van

GroundHawk · May 20, 2003

Hi guys I have a 1990 Ford cargo van 150 series.The steering is very hard. I replaced the power steering pump,but it is still very hard to turn,BUT when you jack it up the turning gets much better but not quite right but better----when you let it back down the hard steering returns--- Help Hawk

Weave · May 20, 2003

That sounds like a bad set of lower ball joints to me. If they haven't been done on the 1990 van, it's probably about that time. Check all the sttering linkage components too, especially the tie rod ends.
-Weave-

GroundHawk · May 20, 2003

This van has king pins I think,and I was told that if the king pins were bad that I would not be able to turn the wheel at all, I have work on many cars and trucks but this one is new to me. Hawk

Weave · May 20, 2003

I'm pretty sure the 150 van has upper and lower A-arms with ball joints, at least one I looked at recently did. You'll have to go under it and look. Even if it does have kingpins, they can cause that same problem.
-Weave-

Jimmy · May 21, 2003

Hey,
I just read your post. Is your steering collum adjustable or have a "U"-joint in it? If it does check it before going any futher.If it's a non-serviceable type ( no grease fitting) I'd go there first!
Your post brought back 20 year memory......LOL! Good Luck.
Jimmy

ATeam · May 21, 2003

The fact that steering remains hard even with no weight on the front suspension and steering linkage (if I take your "jacked up" meaning correctly) leads my thoughts toward the steering gear. It's been many years since I worked as an auto mechanic, but I remember being trained how to adjust certain steering gears. After I graduated from technical school, I never once made such an adujstment because steering gears rarely fail. Just something to check. Jack up the front end, disconnect the pitman arm, turn the steering wheel and see if it still steers hard. If so, your problem is somewhere upstream of the pitman arm. If not, it's downstream.

GroundHawk · May 21, 2003

Thanks guys I'm going to check all of these things. Hawk

GroundHawk · May 22, 2003

I haven't been able to get in deep with what is wrong with this truck but it does have king pins,and no it doesn't have a u-joint in the steering shaft. Hawk

Weave · May 22, 2003

When the van is jacked up, is there a noticeable difference in the steering feel when the engine is on with power assist and when it is shut off?
-Weave-

GroundHawk · May 23, 2003

When the engine is running.Just to give a little more in sight. Before it got this bad it would turn fine in one direction but a little stiff in the other,than as time when on it just gor stiff all over and it was sudden. Hawk

Jimmy · May 23, 2003

Hawk,
With all the descriptions you have gave I am led to beleive that your steering box is at fault.
1.Steers hard in normal driving?
2.With front end off ground it is only a little better.
3.On occassions it has "hung-up" to one side & takes hard effort to return to nuetral position.
4. I assume that you service it at recommened intervals.
5.If all above fit it could have some recirculating balls in the worm gear of the box that have galled & that could be your problem.
6.Look on top of steering box for a breather tube remove it & pour some ATF down the hole & see if it improves;If it does it's most likely the box.
Hope this helps. Jimmy

Weave · May 24, 2003

I would still venture on the kingpins first, they can cause a lot of screwy problems like that just before they lock up completely, and would be that steering system's most likely wear point on the 1990 model van if they haven't been addressed yet. What about the tie rod ends? Have they been looked at in the old van? Same thing. Possible, but like what A-Team said, I have never seen a steering box fail ever. Unless it were ran completely dry of fluid, it shouldn't fail, and it is a point that is not under any load or corrosion stress.
To save you some bucks and keep the van safe, I would recommend at this point to have it looked at by a pro who can actually see and feel the problem at hand, no shame in that. Good guess is the 13 year old unit is going to need some major front end work, but that is to be expected.
-Weave-

GroundHawk · May 24, 2003

Well guys I think I found the trouble.I believe it is the king pins. I had my grand daughter get in the truck(with it off of course)and had her move the steering wheel left to right while I got under the hood I could see the steering moving freely until it gets to a point than I can see the whole linkage assembly bine up,it is trying to turn the wheels but can't. Got to be king pins. This is my short run truck,only use it in the city. I'm trying to fix this thing so I can sell it along with by chevy I going to move up to a straight truck. Hawk

streetsweeper · May 30, 2003

Ford uses upper and lower ball joints. No A frames are involved. Your E150 uses an upper arm & a lower arm which attaches midway to the cross-member underneath your engine. It takes an air wrench driven C clamp looking tool to extract the joints.

Normally its called a jont extraction tool, most shops have them and make the chore of removal, installion much much easier. Other than upper and lower ball joints, the only other problem would be the steering gear itself.

having been away from fleet service in so long, Ford used to have repair kits for those. Things have probably changed in that respect.It was a major issue with their major fleet customers and may have been resolved.

streetsweeper · Jun 6, 2003

RE: van, My response above:

For some odd reason I recall the Ford econolines using twin I Beam not A-arms. The F Series pickups had them then so I'm thinking the van's had them also.

In one thread above, someone mentioned disconnecting the pitman arm and turning the steering wheel. Do that first then check all the tie rods, drag link, and finally upper and lower ball joints.

Leving the wheels on, use a fairly long pry bar, placing it under each wheel and pry up with a hand on the top of the wheel. If any joints are bad you'll feel the wheel moving up and down. Dont extert all you have to do it, just a steady upward pressure several times.

Or have a helper do it, while you observe the ball joints from undeneath. Use a flashlight or work light to illuminate them.

ATeam · Jun 6, 2003

RE: van, My response above:

Streetsweeper's ball-joint test technique is one I often used back when I repaired automobiles for a living. This thread reminded me of a tool I still own but nearly forgot about. It's called a dial indicator, made by Central Tools, Inc. Back in the day, I used it every time I diagnosed a faulty ball joint, tie rod end, or out-of-round disk brake rotor.

With this tool, I was able to measure the precise amount of free play a ball joint or tie rod end had, and compare it to the factory specs. To check ball joints, I did exactly what Streetsweeper says to do, only with the dial indicator attached. With the dial readings in hand, no customer of mine ever had to wonder if my recommended repair was actually needed, and I never had to worry about a customer, competing shop, or secret shopper, or undercover news reporter later saying I made an unecessary repair. I wrote the dial readings on the service order along with the factory specs.

That was about 20 years ago. Checking today, it was fun to see the company is still going strong under the same name, at the same location, selling the same tools. No price is published on their web site, but I'm sure the tool is expensive. It's a very high quality precision instrument. If you are in the business of repairing vehicle front ends and disk brakes, it might be worth buying. Otherwise, Streetsweeper's technique is more than adequate.

Tool photo attached

Central Tools, Inc. web site is:

http://www.centraltools.com/tools.html

To use the tool, you attach the modified vise grip to any sturdy vehcile component. Attach the snake to the vise grip. Attach the dial to the other end of the snake. Position the dial plunger on the questionable component. Tighten the snake to hold the dial firmly in place. Zero the dial. Move the component through the full range of its free play. Note the dial reading.

Then, in the customer waiting area, and hopefully in front of other customers, place the tool in the customer's hands and demonstrate how you used it in diagnosing the faulty component. When they return to their work or neighborhood picnic, you are likely to benefit from some word of mouth advertising.

GroundHawk · Jun 19, 2003

RE: van, My response above:

This van has twin I beams, I replaced the drag link it got better but it is still not right.When the wheels are off the ground its okay,I took the links down and the wheels turn e-z also.Hawk

Weave · Jun 20, 2003

RE: van, My response above:

Have you replaced the lower ball joints yet? That would have been the first thing to try, as they, along with the tie rod ends, are the most common wear points.
-Weave-