yr or about 6 months !!!!!
At 50K you break even at 1.13yrs .....

This is a really good measure .....

Add to this the resale value of a diesels in 4-5 years (average life)
You are way ahead of the game...

Just my thoughts....

P.S. - I'll be happy to e-mail the spreadsheet to anyone wanting a copy...you'll need Microsoft Excel to adjust prices.....

Thanks,

Frank in Pa.

"The Beast in the East":

Lawrence · Jun 9, 2004

Tazman,

Very impressive numbers - yes, by all means please email those to me.

Also, who do you sell for? Go ahead and post it for everyone to see.

Lawrence,
Expediters Online.com

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davekc · Jun 9, 2004

Great information Taz. Gives the van owners something to consider.

OntarioVanMan · Jun 9, 2004

After my last tune-up and upping the tire pressure by 5Lbs My 99Dodge is getting about 14.5 mpg on the flats with no wind and about 500lb load. And keeping at 65 mph. anything over that and it drops to 10-11 mpg.
Its a 318. with just over 507,000 kms or just over 300,000 miles

pellgrn · Jun 9, 2004

I've had a ford e350 gas [5.4] and have two ford diesels 99 and 02 there's about a 3-4 mpg difference as taz stated,i would hope the 6.0 diesel would break 20mpg on the highway,empty,flat surface, and under 70mph.I use K and N air filters cause you never replace them,and change oil every 5,000 miles,can get better mpg with tires at 70 or 80 but it's a rougher ride and my cause a odd wear pattern on the tires.Would like to hear from the 6.0 owners or drivers,another thing for every 500 pounds ya carry in the fords you lose at least a mile per gallon,more if the weight isn't distributed evenly {2 skids better then one} and if you have a breakdown on the road with the diesels your limited to ford dealers and they only have a few tech that work on diesels,i have two diesels so that tells you what camp i am in

jg · Jun 10, 2004

Thanks for the responses. I drove previously and ran a GMC 3500 extended, 5.7L gas. It got 16 mpg after break-in, sometimes 15, a little more than 16 on the last few legs begore I sold it. I am not familiar with the new GM gas engines, nor do I know anything concrete about current diesel engines as far as mpg goes. I loved the GMC, have heard it rides more comfortable than the Ford, but with current differences between fuel/diesel prices, the diesel is tempting.
I hadn't thought of limited repair facilities though, so thanks for that reminder. Keep the comments coming......also, at one time diesel was more expensive than gas in some areas; any guesses if that situation will ever return?? Are oil changes as simple on diesel vans as gas vans? Do van diesels have same fuel gelling problems in cold weather as the "big boys" do? I know it's the same fuel, but don't know if van engines or fuel systems have any anti-gelling properties. I'd guess not, but doesn't hurt to ask. JG

pellgrn · Jun 10, 2004

I live in the Chicagoland area and only use additives if or when it drops below zero,the fuel has additives in it and if you get it from a high volume truck stop it's fresh,you can plug the van in overnight but i've only done that a couple time,i keep the tank fuel and change the water separator [fuel filter] every 4-5 months or around 40,000 miles,i have never had a gel problem.The trouble i've had with the vans are sensors,relays,and selinoids if you don't go to ford your just guessing cause nobody has the software.The engine is made by International and will run for at least 500,000 miles,but Int has no idea how to work on them cause ford has a monopoly on the software,i've been told this by two Int service managers,that was a year or so ago so things my have changed but your still gonna have a harder time getting the diesel running if it's not something simple.

Larry · Jun 10, 2004

I am impressed with the 16mpg on the GM extended vans. It is all I can do to get 14 mpg (I stay between 55-60). Watch the air pressure in those tires. It can really make a difference. When I pull my 14 foot cargo van, I get about 12 mpg.

Drive Save

pellgrn · Jun 10, 2004

If GM put the Duramax in there vans i would give there a serious look.

Twmaster · Jun 11, 2004

Just as a data point I regularly get 18 MPG in my Astro with my regular cargo load at about 1100 pounds by the end of my route.

I am looking at new vans again and am seriously considering a 4.3 V6 1500.

--
Mike N

tazman · Jun 11, 2004

Duramax scheduled for 2006 Model year...you have about 12-13 months before you can order one.

I understand this be mated to a new design Allison as well

Will keep everyone posted as I hear more details..
Frank in Pa.

"The Beast in the East"

tazman · Jun 11, 2004

Thanks for the green light on a plug for me..

I am Commercial Truck/Fleet Specialist (fancy title for a salesman)
with Fred Beans.
We are located in Doylestown Pa. approx. 30 miles north of Philadelphia...

Website:
www.fredbeans.com

I carry all of the Big three+ ...and we have dealerships located throughout Eastern Pa.

What I do mostly is consult customers on the right vehicle for their business..
I work with a variety of "upfitters".

Larry,thanks for the free advertising.

Frank in Pa.

"The Beast in the East"

P.S. - We deliver products anywhere East of the Mississippi..
Or I can drop ship from an upfitter near you.