Caterpillar to cut 20,000 jobs

usafk9

Veteran Expediter
Very well stated, Turtle. You took those words from my head, I believe.

Last poster (can't remember your name, sorry, it's on the last page and I'm too lazy to click back): I have done research on algae diesel and several other renewable fuels. How about you? Have I put any money into them? Do you think I'd be starting a new career at 42 if I had any money?

Got this feeling that you and I will be butting heads on several issues. I welcome it. One of the things that make our nation wonderful.

Oh, and for the record, I am not a Democrat.
 

hdxpedx

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
Obama has been President for six days. We have to wait to see how his policies work. They can't be much worse than what we got the last eight years.(QUOTE)

THANK THE FAIR HOUSING ACT & Liberalism that bought & covered up db barney/dodd.FANNIE MAE-ACORN. which the media leaves out for the koolaid voters!! CAT. plus home depot lost 27,000 jobs and today a REPORT stating a total of 60,000 jobs had been lost recently.. The MAIN STREAM media and liberalism are at fault!! BUSH brought down unemployment-- WHILE the media COVERED-UP-liberalism (acorn-fannie mae) LOSSES-which brought down the markets!! until the lib media holds "ALL" to the same as to attack-and convict-(R) SCOOTER LIBBY, (R)Armitage and gives ALL lib's get a FREE pass-like-(D) JAMIE GORE_LICK (D)Frank Raines,(D) barney,(D) dodd, (D)sandy BURGULAR, Ways and Means Committee Chairman (D)Charles B. Rangel and OTHERS(D), the MARKET CONFIDENCE will continue to be LOST!!- results = job loss = your frt. = our revenue!! HUh?? and now they go for EMISSIONS TAX! Consumer Confidence in the U.S. Fell to Record Low !! point made
 
Last edited:

jaminjim

Veteran Expediter
USA, which part of the trucking industry are you in? It will help me formulate my response.

Turtle, I'm sure your facts are well researched (please take note Chef) but I prefer that California not be the one leading the way for me. Not that all of their ideas are wrong/bad, but they have enough stupid things on their books because of goofy agendas that boggle my mind.
 

pjjjjj

Veteran Expediter
Obama has been President for six days. We have to wait to see how his policies work. They can't be much worse than what we got the last eight years.

THANK THE FAIR HOUSING ACT Liberalism bought and covered up db barney/dodd.FANNIE MAE-ACORN.the media leaves all that out for the koolaid voters!! CAT. plus home depot lost 27,000 jobs and today a REPORT stating a total of 60,000 jobs had been lost recently.. The MAIN STREAM media and liberalism are at fault!! BUSH brought down unemployment-- WHILE the media COVERED-UP-liberalism (acorn-fannie mae) LOSSES-which brought down the markets!! until the lib media holds ALL to the same as to attack-convict- SCOOTER LIBBY, Armitage and gives ALL lib's a FREE pass-like- Frank Raines, barney, dodd, sandy BURGULAR, and OTHERS, the MARKET CONFIDENCE will continue to be LOST- results = job loss = your frt. = our revenue!! HUh?? and now they go for EMISSIONS TAX!

Thought this was an English speaking forum..
And.. man.. I thought it was rough reading IRT's posts.. he's a cakewalk compared to this..
 

Roadpig

Expert Expediter
Oh, and for the record, I am not a Democrat.

Good luck convincing these guys that. If you're not firmly Republican then you're an OMG TEH LIBERALZ!

Doesn't make them bad people, but it just means that they have chosen a side and shall staunchly never budge. I know many Democrats that are the same way. In their eyes Bush was evil incarnate and for the life of me I could never convince them of the man's accomplishments (which there were many in eight years, but get lost in the failures).

But we're talking about southerners here. A place where porch monkey is obviously a progressive term of endearment....

I kid. :)

For the record, my political beliefs fall more in line with a Libertarian view. Fiscally conservative but on a lot of social issues (gasp, don't say it!) liberal.


Sorry for derailing my own thread.

Sucks about Cat, eh?
 

hdxpedx

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
Thought this was an English speaking forum..
And.. man.. I thought it was rough reading IRT's posts.. he's a cakewalk compared to this..

ok BUSH SUCKS-- there you go!! Consumer Confidence in the U.S. Fell to Record Low
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Another viewpoint from Grand Rapids, MI on the Obama emission standards:

West Michigan auto suppliers, environmentalists have mixed reaction to Obama order on emissions

by Kyla King | The Grand Rapids Press Monday January 26, 2009, 5:48 PM


President Barack Obama ordered the government Monday to re-examine whether California and other states should be allowed to have tougher auto emission standards to combat a build up of greenhouse gases.
West Michigan auto part suppliers and environmentalists had mixed reactions to news that President Barack Obama ordered the government to review the Bush administration's refusal to allow states to set tougher tailpipe emission standards and to get moving on new fuel-efficiency guidelines for the auto industry.

RELATED CONTENT • Obama pushing stronger fuel-efficiency standard


"We can't continue to have these high rate of emissions," said Rachel Hood, executive director of the West Michigan Environmental Action Council.
Hood hopes the move eventually means Michigan would revisit efforts to open emission testing sites, similar to a controversial 1995 initiative that was scuttled at the last minute by then Gov. John Engler.
"It would be my concern that Michigan and other big traditional auto states would fail to take aggressive action to protect our environmental and human health," Hood said.
But auto industry supplier Jim Zawacki, owner of Grand Rapids Spring and Stamping, said the issue should remain at the federal level so there would be a single national standard -- a position backed by Gov. Jennifer Granholm.
Zawacki said requiring automakers to build cars that get more miles to the gallon is a lofty goal, but would further hurt the crippled auto industry.
"(Car makers) have got it tough enough already," Zawacki said. "Give them a little breathing room until we come out of this recession."
Zawacki said Obama could focus on more immediate remedies to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from tailpipes, such as offering cash incentives to get older cars off the road and for buying fuel-efficient cars. Such a move would increase demand for newer cars and help the sputtering auto industry.
"If you took every car five years or older off the road, you could eliminate the greenhouse gas effect related to automobiles by 25 percent in this country," Zawacki said.
In 2007, the Bush administration's Environmental Protection Agency denied California's request for a federal waiver to set tougher standards. Obama's order does not yet overturn anything, but states wanting their own power considered it a victory.
California's proposed restrictions -- which have been adopted by 13 other states -- would force automakers to boost fuel efficiency in new vehicles to about 36.8 miles per gallon in new cars and light trucks by 2016.
A law passed by Congress in 2007 requires that by 2020, new cars and trucks meet a standard of 35 miles per gallon, a 40 percent increase over the status quo. On Monday, Obama ordered new guidelines in place to start affecting cars sold in 2011.
The move was met with skepticism by Granholm and Michigan lawmakers, including U.S. Rep. Pete Hoekstra, R-Holland, and Sens. Carl Levin and Debbie Stabenow.
All said the country -- and the struggling auto industry -- needs a strong single national standard instead of a confusing "patchwork" set of rules.
"We all want a cleaner environment and more fuel efficient vehicles, but not at the expense of eliminating jobs and further burdening a major U.S. industry," Hoekstra said. "The auto industry needs certainty and stability in the marketplace."
-- The Associated Press contributed to this story.

West Michigan auto suppliers, environmentalists have mixed reaction to Obama order on emissions - Grand Rapids News - The Latest News, Blogs, Photos & Videos – MLive.com

Also, quoting from the article in the link (bold italics mine) contained in the body of the above (Obama pushing stronger fuel efficiency standard):

"Industry officials have also said they would face billions of dollars in new costs to meet the rules at a time when General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC have received billions in federal loans to stay afloat.
The Bush administration estimated the federal fuel economy rules would cost the industry more than $100 billion to implement the changes by 2020."

For argument's sake let's suppose these costs are overstated by 50%. Do we still want to impose that kind of new burden on this industry during the current economic conditions? Just some food for thought.
 

Roadpig

Expert Expediter
Or maybe this will help spur a new round of industrial output as a modified product is presented to the consuming public. We can Monday morning quarterback all day, but there is the same chance that this could work (simple economics, industry and production are cyclical and the current cycle has run it's course) than the chance that it won't.


What spurred economic growth in the 90's was the proliferation of the internet and home computers. That started the dotcom industry which grew fast and faded even faster. It wasn't anything that Bill Clinton did, he was just in the right place at the right time.

Can Obama do anything? Not really. But his ideas that it is time to move our production and industrial sectors into the new century is dead on. Especially considering the political climate of oil producing nations and couple that with the fact that oil resources are dwindling YES, the internal combustion engine needs an upgrade. This will allow (theoretically) new product to be produced in the US (but it won't last... nothing does) at more affordable prices (now that the UAW is learning some hard truths about how they pay and compensate) that doesn't use the same amount of resources.

Look at the computer. Thirty years ago they took up entire rooms, today they can fit in your pocket and DO MORE.

The internal combustion engine? About the same as it was with the Model T.
 

Tempest

Seasoned Expediter
WOW I missed a great discussion here. I am an animal lover from way back and a single thread with cats dogs seals and monkeys is not to be missed. (oh and I thought porch monkeys, yard apes, curtain climbers ect where children). But this whole Cat thing really worries me. I live in Gaston, SC. and many of my friends at home work for Cat in Sumter. First UPS closed its night shift and now Cat cutting jobs does not bode well in my area. Add to that the expedite frieght we have ran for them drying up (we still pick up the slack for 3state) and this industry in general slowing down, makes me wonder where we are heading. I dont blame Obama but I dont see how he is gonna help either. We can argue politics and race til the cows come home and nothing is gonna change the fact that this country is in sad shape and getting worse.
 

dodgeboy

Seasoned Expediter
You can't say that there was no intent for using a known racial epithet.


Your problem is that he's both black (ding ding) and a Democrat.

If only he were gay he'd have the market cornered on your hate, huh?


But pastor Dave is right, the topic at hand is Caterpillar. Thank you, sir.

BTW, I don't hold grudges, so you and I are cool, Vanman. I just cannot stand racism.

Porch monkey was a little bit over the top. But I have met ovm on the road before and he did not come across as a racist, nor have any of his previous posts inferred that he is in any way, shape, or form a racist. Perhaps he was just being derogatory towards Obama because he does not agree with Obamas policies.
 

dodgeboy

Seasoned Expediter
WOW I missed a great discussion here. I am an animal lover from way back and a single thread with cats dogs seals and monkeys is not to be missed. worse.


Yikes, you made me spit my coffee out onto the computer screen when I read this line. You have a great sense of humor and wit. Man, it almost reminded me of the infamous "turtle!"
 

dodgeboy

Seasoned Expediter
Wow.

(How does a black guy beat a white woman in IOWA? See Farm Bureau, ethanol lobby, etc.

I detect a subtle hint of racism here. How dare you insinuate that a black man can't win a primary election over a white woman in a state that is mostly white. You ought to be ashamed of yourself!
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
I do think we need one, single national standard for fuel efficiency and emissions, instead of allowing California to set the standards. However, California isn't really setting different standards, as much as they are pushing the federal standards up sooner. In the article above, look who opposes this: the auto parts supplier who recommends getting older cars off the road in favor of new cars. That's not toooo self-serving, is it? And elected officials from Michigan? There ya go.

By and large, the US auto industry has not made any major strides in fuel efficiency or emissions without being mandated to do so. A federal mandate, rather than necessity, seems to be the only mother of their invention. Now they're faced with both.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Just think where the automakers would be if it weren't for California pushing the issue....they already move at a snails pace....Maybe instead of fighting the cause the big 3 should've went forward, just maybe they would have had a fuel efficient car to compete long before and this might not have been so bad....hindsight is 20/20 ain't it?:rolleyes:
 

usafk9

Veteran Expediter
I detect a subtle hint of racism here. How dare you insinuate that a black man can't win a primary election over a white woman in a state that is mostly white. You ought to be ashamed of yourself!

No shame in my game, dodgeboy. I'm white, married to a Puerto Rican, have a half black daughter, and 2 black grandkids. I'm probably the last guy anyone can play the race card on.

Roadpig: I also contributed to your hijack. My apologies. I am sad for the Cat folks as well. I believe you are, however, spot-on with the spurring of new economic activity. Not sure who posted the article about the stamping plant in GR (I'm also in West Michigan), but it furthers what I've said about lobbies having pols in their hip pockets. Hoekstra, Stabenow, and Levin are perfect examples. Do you really think, after all of these people who elected the candidate who kept preaching about a green revolution, that they (we) will sit idly by and allow the free market's will wean us off foreign oil? Sure we will. Oh, wait a minute.....we've already done that.....and we're seeing how it works so well. Auto industry needs to quit crying and get busy. The new fuel standards are not that high of a threshold, and they have 2 years to reach them. Why NOT do them nationwide? Sure would make retooling a hell of a lot easier.

Change is constant, folks. Embrace it.

Jaminjim (sorry if I'm spelling wrong): Brand-spanking new, expediting, D-class. Not sure if that's what you're looking for.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
California had it right and we all had it wrong...we B'ed and complained about California but look now....if the automakers hadn't fought it so bad and went with fuel efficient cars sooner they may have competed against the imports sooner...BUT no we had to besmirch Cali..and try to make them look stupid...well the joke unfortunately is on the rest of the country and us....but no ones laughing...:eek:
 
Top