Sanitize the War?

**Turtle** · 02-28-2009, 11:02 AM

You can blame Obama if you like, but it's important.

After December, the Christmas cheer died down. The e-mail messages were all short and sad -- the only thing that changed was the number of casualties. First it was one. Then two. Then four. Then seven. On April 7, 2004, the week of the bloody battle in Fallujah, the body count was 22. That is when she e-mailed the photo to me depicting rows and rows and rows of American-flag draped coffins. I took one look at it and my heart sank. I had known there was still "conflict" in Iraq. I didn't know there was an all-out war. Without a moment's hesitation, I phoned The Seattle Times.

**chefdennis** · 02-28-2009, 12:53 PM

Ok, my 2 sons have fought in the ME, both serving more then one tour and after the Military, the youngest went to work for a Military contractor for 18 months. By Gods grace and the training they both got from your military and their own instincts, they both came out better people then when they left here. All in one piece and healthy. So we never had to deal with this issue.

Now, we all seen these pictures before, viet nam showed them to us regularly. I have seen them of soldiers in this war in the homes of friends, at church and at other invited to occasions.

While a Flag draped coffin is a moving site and a group of them does show a large loss, it doesn't mean anymore it the picture is of 1 or 15, its still loss. It doesn't matter if it is a plane full or 1 , it is personal for someone, those families that are seeing a plane full don't see the numbers, at that moment they are wondering where is their family member and wanting to be has close as possible. It is personal, for each of them.

I agree with Layout, this president isn't doing this out of the kindness of his heart, this is a political move that he will use when the time is to his benefit. He is no friend of the military, never has been, never will be.

While I do understand the privacy of this moment, I do agree that it is up to the family to decide. But if this is everu abused by 1 single reporter, the whole deal is off, and they press gets blocked out once again....

**layoutshooter** · 02-28-2009, 01:14 PM

Turtle, this has been a global war since day one. No one is more sorry than I at the waste of life any war is. That is one of the reasons I spent 20 years doing everything I could to insure that this country avoided them. Our polititons and news media has been at best mis-leading us for as long as I can remember. In my opinion, they are just lying through thier teeth. If we don't meet this threat head on there will be more and more deaths. One is too many. If you want to see numbers like we had in WW2 just continue down the path we are now headed. It took over 40 years to defeat Soviet Russia, and hundreds of thousands of lives. It was NOT a cold war. Now we are letting them, China and anyone else who wants These United States to go away back into the game. Why do so many people in this country think that if we just make nice everything will be hunky dorey? It won't. We can fight them overseas or on our own soil. Take your pick. I prefere to take them on over there. If I was young now I would be in this fray all the way. If I were in charge I would be prosecuting this war like Sherman's March to the sea. The one thing I could promise, is that these kinds of pics would NEVER be used by ANYONE for propaganda. Those brave kids and thier families deserve far more than that. I grieve for thier parents/wifes/brothers/sons and daughters. I cannot imagine how anyone must feel at a loss like that. I honor thier sacrifice to keep me and mine safe. I do not trust this administration or congress to do the same. Nothing they have said or done has lead me to believe that they have anything but contempt for the military. As to the media, Pravda would be proud. Layoutshooter

**Turtle** · 02-28-2009, 01:57 PM

It's not an easy or clear-cut issue. On the one hand, we have people who want to suppress information because they’re afraid of the political ramifications. The flag draped caskets are not identified, so the only real reason for suppressing them is to sanitize the war to one degree or another.

On the other hand, the media ban on such photos was put in place because of the media's irresponsibility with these types of photos (well, maybe not these types of photos, more for the striking, horrific images of Vietnam). The media is leftist, duh, so you know darn good and well that they will be used to make leftist propaganda statements.

Still, Americans should see that freedom is not free and has a very high cost. I do think that in a free society that it is a very dangerous thing to have all of our information be watered down and packaged up real pretty by our government and then handed to us on a tarnished silver platter.

Defense Secretary Gates actually approached the issue more than a year ago, so this is hardly all Obama. It's easy to look solely at Obama, especially if you're not an Obama fan. But it's not a good idea to let hatred cloud the truth and the real issues. Back in January Walter Jones, R-NC, introduced the Fallen Hero Commemoration Act that would have forced the Pentagon to allow media access at Dover. The policy of no media absolutely protects the privacy of the families and friends of the deceased, but likewise the photos of of returning caskets both honor the returning servicemen and remind the public that the nation is at war.

When it's out of sight, it's out of mind, and my own personal opinion is that it's a disgrace that these men are literally snuck back into the country in the dead of night, under the cover of darkness, and out of range of the camera lens. Whenever a plane carrying coffins lands at Dover, it ought to be a big deal, 'cause it is a big deal. But even the families themselves are divided over the issue. Some don't want the media to have any access at all, others want the media there to record the reverence and honor given to the returning solders by the receiving military.

**layoutshooter** · 02-28-2009, 02:42 PM

You are correct, nothing is easy about this subject. I do have a very healthy fear of Obama, not hatred. I don't know the man. I to hate, or whatever you wish to call it, most everything he stands for. His beliefs are what I spent 20 years defending against.

I have no wish to diminish the sacrifice of our fallen soldiers. They deserve all the honor that they can get. I don't pretend to know how to strike the balance between protecting the families from press using those pics from propaganda and the need to pay homage to those who died. We do need to know just what is going on. Every lost life is sad. It is even more sad that after all these years the world still has not learned to live without wars. It is even sadder that we know from history that the type of threat we are facing today never goes away until someone stands up and stops it.

Maybe the answer lies with the families and NOT the media or the government. IF a family REQUESTS coverage they should get it. I worry about the press being given access to hound these families in a time of grief. They do not need that kind of thing. NO GRAVE SIDE protests!!! That is WAY over the line.

I have no wish to hand cuff the freedom of the press, it is on of the most important safe guards to a free sociaty. The press has a grave responsibility to use that power correctly. That means, no bias in reporting. Just the facts. No propaganda. There are many sides to every story. They are required by all that is right to just report so the POEPLE can make up thier own minds. They are failing at this. It is not good for our Republic. We should demand a free, HONEST and UN-Biased press just as we should demand honest polititions. We have allowed this to happen. Layoutshooter

**Turtle** · 02-28-2009, 03:17 PM

Let me apologize for the use of the word hate. It was the wrong word to use. More appropriate would have been "disdain, contempt, rancor and repugnance".

A prominent news reporter for ABC News (I think) was honored, oh, I dunno, 4 or 5 years ago, and she was asked why she wanted to be a journalist. I won't name her, one, because I can't remember her friggin' name (her face is burned into my memory, tho), and two, she's typical of today's media reporters and anchors. Her answer both chilled me and disgusted me.

"I wanted to help change the world."

Journalists aren't supposed to change the world, they're merely supposed to report what happens on it. I think of her quote often when I read an article or watch the news.

"Maybe the answer lies with the families and NOT the media or the government. IF a family REQUESTS coverage they should get it. I worry about the press being given access to hound these families in a time of grief. They do not need that kind of thing. NO GRAVE SIDE protests!!! That is WAY over the line."

I couldn't agree more. There have been families who wanted to video the receiving ceremony of their son, but were not allowed to do so. I personally know one family that this happened to. Gates has mentioned that this is a problem, so I hope it's addressed in a manner in which the press must get clearances from someone in the military, who in turn gets their marching orders from the families.