Oxford Tragedy: Parents and School Failed

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Online
By now everybody has read about this awful situation, and it's probably worse than the Sandy Hook shooting in 2012 because it was completely avoidable. This kid obviously had mental problems which the school administrators and especially the parents knew about. To think that the parents bought this kid a deadly weapon as an early Christmas gift to play with is inconceivable, and we can't help but wonder if one or both of them have mental issues as well. Worse than that is the fact the school knew the kid was prone to violence. A teacher saw his gruesome drawings the day before the shooting and the parents were called in for a conference the next day. The school principal allowed the kid to remain at school after the parents declined to take him home, even though they knew he had access to the pistol and ammo. That same day he proceeded to kill four students and wound seven others; it's a miracle there weren't more victims.

It's fair to conclude that the kid is mentally ill if not criminally insane, and the parents are probably low IQ at best. But the school administrators should have recognized this threat that had red flags waving all over it. There have been past instances when kids have been sent home for aiming their finger while playing at school, yet the principal of Oxford High decided there was nothing to be concerned about and didn't send him home with the parents when he had the chance. Hopefully he'll face charges as well for criminal negligence.


 
  • Like
Reactions: danthewolf00

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Offline
By now everybody has read about this awful situation, and it's probably worse than the Sandy Hook shooting in 2012 because it was completely avoidable.

As was Sandy Hook:

Had Adam Lanza's mother not been a gun nut - who allowed her obviously mentally disturbed (which is documented) son access to firearms - Sandy Hook never would have happened as it did.

As for Oxford being worse ... there were 28 people killed (including Lanza himself) at Sandy Hook - including 20 children between 6 and 7 years of age.

So the calculation there, as to which was "worse", is a just bit ... "off" ... I'd say.

This kid obviously had mental problems which the school administrators and especially the parents knew about.

Well, keeping in mind that hindsight is 20/20, what actual evidence are you using to adduce that the school administrators would have been aware of any mental problems Ethan Crumbley may have had ?

They told the parents they needed to get him to counseling within 48 hours almost immediately (within a couple of hours) after a teacher saw the drawing.

To think that the parents bought this kid a deadly weapon as an early Christmas gift to play with is inconceivable, and we can't help but wonder if one or both of them have mental issues as well.

Well, Mom (at least) is a big gun nut ... and a Donald Trump fan, so there is that ...

Safe bet the father was probably onboard as well.

Worse than that is the fact the school knew the kid was prone to violence.

When ... and based on what exactly ?

A single drawing he made ?

He had no record of any discipline incidents at the high school before Monday apparently.

A teacher saw his gruesome drawings the day before the shooting and the parents were called in for a conference the next day.

And it was suggested to the parents that they take Junior home ... and they DECLINED and resisted doing so.

Hard to know at this point what all took place in that conference.

I'm sure there's much more info to come out on that though ... unlike Sandy Hook, all of the school personnel survived.

Were the parents asked if there were firearms in the home ... or whether Junior had access to them ?

If so, did they (falsely) say that the little horror show they jointly spawned didn't have access to any weapons ?

The school principal allowed the kid to remain at school after the parents declined to take him home, even though they knew he had access to the pistol and ammo.

Well, that's pretty much on the parents - the school had no knowledge of him having access to firearms and ammo as far as I can tell.

I sure haven't seen anything about the parents volunteering to the school administrators anything about recently purchasing a firearm for Momma's little baby.

In fact, it appears - according to the prosecutor - they (the parents) deliberately withheld that little bit of VITAL INFORMATION from school officials.

That same day he proceeded to kill four students and wound seven others; it's a miracle there weren't more victims.

Hard to call anything about this incident a miracle ... it's a complete tragedy ... which is directly attributable to irresponsible gun owners.

It's fair to conclude that the kid is mentally ill if not criminally insane, and the parents are probably low IQ at best.

No argument from me on the kid being mental or parents being low IQ.

(the kid being criminally insane is another matter however)

But the school administrators should have recognized this threat that had red flags waving all over it.

Perhaps.

It will be interesting to see how things unfold.

There have been past instances when kids have been sent home for aiming their finger while playing at school, yet the principal of Oxford High decided there was nothing to be concerned about

That's not accurate - they required that the parents seek counseling for him within 48 hours.

That isn't something a school insists on when "there is nothing to be concerned about".

and didn't send him home with the parents when he had the chance.

And that is deserving of a complete and thorough explanation.

Hopefully he'll face charges as well for criminal negligence.

Interesting that you seem to be more worked up over the school administrators ... rather than THE GUN OWNER PARENTS who:

1. Provided their minor child with a type of firearm which is easily concealable and has considerable firepower (semi-auto, easy to reload, law enforcement estimates he got off around 30 rounds)

2. Failed to adequately secure said firearm (and ammo) ... so that their little monster could not access it without direct parental supervision.

3. Failed to appear at their own arraignment, deserted their own son after things went bad, and apparently were attempting to flee to avoid apprehension after they failed to appear.

FWIW, I realize that the defense attorneys have to advocate for their clients, but I don't think the kind of smoke and BS they're trying to blow up everyones' rear ends is going have the effect they think it is.
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
Not sure they were fleeing apprehension. They may have been in hiding from threats and wanted to secure a safe passage with their lawyers to turn themselves in.
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
By now everybody has read about this awful situation, and it's probably worse than the Sandy Hook shooting in 2012 because it was completely avoidable. This kid obviously had mental problems which the school administrators and especially the parents knew about. To think that the parents bought this kid a deadly weapon as an early Christmas gift to play with is inconceivable, and we can't help but wonder if one or both of them have mental issues as well. Worse than that is the fact the school knew the kid was prone to violence. A teacher saw his gruesome drawings the day before the shooting and the parents were called in for a conference the next day. The school principal allowed the kid to remain at school after the parents declined to take him home, even though they knew he had access to the pistol and ammo. That same day he proceeded to kill four students and wound seven others; it's a miracle there weren't more victims.

It's fair to conclude that the kid is mentally ill if not criminally insane, and the parents are probably low IQ at best. But the school administrators should have recognized this threat that had red flags waving all over it. There have been past instances when kids have been sent home for aiming their finger while playing at school, yet the principal of Oxford High decided there was nothing to be concerned about and didn't send him home with the parents when he had the chance. Hopefully he'll face charges as well for criminal negligence.


One of the articles you provided mentioned they were disputing the claim the kid had free access to the weapon and that it was locked.
 
Last edited:

danthewolf00

Veteran Expediter
Offline
They hid just a few blocks from the Canada border in the warehouse district....
And had withdrawn 4k from the bank.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: RLENT

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
They hid just a few blocks from the Canada border in the warehouse district....
And had withdrawn 4k from the bank.....
Why did they take out 4 k and hide in a acquaintances building? Could it be that staying in their own house would be unsafe considering the anger at them for what their son did? It was also a surprise press conference by the local prosecutor. So much so that the county sheriff was not privy that it would be taking place and that charges against the parents were being filed.

 
Last edited:

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Online
Sorry but this has the same slime feeling as the asshat that ran over people on Thanksgiving.
What these two tragedies have in common is they both could've been prevented. The career criminal in Waukesha shouldn't have been set free by the liberal prosecutor in Milwaukee. The Crumbley kid should've been suspended by the school the day they met with his moronic parents, regardless of their objections. It's surprising that no one is talking about the culpability of that principal and the school board.
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
What these two tragedies have in common is they both could've been prevented. The career criminal in Waukesha shouldn't have been set free by the liberal prosecutor in Milwaukee. The Crumbley kid should've been suspended by the school the day they met with his moronic parents, regardless of their objections. It's surprising that no one is talking about the culpability of that principal and the school board.
The kid didn’t have much of a history of being a trouble maker at the school.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Online
The kid didn’t have much of a history of being a trouble maker at the school.
True, but the teacher found the picture he had drawn depicting bullets, blood, etc, and had a photo of it which should've been reason enough for suspension.
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
True, but the teacher found the picture he had drawn depicting bullets, blood, etc, and had a photo of it which should've been reason enough for suspension.
Maybe so. Certainly looks ominous considering what we know now and what happened. But kids probably draw a lot of weird stuff. And also look up all kinds of crap on their phones too. Are they suspended for that?
 
  • Like
Reactions: RLENT

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Offline
What these two tragedies have in common is they both could've been prevented. The career criminal in Waukesha shouldn't have been set free by the liberal prosecutor in Milwaukee. The Crumbley kid should've been suspended by the school the day they met with his moronic parents, regardless of their objections. It's surprising that no one is talking about the culpability of that principal and the school board.

I think the prosecutor has mentioned the possible culpability of school officials ... so not "no one" ...

When the kid was interrogated by the guidance counselor, he said the drawing was for a video game he was designing.

Per reporting (either ABC or NYT), principal wasn't even aware of the situation ... it was handled at the guidance counselor level.

Given that, it's a fairly safe bet that the school board wasn't in the loop either ... so I'm not sure how one gets to their "culpability" ...
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Offline
Not sure they were fleeing apprehension.

They were headed in the opposite direction ... away from Oakland County.

They may have been in hiding from threats and wanted to secure a safe passage with their lawyers to turn themselves in.

If they were feeling threatened they could have just driven to any police station and turned themselves in.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ragman

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Offline
The warehouse is miles from the border, let alone a few blocks.

Well, technically, the warehouse was probably a mile (or less) from the boarder.

But miles from an official border crossing point/port of entry.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ragman

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Offline
One of the articles you provided mentioned they were disputing the claim the kid had free access to the weapon and that it was locked.

Such a claim on the part of the parents would be self-serving at best.

What is their explanation for how he got the gun and the ammo, if they had it properly secured ?
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Offline
Ok so if they were not running how come bail was set to 1mill each?
It’s five hundred thousand each. But yes it is a lot. The Prosecutor believes they are because they didn’t immediately go and turn themselves in. Again though they may have feared for their safety because tensions are high. I think I read they tried to contact the prosecutor but she didn’t respond back and said that she is under no obligation to answer to them.
 
Top