Caterpillar to add 325 jobs in Sanford

[OntarioVanMan]

For the second time in less than a week, Caterpillar has chosen North Carolina as the site of a major corporate expansion.

The company said Thursday that it will enlarge its Sanford plant and create 325 jobs over the next four years. A Caterpillar supplier will also come to Sanford and create 160 jobs.

The decision has broader implications for the Triangle, as Caterpillar is receiving millions in state incentives that require the company to retain hundreds of existing jobs in Sanford and at another factory in Clayton.

Read more: Caterpillar to add 325 jobs in Sanford - Economy - NewsObserver.com

 

[greg334]

While we lost 71,000 plus jobs, an addition of 325 means little - especially when there are such tax incentives.

Makes one wonder if the Fair Tax would help out instead of flushing all this money down the drain for a job.

 

[LDB]

I'm happy for the 325 people but would like to see Caterpillar go broke, the lousy bunch of bums. That would have to be with no negative effect to anyone and I know that can't happen but I still wish Cat nothing but ill will and nothing but good to the Cat employees.

 

[xiggi]

While we lost 71,000 plus jobs, an addition of 325 means little - especially when there are such tax incentives.

Makes one wonder if the Fair Tax would help out instead of flushing all this money down the drain for a job.

The addition of 325 jobs means a heck of a lot to those people and their families. Jobs are not going to come back thousands in one place at a time it will be because of things like this happening repeatedly.

Corporations do not pay taxes and most incentives are not states just handing companies money, they involve the companies not paying all of the normal taxes for a period of time. If they do pay them the cost is just passed on to those who do business with them. Charge Cat more in taxes you pay more for that Cat engine. I have no problem with tax incentives when done right such as in this case where they have to keep x number of people working to maintain those breaks.

 

[greg334]

Xiggi,
First the cost per job to the state outstrips the advantage of the revenue produced by the individuals who lands the job. While it sounds great for those who are unemployed, the actual cost to them in lost tax revenue is not made up by them so they suffer more in the long run by reduced services.

Second, I would rather pay as an end user of Cat higher costs than to have people suffer. What I mean is the savings is not passed on to me and I will end up paying again through another means - federal taxes which will be sent to the area to make up for the loses from the tax incentives. So the front end costs of a few thousand more actually saves me more money later on.

This is happening here and other places. We get a job which is great but at the cost to the tax payer of $120k to $250k per job. The community suffers because there is no revenue and then there is a make up through other programs (in this area's case, federal stimulus funds are secured to make up the $200m short fall for the area).

It may be better to look at an overall tax change, the Fair Tax may be a good start. I would rather employ people without short term tax incentives and the competition of states/cities where they may lose again and we pay.

The reason I am saying all of this is because cities are suffering a lot more than what is being talked about. Today, Camden NJ announced the perminate closure of their library system, not just a temp closure but actual ridding the books through donations and burning and never to open again. When it becomes so bad that we are closing libraries, then we need to look at the bigger picture.

 

[xiggi]

In my personal opinion libraries should not be funded by taxes. I know there are many arguments pro and con but that is just my feelings on it.

 

[chefdennis]

Yeap its good for those people that will get the jobs, but i don't think those jobs or the Cat id going to have much impact on the economy in the Triangle....:

$134M in Triangle commercial loans delinquent - Triangle Business Journal

$134M in Triangle commercial loans delinquent

Triangle Business Journal - by Amanda Jones Hoyle
Thursday, August 5, 2010, 2:40pm EDT | Modified: Thursday, August 5, 2010, 5:09pm

The delinquency rate for Triangle commercial real estate loans backed by commercial mortgage-backed securities showed signs of moderating in July, according to a report from commercial mortgage data provider Trepp LLC.

More than $134.3 million in CMBS loans on properties in the Triangle region were 30 days or more delinquent in July. That’s down from a delinquency of $166.9 million in CMBS loans the month prior.

Read more at the link above...

 

[chefdennis]

LOL, didn't have to "go" looking at all, seen it yesterday on a financal site I go to daily...and yes it the impact will be by those being emloyed will spend money in the area, but not enough to make a difference...and chances are the Cat isn't payng the are a dime in taxes .... they probably got millions in abatement to enlarge the plant and hire the people...

And it isn't negative...it i a fact of the area and while it is "moderating" at this point, the 4th quarter of this yr will most likely wipe that out and even add to the delinquencies....

 

[chefdennis]

lol there is nothing to wait a darn minute about...i am fine with them getting any help they can from the business standpoint...get all you can and then some...the facts are when the city county or state give tax abatements to a company it does little to help with the tax base or the economy other then what the employees will spend within the area....most tax abatements that go to the devolopment of foctories are in the form of "forgiving" property taxes and the posponement of payment in taxes on inventories and most of those taxes go to the schools in most cities...so abating them away hurts the schools which in turn hurt the property values with leads to less devolopment...in good times, citoes can for the most part get by that, but not when times are as they are now....

 

[greg334]

In my personal opinion libraries should not be funded by taxes. I know there are many arguments pro and con but that is just my feelings on it.

I agree and most of the libraries that were built outside of the major cities were built by people who gave money with the purpose of building them for the people. Carnegie is one who build hundreds of libraries across the country, Morgan another, Ford, Cousins, Dodge and so on. They are responsible for thousands of libraries.

When the art's and fart's groups were left out, they turned to government in the 30's to provide funding so the "artist" could produce worthless art and be able to live which has turned into a mess.

See the problem I have is that we worry about art, like here the Detroit Institute of Arts is well funded and makes some fantastic purchases while across the street the Detroit Public Library is underfunded, had sold a lot of its collections and with the mis-management let a large amount of rare books rot in a leaky basement because no one took care of the building, which is really more important?

AND now with these billionaires claiming to care, they are taking 50% of their fortunes and giving it to select charities to help people mostly outside this country, not the country that allowed them to build their fortunes. It is these billionaires who should be stepping up, building schools and libraries and helping the country they live in.

 

[greg334]

Er, it used to be for every job created, 4 would also be created. I guess the thing about productivity may be something to think about

This is not a short term pain, but a long term pain. The point we are trying to make is in some areas, like Detroit and research triangle don't really benefit from these giveaways. The company does.

GM is another one. They have this great place - GM Tech Center - which could have housed everyone who is sitting at the Ford built RenCen but because Detroit is so desperate for tax revenue, when the subject of consolidating operations were brought up, it became a race issue.

Another example is Compuware and Quicken Loans, the former moved down into Detroit, the latter is moving - both are enjoying millions and millions of tax payer giveaways but creating ZERO jobs. The communities they left now have to deal with the lost revenue while the workers are faced with city taxes and a commute through a war zone.

It doesn't seem to matter, the two jobs that are now created may be gone next year if something happens to the economy and Cat closes shop.

 

[greg334]

Nest year or five years, it takes 7 years for an area to actually move forward with revenue so they are still safe. There is always an out-clause put into these agreements.

 

[letzrockexpress]

You bunch of miserable hypocrites who blast Cat and belittle expansion will be right there to haul their freight if called upon to do so. Those of you who think Cat is so horrible should put your money where your mouth is not haul their freight. I have taken a similar stand against GM. I have refused to haul ANY GM freight since the bankruptcy and will not do so, ever again.

 

[greg334]

Hypocrites?

I guess.

I would rather see Cat expand without incentives because it makes a better economy for all involved. I am glad someone is getting the work but I worry about who is it going to cost in the long run.

Wouldn't it be better to fix the problems that prevent the jobs being created in the first place?

Isn't taxes one of the big big issues with all these companies?

GM is another issue altogether, Cat didn't get special treatment like GM did, they didn't take the approach GM took on trying to recover market share or crying about the Chinese construction equipment taking over. Today's short visit to GM was an eye opener - the money they are p*ssing away makes it look like the good old times have returned and not one person can answer why.

Don't haul for GM, good. I won't buy from them ever again, let alone haul for them.

 

[LDB]

I'll haul Cat again. If I'm lucky it will be like last time, a part for a line that's down and costs $30k per minute of down time. Last time I got the part to them an hour and 57 minutes ahead of schedule. Next time I'll get the part to them one minute before my protect time. Let's see, 116 minutes at $30k each, $3,480,000 extra expense to the lousy bums.

 

[chefdennis]

hypocrites?? I didn't see anywhere where anyone said it was a bad deal that Cat was expanding...I even sad they should take as much cash from the the state as they can get....what i said was that while it is great for the people getting the jobs and for the company, it isn't going to help the economy of the area.....

 

[letzrockexpress]

hypocrites?? I didn't see anywhere where anyone said it was a bad deal that Cat was expanding...I even sad they should take as much cash from the the state as they can get....what i said was that while it is great for the people getting the jobs and for the company, it isn't going to help the economy of the area.....

I think someone did....not you though...