A. Blair
- Thread starter Oilerman1957
- Start date
- Status
I find it arrogant, pompous and highly presumptuous that someone thinks they can make judgment on everything from how much you paid the dealer for the truck to how well you want to insulate the vehicle to just how Spartan you want to live while on the road, and then can make a determination on what rate at which you can be profitable. Don't get me started on double-dipping for so much as a penny less than double rates, especially in an expedited, exclusive use of the truck area of the industry. "You can haul one load for $1, or will give you a bonus and you can haul two loads at the same time with twice the risk and responsibility for $1.60!" Yay. <snort>
Yeah, sure, you won't lose money directly out of your pocket running for 65 cents in a van, and with more miles per week you'll have more revenue. At the same time, roughly 20 cents per mile, every mile, fails to go into your pocket. Do the math. There's profitable and then there's profitable. (Somebody's making a profit at 65 cents, but it ain't the steering wheel holder, that's for sure.) I'd much rather run 2000 miles at 85 cents than 3000 miles at 65 cents. The 3000 miles at 65 cents yields $250 more in gross revenue than the higher rate, but it's a mistake to look at that alone. The extra $250 didn't magically make your cost per mile any less. If anything, the extra miles raised your CPM in additional maintenance alone.
Why do I have the feeling that only looking at the gross revenue is hit long at hard at some carriers? It's like at one unnamed carrier in particular where they hammer hard it's not about the deadhead it's all about getting to that next load, that gross revenue, and people come out of orientation believing that crap.
Everyone's cost per mile will be different, but looking at it realistically, other than your actual CPM, do you want to get paid anything? Whatever the rate, the driver should be able to get paid roughly 40% of the load for their efforts. At 65 cents a mile, that's 26 cents a mile. If someone offered me a driving job for 26 cents a mile I'd think they were kidding (although that's what new hires at Werner get paid to start). Yeah, you can live on 26 cents a mile, survive mostly, but it will get you nowhere unless it's a stepping stone to a raise like you get with Werner.
A more reasonable rate is 32 cents a mile, which at 40% works out to 80 cents a mile for a rate. Aything above 80 cents goes into the bank for unexpected major repairs or towards a new vehicle. Any major unexpected repairs at 65 cents a mile and you're screwed, regardless of how many 3000 mile weeks you get.
Another way to look at it is, let's say your CPM in a van is 40 cents a mile (not including what you'd pay yourself per mile). At 65 cents, you're gonna make a profit, yes indeed, 25 cents per mile (that's your own personal pay per mile). And you'll make 25 cents a mile at 1500 miles, 2000 miles, and 3000 miles. So, you want lots and lots of miles. Gotta buy new shoes, and new tires, somehow. 3000 miles clearing 25 cents a mile is $750. Lots of money.
At 85 cents a mile, you clear 45 cents a mile with a 40 cent CPM. Just 1666 miles at 45 cents clears you the same $750. Whoops. So much for more miles at less money in order to make more money. Pay yourself 32 cents a mile of it and you have 13 cents per mile left over to go into the bank. And you won't have the higher percentage of maintenance and repair costs that rises with more miles. More miles makes your CPM go down on the surface at first glance, but your maintenance and repair costs will go up at a graduating percentage (anywhere from 10-20% as you approach 100,000, in a Sprinter).
Lots and lots of miles at 65 cents a mile you're a Tribble gorging yourself on a seemingly unlimited supply grain, but devoid of nutrients. Good luck with that.
herronryan
Seasoned Expediter
know what? i was scared of making .65 cpm too when i signed on with them. but i am soooo glad i did! you ignorant people can slam a blair all you want because you dont know. i know so i am not worried. the cats used to pay me squat! now i feel like i can actually take care of my family. no deadhead and no minis! this is friggin awesome. my average load is like 700 miles and they do not swap! ahaaaa! no lies also. there is just a lot of griping that goes on in this business about stuff you have no clue about. it always has been and always will be because you have some drivers out there that are not succeeding so they dont want anyone else to succeed. this job is not half as much as what your cents per mile is as it is how well you manage your money while on the road. to be truthful, a few weeks ago i was sitting on a beach in the south pacific with my wife. we were on vacation for 2 weeks across asia. wanna know why we went? because we could afford it! why could we afford it? because this company pays me well for what i am skilled at. im telling you people a. blair is the way to go but there are still minds that will always tell you otherwise.
How long you been in the business? let me a Ignorant Person explain something to ya.
1) A.Blair to me is a Bottom Feeder and part of the problem in the business today
2) your happy with 65 cpm. that makes you a bottom feeder and also part of the problem
and the Ignorant People Here have a deep well of knowledge, You would be the Ignorant one for not dipping into that well.
your more than welcome to stop by my house anytime and I'll be happy to show you what my success has allowed me to have. and it wasn't on 65. cpm
EdwinDavis
Seasoned Expediter
I also work for A.Blair.I have worked for panther & Bolt in the past and could make enough money. Because of sitting and waiting on loads and to many deadhead miles. Now I do not sit as much and get plenty of miles.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
I wonder if I can pay my tax bill in miles. 
I'll say it again, the "more miles didn't magically make your cost per mile less." Cost Per Mile and Revenue Per Mile is everything in this business. It's not how much you make, it's how much you keep, or how much you are willing to give up. If all you look at is all them miles, you cannot see the forest for the trees, you're not looking at the big picture. You're ignoring long term success for the short term instant gratification, and it's a fantasy. The math of the long term big picture is brutal and unrelenting. Every mile you drive at 65 cents you are willingly giving up between 15 and 25 cents per mile, each and every relentless mile. That's a lot of money, to the point of being brutal. 100,000 loaded and you've short-changed yourself twenty grand, probably more.
TJ959
Veteran Expediter
It seems to me that the whole point is return on investment. What you get for the investment of money in your equipment and your time. If someone were to ask you to work 70 hours a week and live in a tin can with no insulation and no heat for minimum wage or less you'd call him a slave driver or worse. Why would you do the same thing to yourself and be happy about it? Why would you live that way? Why would you believe that wanting to stay warm and rested and have a decent life is frivolous? If you are to run smart and be profitable under this formulae, you must live poorer than the average welfare recipient while on the job. The government isn't going to take care of you because you are self employed. You don't even qualify for unemployment if you fail. All you have done is bought yourself a low paying job with long hours and no benefits.
I must be nuts because I always thought if you risk capital you should expect a certain amount of return on investment for that risk. To my mind, that's being a smart businessman. A company has every right to offer any pay or percentage they wish and it's up to us to accept or decline as business people. There are good business people and bad business people. You decide who they are.
I have also felt that to be safe and efficient on the road you should have a certain amount of comfort. Comfort is also important for personal morale, self esteem, and job satisfaction. No one is going to tell me that insulation and heat are frivolous. There is a good reason why most third world countries are in warm climates. They can't afford heat. The low end van driver is better off in Panama.You won't be working smart if weather causes you to spend money on motel rooms. Yes, your comforts reduce payload and space and you do need to be smart about your choices but it can be done. I had my comforts and I could haul three skids at 3000+lbs in my sprinter. I don't need someone who goes home every night to his house telling me how to run smart.....I gotta stop here and vent the steam out of my ears... This has got to be my longest post ever..... I'll get off my soap box now.
I must be nuts because I always thought if you risk capital you should expect a certain amount of return on investment for that risk. To my mind, that's being a smart businessman. A company has every right to offer any pay or percentage they wish and it's up to us to accept or decline as business people. There are good business people and bad business people. You decide who they are.
I have also felt that to be safe and efficient on the road you should have a certain amount of comfort. Comfort is also important for personal morale, self esteem, and job satisfaction. No one is going to tell me that insulation and heat are frivolous. There is a good reason why most third world countries are in warm climates. They can't afford heat. The low end van driver is better off in Panama.You won't be working smart if weather causes you to spend money on motel rooms. Yes, your comforts reduce payload and space and you do need to be smart about your choices but it can be done. I had my comforts and I could haul three skids at 3000+lbs in my sprinter. I don't need someone who goes home every night to his house telling me how to run smart.....I gotta stop here and vent the steam out of my ears... This has got to be my longest post ever..... I'll get off my soap box now.
Tom Robertson
Veteran Expediter
Ok… let’s try this again.
My previous post was supposed to create a positive message that our industry APPREARS to be rebounding in today’s uncertain economy, and to respond to misinformation regarding A. Blair Enterprises.
I’ll try again…
Every company and driver in the expedited industry has been adversely affected by the state of our economy. Carriers responded to the downturn in a variety of ways, all of which affected you in one manner or another. Most of you have had fewer runs at reduced rates per mile. Some of you have been cheated out of miles and others out of weeks of pay. Many of you are thinking you have a 1200 mile run only to be flagged down and instructed to pass the freight to another vehicle. Again, all of us have taken a hit in one way or another.
If you are making the same rates per mile you were making in 2005 then consider yourself one of the few. If you can afford to eat out every day and night consider yourself one very lucky person. It amazes me that some of you claim to make rates that are equal to or greater than 2005, while others from your company have been offered rates as low as 40 cents per mile. Why the discrepancies? We have drivers from every major and many smaller companies working with us. I have seen the rates that are being paid, the deductions that are occurring (legit and “mystery” deductions) and the amount of deadhead between point of delivery and the next pickup. The only real measure is in your profit per mile. Many of you think you are making more than you really make.
I’ve seen discussions on this site about devices to increase your fuel economy. All vans show highway mileage is 4 or 5 miles per gallon higher for highway mileage. Large trucks fuel economy will increase by 2 or more miles per gallon on the highway. Because of the lengths of our average runs, our drivers have less than 5% city driving. How much less per mile would you spend if you could attain the same percentage? The same logic holds true for deadhead miles…If you have to drive 100 miles to your next pickup off a 400 mile run, your percentage of deadhead is twice that of a 800 mile run. Working smarter…not harder!
I speak to you in generalities…if it doesn’t apply to you…it wasn’t directed to you.
Turtle…
Why are you taking this so personally? The statements I make are not directed toward you. Perhaps you paid less than I did for the same truck…but from my experience I know that most are paying a lot more. davekc and I had conversations about this many years ago, and determined that since most drivers buy a truck only once or twice every few years, their lack of knowledge usually leads them into mistakes in equipment, sizing issues and most of the time, a price tag that is greater than someone who has purchased many trucks over many years. I do not intend to be “arrogant, pompous and highly presumptuous” and experience backs up my statements. davekc and I know for a fact that we have purchased trucks in the pasts for thousands less than others.
fastman1…
Your statement “A.Blair to me is a Bottom Feeder and part of the problem in the business today” borders on libel.
Use caution when speaking of my company in this manner.
Let’s understand a little known fact. The companies you drive for are as much to blame as any other expedited company in the industry. There are a limited number of shipments available and all of us compete for the same loads. When the number of trucks in a specific area greatly outnumber the available loads…bidding wars begin. We have ways of knowing who gets many of these loads, and many times we loose freight to major carriers at rates below our minimum acceptable rate. Perhaps you have never been offered a load at a discount rate…but someone in your company is accepting them!
We rarely bid on shipments having less than 500 miles…and when we do, it is either to reposition to a better area or at the driver’s request to go to a specific area (usually home).
Longer runs invite more competition. More competition means lower rates; it also means better fuel economy, and less wear and tear on components like brakes and tires.
TJ959…
Nice rave! It’s amazing how some of you can go nuts over one small topic or two. I did not imply that you should not have insulation in your van…I am saying that your insulation should not be 4” thick and reduce the clearance to under 48”.
“There is a good reason why most third world countries are in warm climates. They can't afford heat.”
Just when I thought I had heard everything! Truly an EO Classic Quote! Just one question…Where would those countries move if they became more affluent? LOLOLOL!!!!!!
Tennesseahawk… my number one heckler… let’s talk some more about Pilot hot dogs!
The bottom line is this…
There have been 3 or four of our drivers respond to this thread. All of them are telling you that you are not seeing the whole picture, and most of you are still telling them how wrong they are. Our system has proven profitable for our owner operators and most would not consider working anywhere else.
If you are happy where you are…stay there, but don’t pretend to understand something you have not experienced, and stop badmouthing a system that works for a lot of others. I am not trying to convince you to change religions…I am not asking you to abandon your business plans or work ethics. The most important lesson one can learn in life is simply…”JUST BECAUSE IT’S DIFFERENT, DOESN’T MAKE IT WRONG”... we may not be right for you…but we are a great option for most of those who give us the opportunity.
After taking major hits for over a year, in April of 2009 we discontinued paying a FSC to our drivers, based on our inability to remain profitable at the rates we were able to attain. We were able to make adjustments to our system and a short five months later the FSC’s have been re-instated. Our straight trucks can now make up to $1.60 per mile! We are no longer paying only a flat buck per mile. For the first time in our 25 year history, we began signing on vans and Sprinters in May of this year. They too ran without a fuel surcharge until now. FSC’s for vans can raise their pay to 1.10 cpm.
So… Straight trucks …up to $1.60 per mile Vans and Sprinters up to $1.10 per mile.
I find it interesting that the only positive responses are from those who are driving for A. Blair Enterprises.
My previous post was supposed to create a positive message that our industry APPREARS to be rebounding in today’s uncertain economy, and to respond to misinformation regarding A. Blair Enterprises.
I’ll try again…
Every company and driver in the expedited industry has been adversely affected by the state of our economy. Carriers responded to the downturn in a variety of ways, all of which affected you in one manner or another. Most of you have had fewer runs at reduced rates per mile. Some of you have been cheated out of miles and others out of weeks of pay. Many of you are thinking you have a 1200 mile run only to be flagged down and instructed to pass the freight to another vehicle. Again, all of us have taken a hit in one way or another.
If you are making the same rates per mile you were making in 2005 then consider yourself one of the few. If you can afford to eat out every day and night consider yourself one very lucky person. It amazes me that some of you claim to make rates that are equal to or greater than 2005, while others from your company have been offered rates as low as 40 cents per mile. Why the discrepancies? We have drivers from every major and many smaller companies working with us. I have seen the rates that are being paid, the deductions that are occurring (legit and “mystery” deductions) and the amount of deadhead between point of delivery and the next pickup. The only real measure is in your profit per mile. Many of you think you are making more than you really make.
I’ve seen discussions on this site about devices to increase your fuel economy. All vans show highway mileage is 4 or 5 miles per gallon higher for highway mileage. Large trucks fuel economy will increase by 2 or more miles per gallon on the highway. Because of the lengths of our average runs, our drivers have less than 5% city driving. How much less per mile would you spend if you could attain the same percentage? The same logic holds true for deadhead miles…If you have to drive 100 miles to your next pickup off a 400 mile run, your percentage of deadhead is twice that of a 800 mile run. Working smarter…not harder!
I speak to you in generalities…if it doesn’t apply to you…it wasn’t directed to you.
Turtle…
Why are you taking this so personally? The statements I make are not directed toward you. Perhaps you paid less than I did for the same truck…but from my experience I know that most are paying a lot more. davekc and I had conversations about this many years ago, and determined that since most drivers buy a truck only once or twice every few years, their lack of knowledge usually leads them into mistakes in equipment, sizing issues and most of the time, a price tag that is greater than someone who has purchased many trucks over many years. I do not intend to be “arrogant, pompous and highly presumptuous” and experience backs up my statements. davekc and I know for a fact that we have purchased trucks in the pasts for thousands less than others.
fastman1…
Your statement “A.Blair to me is a Bottom Feeder and part of the problem in the business today” borders on libel.
Use caution when speaking of my company in this manner.
Let’s understand a little known fact. The companies you drive for are as much to blame as any other expedited company in the industry. There are a limited number of shipments available and all of us compete for the same loads. When the number of trucks in a specific area greatly outnumber the available loads…bidding wars begin. We have ways of knowing who gets many of these loads, and many times we loose freight to major carriers at rates below our minimum acceptable rate. Perhaps you have never been offered a load at a discount rate…but someone in your company is accepting them!
We rarely bid on shipments having less than 500 miles…and when we do, it is either to reposition to a better area or at the driver’s request to go to a specific area (usually home).
Longer runs invite more competition. More competition means lower rates; it also means better fuel economy, and less wear and tear on components like brakes and tires.
TJ959…
Nice rave! It’s amazing how some of you can go nuts over one small topic or two. I did not imply that you should not have insulation in your van…I am saying that your insulation should not be 4” thick and reduce the clearance to under 48”.
“There is a good reason why most third world countries are in warm climates. They can't afford heat.”
Just when I thought I had heard everything! Truly an EO Classic Quote! Just one question…Where would those countries move if they became more affluent? LOLOLOL!!!!!!
Tennesseahawk… my number one heckler… let’s talk some more about Pilot hot dogs!
The bottom line is this…
There have been 3 or four of our drivers respond to this thread. All of them are telling you that you are not seeing the whole picture, and most of you are still telling them how wrong they are. Our system has proven profitable for our owner operators and most would not consider working anywhere else.
If you are happy where you are…stay there, but don’t pretend to understand something you have not experienced, and stop badmouthing a system that works for a lot of others. I am not trying to convince you to change religions…I am not asking you to abandon your business plans or work ethics. The most important lesson one can learn in life is simply…”JUST BECAUSE IT’S DIFFERENT, DOESN’T MAKE IT WRONG”... we may not be right for you…but we are a great option for most of those who give us the opportunity.
After taking major hits for over a year, in April of 2009 we discontinued paying a FSC to our drivers, based on our inability to remain profitable at the rates we were able to attain. We were able to make adjustments to our system and a short five months later the FSC’s have been re-instated. Our straight trucks can now make up to $1.60 per mile! We are no longer paying only a flat buck per mile. For the first time in our 25 year history, we began signing on vans and Sprinters in May of this year. They too ran without a fuel surcharge until now. FSC’s for vans can raise their pay to 1.10 cpm.
So… Straight trucks …up to $1.60 per mile Vans and Sprinters up to $1.10 per mile.
I find it interesting that the only positive responses are from those who are driving for A. Blair Enterprises.
I can't speak directly to the van rate at 65 cents, but I can on the straights. Just not that intimate on the costs and ownership of the vans. I believe some interpret this thread as bashing, and that isn't my directive.
I am trying to figure out if the wheel has been reinvented, and if there is a way to operate a straight consistently at a dollar mile and actually turn a profit.
Make no mistake, we have hauled for a dollar a mile before, but it was a brokered job just to get out of the northwest.
It covered the drivers wage, fuel, and fixed costs, but that is about it.
If just using a a flat dollar per mile, we are running way ahead of that rate. But we don't have 7 percent deadhead. More like double that number with some of it marginally paid.
I don't see over a say a three year projected period of time, this could be done on a consistent basis. There are always places to cut costs, but a percentage of that is eroded away with other costs that continue to climb. You name it, taxes, fuel, tolls, food, repairs, and the list goes on. Ten years ago we didn't run at that rate with dollar fuel and trucks that cost half as much as they do today.
Worse with a van I guess. 30k for a Sprinter and it is shot in three years. Does anyone have one with over 400k on it?
But that aside, there is always something to learn. I would love to see a breakdown of a truck operating at this rate. Something like the OOIDA spreadsheet that factors most fixed and variable costs.
Gotta have a open mind. I might just learn something.
Quick re-edit, since I didn't see Tom's recent post, the new milage figures are more in line with what I feel is necessary to operate.
1.60 per mile mile average I believe is doable and much closer to where we are at. Not owning van, 1.10 seems a pretty competitve average.
I am trying to figure out if the wheel has been reinvented, and if there is a way to operate a straight consistently at a dollar mile and actually turn a profit.
Make no mistake, we have hauled for a dollar a mile before, but it was a brokered job just to get out of the northwest.
It covered the drivers wage, fuel, and fixed costs, but that is about it.
If just using a a flat dollar per mile, we are running way ahead of that rate. But we don't have 7 percent deadhead. More like double that number with some of it marginally paid.
I don't see over a say a three year projected period of time, this could be done on a consistent basis. There are always places to cut costs, but a percentage of that is eroded away with other costs that continue to climb. You name it, taxes, fuel, tolls, food, repairs, and the list goes on. Ten years ago we didn't run at that rate with dollar fuel and trucks that cost half as much as they do today.
Worse with a van I guess. 30k for a Sprinter and it is shot in three years. Does anyone have one with over 400k on it?
But that aside, there is always something to learn. I would love to see a breakdown of a truck operating at this rate. Something like the OOIDA spreadsheet that factors most fixed and variable costs.
Gotta have a open mind. I might just learn something.
Quick re-edit, since I didn't see Tom's recent post, the new milage figures are more in line with what I feel is necessary to operate.
1.60 per mile mile average I believe is doable and much closer to where we are at. Not owning van, 1.10 seems a pretty competitve average.
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EdwinDavis
Seasoned Expediter
1000 miles at .65 per mile is better than 0 miles at .85 per mile.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
Like Dave, I too was trying to figure out how 1.00/mi would bring in a true profit. My comments were geared more toward the drivers who allow themselves to be run hard for pittance. My only comment toward you was that you seem to know how everyone can trim their costs to run at an A.Blair level. I, like Turtle, find that a bit presumptuous. But, I am not here to heckle you, or your drivers... only to state my opinion, for what it's worth.
If you're giving 1.60/mi for straights, regardless of two or three pick ups, then good! It's a step in the right direction for the industry.
If you're giving 1.60/mi for straights, regardless of two or three pick ups, then good! It's a step in the right direction for the industry.
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Just how does your FSC work? Seeing that you should be charging a FSC on every load you get and pass that on to the drivers why would you quit paying a FSC? The way I read this is you maintained your profitably by keeping the FSC that rightfully should have went to the drivers. Is this true?
Tom Robertson
Veteran Expediter
fastrod…
“The way I read this is you maintained your profitably by keeping the FSC that rightfully should have went to the drivers. Is this true?
The way you read it is wrong!... so- NO - it is not true.
The extreme disproportion of trucks available to shipments available boards caused most winning bidders to submit “all in” bids… meaning no additional charges of any sort. We, like most carriers have been operating at a loss for many months. But you go ahead and think whatever you like.
Tennesseahawk…
After further review I am certain there can be no profit at a dollar a mile. Since the life expectancy of the average truck is only 500,00. I can easily see how it the original purchase price, operating costs, and on the road costs would equal a dollar a mile and cost your every penny of $500,000 and how you would be working for nothing!
And I’m sure that a Sprinter would cost $325,000 to own and operate for the same period of time.
There just cannot be any possible way to survive at these rates.
Tennesseahawk…
Perhaps you can give us a rundown of the trucks in your fleet. What are the years, makes and set-ups? You are a fleet owner aren’t you? NO? Then tell us the year and make of your personal truck. Then the challenge goes to you… show me how it is remotely possible to spend a dollar a mile owning and operating a straight truck.
Thanks for reminding why I quit posting here.
You guys just go ahead with your plans to move third world countries to other locations on the planet.
“The way I read this is you maintained your profitably by keeping the FSC that rightfully should have went to the drivers. Is this true?
The way you read it is wrong!... so- NO - it is not true.
The extreme disproportion of trucks available to shipments available boards caused most winning bidders to submit “all in” bids… meaning no additional charges of any sort. We, like most carriers have been operating at a loss for many months. But you go ahead and think whatever you like.
Tennesseahawk…
After further review I am certain there can be no profit at a dollar a mile. Since the life expectancy of the average truck is only 500,00. I can easily see how it the original purchase price, operating costs, and on the road costs would equal a dollar a mile and cost your every penny of $500,000 and how you would be working for nothing!
And I’m sure that a Sprinter would cost $325,000 to own and operate for the same period of time.
There just cannot be any possible way to survive at these rates.
Tennesseahawk…
Perhaps you can give us a rundown of the trucks in your fleet. What are the years, makes and set-ups? You are a fleet owner aren’t you? NO? Then tell us the year and make of your personal truck. Then the challenge goes to you… show me how it is remotely possible to spend a dollar a mile owning and operating a straight truck.
Thanks for reminding why I quit posting here.
You guys just go ahead with your plans to move third world countries to other locations on the planet.
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I see what you are saying now and I did read it wrong. I was under the impression that you actually had some customers but see now that you get all your loads from the boards. I am a one van operation that works directly with shippers and it works great for me. You may want to try building a customer base and get away from using those boards 100% of the time.
jaminjim
Veteran Expediter
Not sure where to begin, if your company is competing with other companies, why are your rates so much lower? I would think that with your companies much lower overhead that you could still take a good profit from each load and still pay your drivers closer to what the industry standard is.
It makes no sense to threaten law suits here.
Bottom Feeder: • figurative someone who profits from things cast off or left over by others.
It makes no sense to threaten law suits here.
Bottom Feeder: • figurative someone who profits from things cast off or left over by others.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
- Status