Best ST box size??

[bentleytech1]

What is the best box size when looking at a ST?? I see several used with 20'-22' boxes. This tells me one of two things.....either these are the ones that no one wants, or this is what everyone uses.

What size box are most people running ST using? Why??

What would the benefit or detriment of using a 16'-18' be?

From reading posts over the last month or so, it seems that most runs are rarely at full GVW or box capacity.

Feedback would be really appreciated as I continue my "education" before jumping in and making the wrong choice in equipment. "A craftsman is only as good as his tools."

Thanks for continuing to contribute to my "education".

 

[LDB]

The 40 foot rule usually is the answer and sleeper size the variable. More is better whether length or gvw for max load offers. Keep reading here.. a lot. Good luck.

 

[moose]

Good question .
Just like anything else Expedite ,you spec the truck to better serve your costumers needs .
the Only way you can know that ,is if you run for that carrier first.
most smaller boxes are customs fitted to a unique carrier ,and are well equipped to handle it's demanding costumers .
while it's mathematically possible to fit a 10 skids load into a 20' box ,the extra 2' can be used for secured storage of personal belonging, freight handling items and maintenance stuff ,while still being able to accept a 10 skids or long OD loads .
it is that one quarterly load ,that make or brake the profitability of a larger box.
or you can built a truck with 20' box and a line of belly boxes below, an option that have it's ups and downs when you think about it.
you will also find out that when you look on boxes heights ,there's no one size fits all standard .

 

[greg334]

DO NOT GET ANY THING LESS THAN 20 FEET.

I'm speaking from experience.

Don't get fooled with the idea of having a big sleeper, if you can live in a box, then 72" should be enough.

Don't listen to the cheerleaders, be versitle (sp?) and look over the horizon at what all companies want.

Get the biggest box that you can ever get. If you can get way with a 40 foot truck with a 24 foot box - DO IT.

 

[bentleytech1]

OK...40' rule I understand............but how often are you hauling "10 skids or long OD loads"? Seems like the posts I read are 6 or less skids, down to one box of 250lbs.

Also what makes most sense...single or dual axle? I understand the additional operating costs of dual axle, but is is ever significant, and should it play into my pick of equipment??

To my way of thinking HP isn't that big of an issue at the "fuel saving speeds" that it seems most people are running, as long as you have enough gearing. I think the "more is better" philosophy probably applies here.

 

[Humble2drive]

What is the best box size when looking at a ST?? I see several used with 20'-22' boxes. This tells me one of two things.....either these are the ones that no one wants, or this is what everyone uses.

What size box are most people running ST using? Why??

I see you have changed your thinking and you are considering kicking it up a notch from CV to ST??

You can rule out the "ones that no one wants" conclusion.
You see a lot of them because it is the most common size.
As stated by others, you want to find the perfect mix for you. A sleeper size that you can live with and a box that gives you the most opportunities all within a total length of 40 feet.
For most, that shakes out to 20-22.

What would the benefit or detriment of using a 16'-18' be?

Benefits:

1) Big sleeper
2) Some carriers will dispatch a smaller load exclusively to the c-unit with the smaller box in order to keep the d-unit available for any larger loads.
3) Less taxes if unit is single axle classified as C.

Detriments:

1) The obvious is not getting a load because it won't fit.
2) Losing loads to B-units.
3) Depends on the carrier.
4) Resale

From reading posts over the last month or so, it seems that most runs are rarely at full GVW or box capacity.

We have a 22 ft box and our most frequent loads are 2-6 pallets.

BUT

It is hard to understand (until it happens to you) how important that useable 20 feet of space can be when you need to get the truck rolling.
Rare? Perhaps, depends on the carrier and it's customers.
A "rare" load that gets you moved out of an area once a month and keeps you moving is priceless.

Assuming that you are still planning to run solo? That in itself places a huge limitation on the runs that are available to you so I would recommend not placing another limitation such as box size in to the mix.

I would agree with Greg on this one.

 

[ATeam]

Consider picking a carrier before you spec a truck. After you have done that, ask your carrier which box size (or truck type) is the best money maker, if making money is your goal.

Spec'ing a truck is an exercise in tradeoffs (carrier culture, sleeper size, component costs, revenue potential, etc.) and striking the right balance between them.

I documented the decisions Diane and I made when we spec'ed our truck. You might want to read this piece, not because our decisions will be right for you (they won't be), but because it will help you think through the many trade-offs that are involved.

 

[greg334]

For the most part, I would look at mileage as a secondary issue. If you follow my suggestions on what to do when you are looking at any truck, then you can take the info and ask others for a comparison to make sure that it is geared right for that engine.

The key isn't having the space to use but having the space to attract.

I mean there are two issues that comes to mind, one is the carrier isn't on the dock so the customer who asked for a truck with 20 feet of space may need 22 feet or 5 feet. The other is the carrier may feel with specific customers, only large trucks should be used as a selling point for the brand.

I seen the first happen a couple times sitting at a dispatcher's desk a few years back. There were two trucks sitting within 5 miles of a shipper, one 16 foot and one 22 foot. The customer was saying they had 6 pallets weighing 5000 lbs, 14 feet was all that was needed but they didn't sound sure on the phone. The dispatcher selected the 22 foot truck as a precaution, and did a very fast override without noting it. The dispatcher was right in doing so, the shipper had 10 pallets to go, not 6.

 

[bentleytech1]

I'm not sure about the "kicking it up a notch", I'm just looking at all of the options that make sense. CV has advantages of low cost of entry, and lower operating costs, (fuel, insurance, tires) but it looks like C or D units have more flexibility on loads and able to stay rolling more. May be not true, but a perception on my part. Entry costs with a C or D unit aren't significantly greater, though operating costs are. Again the offset here is load availability to keep the truck moving.

Have been talking with several companies, and getting good responses, so just have to shortly make a decision, jump in, and get started.

Thanks to everyone that is being my "professor" and helping to continue my "education". Slow and steady when making this kind of investment and commitment to job and lifestyle, seems like the most sensible approach.

Still learning.....

 

[ATeam]

Thanks to everyone that is being my "professor" and helping to continue my "education". Slow and steady when making this kind of investment and commitment to job and lifestyle, seems like the most sensible approach.

I suggest that the most sensible approach is to not enter the business until you know with every fiber of your being exactly what it is you want to accomplish by entering the business.

There are two approaches.

One is the shopping approach. With it you read the Open Forum; talk to drivers, carriers, truck dealears and others; read up on the business, and maybe visit a trade show or two; all as if you were pushing a shopping cart through a grocery store, picking up ideas as you go and as they appeal to you at the time.

The other approach is goal oriented. Decide long before you enter the business exactly what it is that you want to achieve. Is it a certain lifestyle? Is it about the money? Is it to escape a job you now hate? Know exactly what you want out of expediting, and why you want it.

To figure that out, you may need to make a few trips to the grocery store, not to buy, but to get the big picture and see what the possibilities are. Then, after you know what you want and why, return to the store, this time to buy.

When you know exactly what it is that you want out of the business and why you want it, the items you need will jump off the shelves and into your life in a way in which you can put them to good use.

If you don't know what you want and why, dealers will just as happily sell you a truck, carriers will just as happily sign you on, expediters will just as happily offer advice, but you'll be out there casting about to no good end.

 

[bentleytech1]

I agree with the "shopping" idea. That is the phase I am currently in. Trying to collect all of the data, analyze it, see what fits MY needs, and how it fits the business plan and MY long term plans. I started out reading "your piece" about specifying your truck, and have moved on to you blog and other materials.

This stuff should be part of Expediting 101 for EVERYONE. This is great information!!

We (my wife of 25yrs) and I are also now talking about doing this as a team. Thinking I'd like to start with her still working a full time job, and see what works from there.

It's all about what works for US!!

thanks for everyone's help

 

[greg334]

There are two approaches.

One is the shopping approach. With it you read the Open Forum; talk to drivers, carriers, truck dealears and others; read up on the business, and maybe visit a trade show or two; all as if you were pushing a shopping cart through a grocery store, picking up ideas as you go and as they appeal to you at the time.

The other approach is goal oriented. Decide long before you enter the business exactly what it is that you want to achieve. Is it a certain lifestyle? Is it about the money? Is it to escape a job you now hate? Know exactly what you want out of expediting, and why you want it.

Actually Phil, these two things are pretty much the same thing but good advice nevertheless.

The thing I see is people can't go into anything without goals, goals are defined by the person and it is only the person who knows if they are successful or not. There are steps in any buisiness to build a foundation and make decisions. A lot of people just listen to others and never ask a question while other still think because they are some guru, that they know what to expect. It all comes down to information - the data - and how it is applied to your situation.

Information gathering is one step of many, and asking questions is a subset of steps within the information gathering step.

We, at least most of us don't go into this without thinking what we get out of it, some may have no choice because of the access to work while others are trying to escape "the corporate life".

Most of us can't form goals without knowing the basic information, like what is this all about or is this a lifestyle or a marriage to the truck for 5 years and so on.

But regardless, goals and shopping carts go hand in hand. Things may not jump off the shelf after a while but crawl into the cart, some things may even run away from you but then again you can't in this or any other business be passive about finding answers.

 

[14Wheeler]

Since youre considering bringing your wife along , then a smaller box - larger sleeper would be the way Id go. You will be sitting quite a bit of time and there's no substitute for quality of life. DO NOT assume you'll be able to live comfortably as a couple in a smaller unit. Specially if youre an older couple. From my seventeen years of on the road experience.....go big if youre taking your wife.

 

[ATeam]

This piece may also interest you:

Introduction to Expediting

 

[Humble2drive]

Consider picking a carrier before you spec a truck. After you have done that, ask your carrier which box size (or truck type) is the best money maker, if making money is your goal.

I would have agreed to that advice 2 years ago.
In the current economy I would suggest that it might be more prudent not to tie yourself and your business to one particular carrier.
What works with one company might not be the best thing with another.
Start looking closly at the expediter trucks you see go by and you will start to notice that underneath that nice Panther graphic is an old Fed Ex graphic and an old Tri State graphic etc. etc.
In other words the carrier divorce rate is very high in this biz.

 

[piper1]

Ask yourself this question, what generates more revenue

1) a 1/2 filled box running down the road

2) you sitting because you are too small to haul the load

Bunks are important...you live there and it becomes home, but in todays competitive environment, I would want all the flexibility I could get to generate revenue and if I needed to, switch carriers.

 

[greg334]

Consider picking a carrier before you spec a truck. After you have done that, ask your carrier which box size (or truck type) is the best money maker, if making money is your goal.

I would have agreed to that advice 2 years ago.
In the current economy I would suggest that it might be more prudent not to tie yourself and your business to one particular carrier.

Actually Humble that wasn't good advice two years ago, maybe five. Phil's advice seems to be a bit backwards, I wouldn't look for a carrier before the truck and then build the truck around the carrier, their goals can be a lot different than yours. But rather look for a carrier with YOUR goals in mind after you decided what you want to drive, Van or Straight Truck

The past is the past, Phil and others spec'd or bought trucks with specifics in mind, this includes me. I can't stress enough not to end up with a small box for any reason. With the glut of trucks out there, even older ones that will work, there isn't a reason why you should have anything smaller than 20 feet.

 

[bentleytech1]

Lots of "interesting" comments, and I thank you for all of them! Now what I really need is DATA. Of you (men and women) that are running 20'and 22' boxes, what percentage of your runs are with the box "full"? One run in 200- .05%, one in 100 - 1% or one in 10 - 10%?

I see that Phil and Diane are running a 16" reefer box, and from all appearances are reasonably successful. Though I have to admit, after reading their "blog article" about specifying their truck, it is much closer to the "Cadillac" than the "Chevy" I am considering. The fact is, it seems to meet their needs and keep them successful. I find that this life is always full of "would-a, could-a, should-a", and am really more interested in "what will work", not the "ideal / perfect" solution. If I was to follow that line of thinking, I would be looking at a T/T and offering to haul any freight, any size, knowing that I always had the most capacity for whatever the load was.

Remember part of this calculation is "Cost of Entry" which includes the initial cost of the truck and the operating expenses.
My take on it at this point is that being a 16" reefer, with white glove, blue glove, brown glove, pink mitten, TVAL, and HAZMAT might be more important to utilization of the truck than whether it is 16" or 20'. Maybe I'm wrong and I need someone to show me!!

 

[greg334]

1 - Phil is special.

2 - Don't try to quantify the size of the box through utilization because we are not in the freight on demand but capacity on demand. The numbers are not there, but depending on the carrier, you may be in the position to have more than one customer's freight on the truck, which means more money.

3 - A 16 foot truck get almost the same mileage as a 22 foot truck. The only drawback is ... well there isn't any I can see.

4 - Take it from someone who knows - get a large box.

5 - Success is subjective and defined by the operator, not someone who claims to be successful. Even people who leave are successful in different ways. Success is not related to the size of a sleeper or model of a truck, it isn't because someone is the smartest business person on earth but things that are sometimes out of our control. They, Phil and Diane are as successful as I or others are.

6 - before I forget, the cost of entry is not just calculated by the actual cost to get into this business but rather calculated by your flexibility in this business. It you stick yourself with a 16 foot truck, then you will get 16 foot freight, which competes directly with van/box vans. If you get a reefer, then you have limits on what you can accept because of the cost to maintain the reefer (hint, you have to actually make more to pay for that maintenance) and so on. What I am getting at is the cost of the truck is one little factor and people are so sold on this idea that they need all the bells and whistles to get work and consistent work but in reality it is the plain truck with floor space that actually makes it better for the owner. To reinforce this idea, look around at the four majors and see what they do, the one who has the largest fleet of all of them has only 9 reefer straight trucks. The largest company (not the largest fleet) markets specific services to specific customers and demand specific trucks - can an owner take that 16 foot reefer truck and move to the company with the largest fleet and make it? Not really.

 

[gotta go]

Lots of "interesting" comments, and I thank you for all of them! Now what I really need is DATA. Of you (men and women) that are running 20'and 22' boxes, what percentage of your runs are with the box "full"? One run in 200- .05%, one in 100 - 1% or one in 10 - 10%?

I see that Phil and Diane are running a 16" reefer box, and from all appearances are reasonably successful. Though I have to admit, after reading their "blog article" about specifying their truck, it is much closer to the "Cadillac" than the "Chevy" I am considering. The fact is, it seems to meet their needs and keep them successful. I find that this life is always full of "would-a, could-a, should-a", and am really more interested in "what will work", not the "ideal / perfect" solution. If I was to follow that line of thinking, I would be looking at a T/T and offering to haul any freight, any size, knowing that I always had the most capacity for whatever the load was.

Remember part of this calculation is "Cost of Entry" which includes the initial cost of the truck and the operating expenses.
My take on it at this point is that being a 16" reefer, with white glove, blue glove, brown glove, pink mitten, TVAL, and HAZMAT might be more important to utilization of the truck than whether it is 16" or 20'. Maybe I'm wrong and I need someone to show me!!

You will also notice that Phil and Diane chose to spec their truck to answer the needs of a specific carrier. They made the right choice for themselves.
If someone is just starting out and hasn't driven for an owner (or two) first, they might find that they don't fit well with the carrier. Not all carriers are set up to use the 16' reefer to it's full capacity. I don't mean freight capacity, but wallet capacity. If you are going to have a specialty truck your carrier needs a specialty customer base.