Figures and such

aristotle

Veteran Expediter
You may be overly sensitive to it. In any case, it's almost as distressing as watching the disingenuous unbridled enthusiasm displayed by many with the over-the-top fawning over our troops. It began with the returning soldiers from the Gulf War, the first major engagement since Vietnam, where massive national guilt had taken a grip so as to have people in this country make absolutely sure that returning soldiers did not experience anything even remotely close to what Vietnam veterans experienced. The pendulum swung back too far, can I get a yellow ribbon 'round the old oak tree.

And the fawning continues, because it's in vogue, it's all the rage, it's politically correct.

Credit is due where credit is deserved, and all soldiers deserve some credit. But they aren't as a group due the kind and level of credit that many people give them. To listen to some, simply by virtue of volunteering to wear a uniform, all soldiers are a pair of sandals away from walking on water.

That's not to say you shouldn't be proud of your son. You should be. We all are proud of everyone who volunteers to serve our country in the military. But we don't need any idealistic embellishments to build these people up to be more than they are. Like, we don't need to be told the Marine Corps doesn't accept slackers, whiners or stupid people, when we all know darn good and well they do. The military including the Marines are loaded with the same thing that's out in civilian land. Some are accepted, some slip through the cracks, some are dealt with, and some are put in the field of battle with a gun in their hand. And these same slackers, whiners and stupid people, regardless of their branch of the military, will be issued their own virtual sandals by the American people when they come home.

We absolutely agree on one thing however, that few if any people volunteer for military service because of the money. Everyone I know in the military, current and former, all say essentially the same things: they would do it for free as long as their families back home were taken care of. My cousin, who is a Colonel making like 10 grand a month, says the same thing. Not sure what his stance would be on Congress cutting out military pensions, tho. :D

We've had this conversation before. Almost verbatim. I view honorable military service as noble. Others may hold a different view. I find honorable military service given by young American men and women to be praiseworthy. Moreover, I believe they need and deserve our support. Again, no one is required to share my views. Where some see political correctness, others such as myself, see the patriotism needed to defend our way of life. Idealistic? Maybe.
 

clcooper

Expert Expediter
The true slackers, whiners and stupid people are hustled out of service in pretty quick order. Unlike your comfortable civilian life, in military situations these slackers are deemed a danger to their comrades. Some end up in the brig, some in the rear echelon and some sent home. Their presence is an affront to the stalwarts.

is that why there is so many contractors doing most of the military jobs .

and i was being smart when i said they didn't deserve that much .

i worked on the Army bases and i can tell you the Army is not full of MEN any more . i saw more street punks then i did soldiers . texting all the time and most don't even know how to do their job . i was working at a school the instructor told me he has to go to the gate to smoke , could not swear at all . and there is no more GIVE ME 10 push ups . but the student soldiers could smoke right out side the door . could month back and swear .
most people i worked with from 1 tour to retired from the Army . 1 or 2 were great people the rest were there for their pay check .

yes some that were or are now over seas fighting do deserve more but allot don't .

volunteer i would volunteer to go over there . see how much they make while over there. compared with what they make in any other place .

i volunteer for all my jobs the same way they do for the military . and today it is about the pay and about getting college paid for them .

most courts give young boys a choice either jail or military .

i worked with one marine and he was a great person will work with him agian . worked on one mirne base . the marine DOD workers were alot more friendlier . they showed more proud in their work .
 

clcooper

Expert Expediter
Most officers are college grads. 38k is low for a General:D

and which one is the one that is the real reason wars are lost or take over 10 years to fight

. is it the soldier that does what he is told . or is it the general that is college educted and is to know how to win wars that is the one that tells the soldiers what to do .
which one dies more . which one is the one that is getting shot at . which one is sleeping on the ground . which one is sleeping in a bed with a roof and 4 walls with heat and A/C . so whos life is worth more .
 

skyraider

Veteran Expediter
US Navy
and which one is the one that is the real reason wars are lost or take over 10 years to fight

. is it the soldier that does what he is told . or is it the general that is college educated and is to know how to win wars that is the one that tells the soldiers what to do .
which one dies more . which one is the one that is getting shot at . which one is sleeping on the ground . which one is sleeping in a bed with a roof and 4 walls with heat and A/C . so who's life is worth more .

*** I understand ur concern for enlisted men in the field and officers in the rear quarters. Many enlisted men die in war, been there to see it. Officers are not always in the rear , but they do make decisions based on data from the enlisted men on patrol in the field. Officers that make decisions in the command headquarters have to have some place sometimes to make decisions in peace and quiet using the overall maps to see where all the battles are and where he needs to focus, its not simple like they show it on a TV movie.

My nephew is a Captain in the Army in Afghanistan and is in the field and yes does do the door to door thing in towns and does see his men live and die. He is in full battle gear a lot. Is he scared, u bet he is scared, but thats what he is ordered to do from the higher ups. Unfortunately men die in all wars and I dont like it either. WW1,WW2 and so on were terrible. There are many many fors and against our men and women being put in harms way, Im glad someone stood up in WW2, what a mess that could have been if we had not done something to stop Hilter and MOJO. War is not good, it makes good men to do things that are terrible and not normal to everyday life as we know it . I'm an American and I approve this message.:D
 

clcooper

Expert Expediter
*** I understand ur concern for enlisted men in the field and officers in the rear quarters. Many enlisted men die in war, been there to see it. Officers are not always in the rear , but they do make decisions based on data from the enlisted men on patrol in the field. Officers that make decisions in the command headquarters have to have some place sometimes to make decisions in peace and quiet using the overall maps to see where all the battles are and where he needs to focus, its not simple like they show it on a TV movie.

My nephew is a Captain in the Army in Afghanistan and is in the field and yes does do the door to door thing in towns and does see his men live and die. He is in full battle gear a lot. Is he scared, u bet he is scared, but thats what he is ordered to do from the higher ups. Unfortunately men die in all wars and I dont like it either. WW1,WW2 and so on were terrible. There are many many fors and against our men and women being put in harms way, Im glad someone stood up in WW2, what a mess that could have been if we had not done something to stop Hilter and MOJO. War is not good, it makes good men to do things that are terrible and not normal to everyday life as we know it . I'm an American and I approve this message.:D

Officers went to college
enlisted did not

so answer which human life is worth less ??
the one that went to college or the one that didnt ??

i agree that they need to make decisions in peace and quiet .

i asked why is the ones that sleep on the ground not worth more pay then the ones that sleep in a bed .
enlisted soldier makes a bad decision . who can lose their life ??
Officers makes a bad decision. who can lose their life ??
 
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