The 1000 Mile Load

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
My math works out to 64 boxes. 4 across (48") x 8 deep (96") = 32 boxes. The boxes were 18" high so I could only get two courses (36") for a total of 64. I could get 8 more on my bed, so that's 72. I don't know what the boxes contained, but if I could crush a few I could probably get 12 on my bed. Wow, now I'm up to 76. Four more in the footwell on the passenger side and maybe two between the seats and I still need room for 18 more.
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Forget the math..the dispatcher said it would if it was a 1000 mile run and he said it wouldn't be swapped...I can't believe you didn't trust your dispatched at the "Cat".....:D

But at least you did Thank him for his consideration to offer you the load...:D
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Forget the math..the dispatcher said it would if it was a 1000 mile run and he said it wouldn't be swapped...I can't believe you didn't trust your dispatched at the "Cat".....:D

But at least you did Thank him for his consideration to offer you the load...:D

the beauty of the Cat system...dispatch can say or promise the moon and safety comes along and over rules them later....dispatcher feels they are off the hook...but it is probably all a set up from the git go...
 

LDB

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Yes, my bad. I just did a quick multiply of the cubic capacity without taking account of the shape limitations. I must have just woken up from a nap or just been in need of one. :D
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
the beauty of the Cat system...dispatch can say or promise the moon and safety comes along and over rules them later....dispatcher feels they are off the hook...but it is probably all a set up from the git go...
That's exactly the way the system is set up. Dispatch dispatches the load, and then once the load is picked up, Safety then takes a look at the load and figures in the available hours for the driver. Safety lets Dispatch know when the driver is required to take a break. If Dispatch determines that the driver cannot take a 5 hour break and still complete the load on time (figured at 47 MPH), then the load will swap.

The system also makes it very easy to pass the buck. Dispatch will say it's Safety's decision, but Safety says nope, it's Dispatch's call to swap it, which is true. Safety only makes decisions on what time a driver must take a break, not whether or not it gets swapped. But Safety's decision is used by Dispatch to determine whether it swaps or not.

That's why it's important to know your hours, and know the rules, and use the rules to your advantage, just like Moot did. Otherwise, you'll be taken advantage of, just like Moot would have been if he didn't know the rules.
 

tknight

Veteran Expediter
Having only felt with 1 swap in my lifetime in a van filled to the brim with boxes who gets to repackage them all into another van ? Not sounding like fun
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
That's exactly the way the system is set up. Dispatch dispatches the load, and then once the load is picked up, Safety then takes a look at the load and figures in the available hours for the driver. Safety lets Dispatch know when the driver is required to take a break. If Dispatch determines that the driver cannot take a 5 hour break and still complete the load on time (figured at 47 MPH), then the load will swap.

The system also makes it very easy to pass the buck. Dispatch will say it's Safety's decision, but Safety says nope, it's Dispatch's call to swap it, which is true. Safety only makes decisions on what time a driver must take a break, not whether or not it gets swapped. But Safety's decision is used by Dispatch to determine whether it swaps or not.

That's why it's important to know your hours, and know the rules, and use the rules to your advantage, just like Moot did. Otherwise, you'll be taken advantage of, just like Moot would have been if he didn't know the rules.

hence we get..."Embrace the Stupidity"...
 

purgoose10

Veteran Expediter
When Panther tells you to swap out. Who does the labor and where do you do it at?? If it's on a pallet and a fork lift is involved do you drive out of route to get it done at a designated spot and do you get paid for out of route miles?? How do you account for the delay in transfering loads?
Just curious.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
When Panther tells you to swap out. Who does the labor and where do you do it at?? If it's on a pallet and a fork lift is involved do you drive out of route to get it done at a designated spot and do you get paid for out of route miles?? How do you account for the delay in transfering loads?
Just curious.
100 boxes...wouldn't that pay as a hand load and unload?....and the next driver would get that as well?.....
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
If it's a forklift operation, you drive to an LTL dock or sometimes even a tow truck lot where it is transferred. These places are always out of routing, although many are just a few miles. Some are 20-50 miles out of routing. But they do generally pay for all miles driven (sometimes Zip-to-Zip and not address-to-address actual miles). If it's hand transferred, one or both drivers will get the hand-load pay.

As for accounting for the time it takes to transfer the load, which can be hours if it has to wait on the forklift driver to show up or the second van to show up, generally isn't accounted for, at least from the perspective of the original driver. If there is a delay in transferring the load, the delivery time is usually bumped up to give the second driver plenty of time to get the load delivered safely and on-time. Ironically, if they had bumped up the delivery time for the first driver, he could have taken his break and still delivered the load safely and on-time himself, no wasted money for the crossdock.

I once picked up a load in Salt Lake City (from a driver who picked it up in Reno) that was going to somewhere in southern AL. Best routing on that is US 95 down to Vegas, Kingman and then right across I-40. Vegas would have been a good place to crossdock, too, especially since the driver who picked it up was already pre-dispatched on a load picking up in Vegas going to Los Angeles. But there were no drivers in Vegas and I was in Salt Lake, so they sent him to Salt Lake to give it to me and then I was to take it to Alabama, while he then deadheaded to Vegas. No comment.

The first driver and I waited a little more than 5 hours for the tow truck driver to arrive at the yard to do the crossdock, for $300. So I'm already 5 hours in the hole, but after sitting there for 5 hours my 16-hour clock was reset. I knew that about 900 miles would be Lincoln or Omaha, so I figured that's where they'd swap me out. I could have taken a 5 (or even 8) hour break in Lincoln and then continued on without swapping at all, since there was still more than enough time in the load (I had made up considerable time with me driving such a long distance at 70 MPH or so). I would have driven two legs of that 4-leg trip with a good break in between, and then possibly swapping it out to another driver in Nashville or someplace for the 4th leg when it was time for another break. But no, they swapped it out at a tow yard, in Omaha, in the middle of the night on a Saturday. Instead of going through Lincoln over to I-29, they swapped it out on the north side of Omaha, adding 65 miles and a good hour to the total trip. Awesome. I was paid the miles to the swap point, though.

The infuriating part was, I called them at 2PM when I was in Cheyenne, 8 hours before I was to get to Lincoln, and told them my ETA so they could decide about a swap, depending on other driver and crossdock availability, or have me just take a break and continue on (sometimes on the weekends you have to give them a headsup about those kinds of things). As I approached Lincoln there was still no word on swapping it out, so I called and asked where this was gonna swap, or if I should just take a break and continue on. At that point, at 47 MPH, the load was running a little mover 18 hours ahead of the delivery time, so a 5 hour break would be no problem. They said it had to be swapped out, that I really didn't have time for a break, and they gave me the address of the tow yard north of Omaha. They also said they didn't have a driver there and they'd have to send one up to get it. Clearly, my headsup didn't work and they were scrambling. Turns out, he came up from Wichita, 300 miles away. Wichita! They hadn't called him 8 hours earlier, they had just called him a few minutes ago, when I asked where it was gonna swap. Unbelievable. So I sat there in Omaha for more than 6 hours waiting on the other driver. The tow truck driver waited 5 hours, at $100 an hour, and then swapped it out for $350, a total of $850 to swap out a load while I sat there for more than 6 hours despite being told I didn't have time for a 5 hour break.

So, instead of having the first leg driver just keep driving towards Alabama after a 5 hour break in Salt Lake and then taking another lengthy break in Lincoln, and me going to Vegas for his load, they swapped it out for $350. And instead of having me continue on to Alabama from Lincoln they swapped it out for $850 plus deadhead pay to the other driver. I have no idea what happened after that, other than the driver who I swapped it out to said he would be going through Louisville to visit his van's fleet owner and pick up new license plates, which is about 200 miles out of routing, thereby absolutely guaranteeing yet another swap for who knows how much.

It may change with ABF in the picture, but I'll guaran****tee you that Panther spends well over a million dollars annually in crossdock fees. And most of them are of the $75 dollar variety at LTL terminals. Probably 85% of them aren't even necessary.

Embrace the Stupidity. I'm tellin' ya.
 

LDB

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
That's the kind of story the driver council would periodically bring to their attention. We'd suggest changes in policy and procedure to improve things such as this but they rarely listened to anything that required either spending any money or changing/training dispatch.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Remember that really long "Action Items" list that ended up being the "Unfinished Items List"? I've still got it, and the laughable update, on my computer. I have no idea why.
 

NorthernBill

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Just wondering how often after waiting 5 hours to swap loads drivers have been dispatched on a new load. Now i think understand the embrace the stupidity advice. Wow
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
Keep the stories a little smaller. I am trying to put together the 2008 Panther Paws addition.
 

purgoose10

Veteran Expediter
Well I can say one thing that would be a great post for someone asking what it would be like to run for Panther. With decisions like that how in world do they make any money?? As far as ABF goes they really won't do any better if your familiar with their track record. That's the craziest thing I ever heard. I believe I would have fired everyone involved with that decision.;)
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Yes, my bad. I just did a quick multiply of the cubic capacity without taking account of the shape limitations. I must have just woken up from a nap or just been in need of one. :D
Leo, you're the math guy! When I saw your post showing a 104 boxes I thought I screwed up with my numbers. I had to check them twice.

I just tracked the 1000 Mile load. It delivered this morning at 08:18, 42 minutes ahead of schedule. Definitely a better driver than me. Had to have been a Sprinter, cuber or possibly a straight truck. I don't think 100 boxes of this size would have even fit into a completely stripped out extended GM or Ford van.
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Remember that really long "Action Items" list that ended up being the "Unfinished Items List"? I've still got it, and the laughable update, on my computer. I have no idea why.
Please e-mail it to me. You do miss Panther don't you!
 
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