Canada PAPS

Weave · Nov 14, 2004

One of my reliable informants just told me that a PAPS barcode will be a REQUIREMENT to bring freight into the USA from Canada as of Nov. 15th. I basically told him I didn't belive him, and he got really cross with me. Does anyone know of any truth to what I was told?
-Weave-

Tony · Nov 14, 2004

I asked a US Customs officer and got the standard response, I don't know. Then asked my broker and they said yes you need Paps(my carrier has still not got me a firm answer). So that's all I can offer, but I would sure like a definite answer also.

Weave · Nov 14, 2004

Thanks Tony. I checked with a few brokers and with US customs, and it is true. As of Nov 15th, no freight leaves Canada without a carrier provided PAPS barcode. This barcode must be faxed to the broker by the shipper, and freight will clear at the booth if the barcode is OK. Only if the barcode does not work at the border must you go in and see the broker. But yes, PAPS is now a requirement. My carrier has yet to provide the barcodes either.
-Weave-

chetjester · Nov 16, 2004

We just had a driver pick up in Belleville, ON without the ability to use PAPS. He exited at Kingston, and went inside where they processed him and he was out pretty fast.

Since we pick up in that area often, I will probably never drive back to Windsor to cross considering the line was 5 hours long last night.

RobA · Nov 16, 2004

>We just had a driver pick up in Belleville, ON without the
>ability to use PAPS. He exited at Kingston, and went inside
>where they processed him and he was out pretty fast.
>
>Since we pick up in that area often, I will probably never
>drive back to Windsor to cross considering the line was 5
>hours long last night.

Well, I would think that the crossing at Kingston (I'm guessing you're refering to the Thousand Islands Bridge)would always be quicker as less traffic goes that way.
It sounds like US Customs just decided to "go" with PAPS whether or not anyone was ready.

chetjester · Nov 16, 2004

I always thought it would be more difficult to enter Canada as a US citizen carrying freight. Just an ego thing, I guess.

But, returning to my country (USA) is so much more difficult. I don't know what the deal is. Why do I have to pay the US a $5.00 custom fee? Why do they make is so hard? Are they just being jerks?

Weave · Nov 17, 2004

I got my info from brokers and customs at the Peace Bridge in Buffalo. It's no longer US customs, it's the Department of Homeland Security!!

(They were quick to point out the name change to me.) I don't know how they could enforce the PAPS thing now if nobody was told about it, there has to be some sort of transition or ease in period. When I crossed in Detroit the week before last, there were no signs or ? in either the broker building or cus...DHS

The strictness is due to 9/11, but it's getting way too strict getting into the USA. Better have a birth cirtificate too. I was asked for it in Detroit for the first time with my prior cross and never before in 7 years.

-Weave-

chetjester · Nov 17, 2004

You're right about the warning. I didn't find out until a week before it went into effect at the Pre Processing Center in London, ON.

Regarding identity, I have a birth certificate, a Passport and my FAST Card. I can't imagine what more they might need.

OntarioVanMan · Nov 17, 2004

Sorry guys but companies were informed about 3 months ago of the new PAPS requirements. Your carriers should have gotten a bulletin from Homeland security...DX was prepared with its customers as were most of the drivers.

Edit: on hindsight maybe DHS only notified Canadian carriers? Which wouldn't surprise me any..eh?

dieseldiva · Nov 17, 2004

Don't forget your current vaccination records for any pets on board, we've been asked for those as well.

Of all the things I've lost in my life, I think I miss my mind the most!!

highway star · Nov 18, 2004

You will also be able to clear freight using FAST. I think it's only the big three right now. BRASS barcodes can still be used in some cases if the driver has a FAST card and the info has been faxed ahead.

Weave · Nov 23, 2004

Or... our company officials got the bulletin and didn't read it, no surprise there either:7
-Weave-

redbeard2001 · Nov 27, 2004

hi everybody allfreight going to the us. has to have a paps carrier bar code attached to the cargo manifest and the invoice.also the driver must have a fast card to use it and it should be faxed 2hrs. prior to arriving at the border.

highway star · Nov 28, 2004

The FAST system is also in use and does not require a manifest or a customs invoice. You also can use PAPS right now without a FAST card, but you may be delayed because of it.

terryandrene · Dec 1, 2004

On 30 Nov we entered the USofA at Port Huron with nothing more than a customs invoice and an inward manifest. I did not use PAPS. The US side broker did the usual magic to get us cleared.

OntarioVanMan · Dec 4, 2004

Yeah if you READ the poster it says REQUIRED but at the bottm it says without it, you MAY be delayed or refused entry. Conflicking statements?
Yes but I expect nothing from Homeland Security!

Heres one, 2 Saturdays ago I was Refused entry (first time in 2 years)
Reason? No Importers IRS number! Now since the exporter was paying for everything, The exporting company has never included it on any documents when theres no cost to the importer.
Apparently I wasn't the only one caught up in all this fiasco there must have been 20 or 30 of us there this day and all the same thing!
I felt for the OTR guys cuz most had deliveries for Monday or so and the importers were closed for the weekend. They were scurring from broker to broker having them check thier databases for IRS numbers.
So the broker says this rule has always been around but is never usually required ONLY at the officers discretion!!!

Both U.S and Canadian officers have too much discretion. In this case it was unfair and costly to the exporter, importer and driver especially on a Saturday! Just cuz some officer didn't get laid the night before! Rules are rules and should be enforced on a consistent basis, things would go smoother for all concerned, not on a fly by your pants system.

redbeard2001 · Dec 7, 2004

It seems the customs brokers are finally getting with the program.On Dec. 06 I faxed my PAPS to Livingston at Lewiston Ny.When i got to the booth I was shocked when he told me it cleared.The next morning i did the exact same thing at Detroit Mi.and it also cleared.Hopefully this will continue? Maybe Livingston has turned a new page?:+

Trucker don · Dec 9, 2004

>
>
>
>Well, I would think that the crossing at Kingston (I'm
>guessing you're refering to the Thousand Islands
>Bridge)would always be quicker as less traffic goes that
>way.
>It sounds like US Customs just decided to "go" with PAPS
>whether or not anyone was ready.
This may be old news now, but if you have a FAST Card. The line Release (BRASS) will work. If NO FAST Card, Then one must use PAPS with the shipment coming into the USA. You must Give them enough time for the Broker to get it in the system. Fort Erie, Ontario Ex 5 on the QEW. On the 401 Exit 177 a, North Talbot road. Near London as well as in Windsor. The PPC (Pre Processing Center) will set up your paps for you. London Better as it will give you more time to get to border. Again I faxed Paperwork from Brockville,On to Peace Bridge, Detroit. I called 2 hours later. They could not find paper work. I said It was fax from Shipper. I called 2 hours later..Paperwork found. That was 4 hours.

Don

iheartfaye · Dec 11, 2004

>One of my reliable informants just told me that a PAPS
>barcode will be a REQUIREMENT to bring freight into the USA
>from Canada as of Nov. 15th. I basically told him I didn't
>belive him, and he got really cross with me. Does anyone
>know of any truth to what I was told?
>-Weave-

I crossed at Windsor/Detroit just 3 days ago and there was some interesting PAPS information going around.

Per US Customs, as of Dec 15th if you hit the booth and your PAPS does not clear you must show a fax confirmation proving you faxed the broker or be fined $5000.

The flip side is that if you show the confirmation and it is over an hour old and it does not clear the broker will be fined $5000. I sent a qualcomm to my carrier to check into this and I have not heard anything back yet.

Brian

redbeard2001 · Dec 11, 2004

I have a letter from the CANADIAN COURIER & MESSENGER ASSOC.stating that under 19CFR 123.92 may lead to denial of entry and/or monetary penalty.After Nov. 30 the potential fines are extremely onerous at $5000 USD for a first infraction and $10000 USD for subsequent infractions against the same driver. It goes on to say by JAN.31 2005. Entery will be denied for any truck arriving at the border that is non compliant.A penalty/liquidated damage will also be issued as appropriate.There is more information at www.CBP.gov key words Truck Trade Act and FAST Hope this helps everyone.:9 :9