Obama Snubs Nation's Heros

[chefdennis]

you play symmetics, but its not becoming of you. The fact is there was a Red White and Blue Heros Ball, it did benefit the USO and TAPs They are Named as PARTENERS, it does have a corp. sponsor. And it did happen and the man in the presidents office didn't go.

As to the "fake e-mail', turtle, it really is beneath you to think you are the only one thats right and everyone else on the web is wrong, lying, writing fake e-mails and just plain has it in for osamaba (yes I do, but not the whole world lol) that they are just putting stuff out that is totally fake and false....mistaken in facts, sure, deliberate lying, sorry I don't think you are the only one on the web that right.....

PS: as to the e-mail being a fake, we will find out, the phone # listed works, it is the direct line to mr roberts, i left a message, hopefully i'll get a call on fri...

and now i must take leave as i have to run up to alliance Neb. from KC Mo.

[Pilgrim]

Well, I never said there was no Red White and Blue Hero's Ball Sponsored by the American Legion. It's a true statement, but I never said it.

I said there was no Salute to Heroes Ball sponsored by the American Legion, and there wasn't.

And the Red White and Blue Ball didn't just have a different sponsor this year.

It's a completely different ball and has never had anything to do with the Salute to Heroes Ball that the American Legion has sponsored. It's an important Ball, I think, but keep in mind that the POTUS didn't go to the very-first-ever Red White and Blue Ball in 2005, either.

This year's Red White and Blue Ball was not, absolutely not, sponsored by the USO (the Metro Washington chapter, anyway) and TAPS. The Ball was held specifically as a charity benefit for those two organizations. It had corporate sponsorship. It had the same sponsor this year that it did 4 years ago, namely the Citizens Helping Heroes. Both this year and four years ago, it raised the funds to pay for the event through corporate funding. CHH is a very worthwhile organization, as are their two primary charities.

There were no special interest or benefit Balls on the Presidential Inauguration Committee's list.

"kind of disingenous on your part don't you think!?!?"

Nope. What's disingenuous about it?


Originally Posted by Turtle
He didn't go because there was no American Legion sponsored Salute to Heroes Ball to go to.

I'm shocked. I can fake an e-mail with the best of 'em.

Have you noticed how silent TSO has been of late? No scans of anything that would substantiate his being there. Nothing.

What part of "it's all made up" do you not understand? The whole thing was made up to make Obama look bad. Apparently, many think Obama will be unable to do that on his own.

Find a link, if you can, to the American Legion's Web site that talks about any of this.

For your reading enjoyment:
At inaugural ball, Obama pledges to serve troops | Stars and Stripes

Here's the link to the American Legion's Public Relations Division and their Media Contacts which includes Craig Roberts:

American Legion

Since his contact info was readily available, I e-mailed Mr. Roberts and asked him if the Salute To Heroes Ball took place this year and if either Pres. Obama or VP Biden attended. He promptly responded, and the following is the body of his reply (italics mine - and if you think this is also made up, you're free to contact him yourself):

In answer to your inquiry:
The American Legion, as it has on every inauguration evening since 1953, hosted the Salute to Heroes Inaugural Banquet & Ball on January 20th. The quadrennial event is co-sponsored with fourteen veterans service and military service organizations and honors recipients of the Medal of Honor. Forty-seven of these heroes attended this year’s event which was held in the Renaissance Washington DC Hotel.
President Obama was invited but did not attend. Vice-President Joe Biden did appear, however, and was very warmly received. The new President’s absence was understandable considering the unprecedented logistical challenges presented by the vastly increased number of visitors to this inauguration and the necessary attendant security measures. The American Legion, as an organization, does not feel offended or “snubbed.”
Thank you,
Craig
Craig Roberts
Media Relations Manager
The American Legion
1608 K Street, NW
Washington, DC 20006
202.263.2982 (direct)

In spite of the forgiving nature of Mr. Roberts' statement, it's impossible to ignore these facts: (1) The event occurred (2) Obama didn't go, in spite of the fact that Biden was able to overcome the "logistical challenges" to get there. Was it a snub? I guess that's in the eye of the beholder. But to be the first president since 1953 to blow off this event is pretty telling.

[Turtle]

you play symmetics, but its not becoming of you. The fact is the was a Red White and Blue Heros Ball, it did benefit the USO and TAPs They are Named as PARTENERS, it does have a corp. sponsor. And it did happen and the man in the presidents office didn't go.

I'm not playing semantics and you know it. The facts as above are exactly as I stated them, as well as the fact that the president 4 years ago didn't go to it, either.

As to the "fake e-mail', turtle, it really is beneath you to thunk you ar the only one thats right and everyone else on the web is wrong, lying, writing fake e-mails and just plain as at in for osamaba (yes I do, but not the whole world lol) that they are just putting stuff out that is totally fake and false....mistaken in facts, sure, deliberate lying, sorry I don't think you are the only one on the web that right.....

The whole thing beginning with TSO's original post was a fake. He made it up, and he got caught doing it. You think someone wouldn't fake an e-mail to silence the doubters? No one would make up a lie to cover their butt on another lie or to foster a lie they favor? Puhleeze.

I've been on the Internet since before it was even called the Internet, and I have learned how to spot a fake e-mail from a mile away. And that one's not even a good one. It tries too hard. It looks a little too good to be true. It answers all of the questions a little too precisely, and touches all of the issues surrounding this mess, and offers not once scintilla of additional information, not one little tid bit about the event other than what is at issue on the Blogs. Nothing. Not even an "It was well attended". And the "was warmly received" was a bit over the top for a formal reply from Media Relations. It answers the questions, exactly as one would want then to be answered, so that when anyone reads it then instantly all of their doubts would disappear. Poof. See? I told you so. Nya, nya, nya.

Also, the Salutation and Closing are inconsistence with the form used inside the e-mail, something that would be very unlikely to occur considering the formality of the content from the Media Relations department of the Legion. But it might.

The person who copied and pasted the e-mail, headers included for effect, left out one critical component that makes it impossible for him to have received the e-mail, tho, and that's cetainly one big red flag of authenticity.

When you take all of these together, it casts serious doubt as to the authenticity of the e-mail. The names, e-mail addresses and phone numbers can be found on most of the press releases from the Legion, and certainly on their Web Site. What you can't find on their Web site, though, is any mention of the Salute to Heroes Ball that they sponsored this year. Not one word.

No, I don't think everyone on the Web is wrong, lying, writing fake e-mails and has it in for Obama. But some Bloggers do. And some, without a doubt, unquestionably, absolutely will put stuff out there that is totally fake and false. TSO's one of them. And people read it and they believe it. Then we've got dear Julie from the Cleveland Dealer yankin' stuff out of news stories from four years ago and inserting it into today's story as if it were true. Sorry, that's not a mistake in facts. That's makin' shіt up no matter how you want to spin it.

Then all this crap takes on a life of its own, spreads across the net like Ebola, gets read by bazillions of people, and because they read it on the Internet, it's real.

Well, it's not real. It's made up! I don't care how badly you wish it to be true, it's still made up.

The posting of now a second letter, with identical wording, with the new addition of even more too good to be true answers that should shut people up. But, it now has a different Salutation, and a different Closing, which is VERY inconsistent with a Media Relations department.

I'm pretty sure that letter wasn't sent to you, Chef, nor are the accompanying comments from you. That's cut-n-pasted all the way. If it is an e-mail to you, I'd love to see the full headers of that e-mail. hehe

Someone saw the first letter and decided there was one little question left unanswered, so they piled a little extra make-up on the made-up and there ya go.

It's classic. It really is. The "and if you think this is also made up, you're free to contact him yourself" line is one that is betting that people don't, and if someone does, and posts a response, the replies to that will be, "You made that up."

Unless you can come up with a link to a credible news organization that knows a thing or two about fact checking, or a link to the American Legion Web site that talks about their Ball this year to salute CMH winners, you might as well just chalk this one up to being gullible and biting the bait hard, and let it go.

And you might want to consider being a little more skeptical of things you read on the Internet in the future. But you won't, because you're part of it. You come to conclusions with no evidence, and you believe what you want to believe regardless of whether it is true or not, simply because you prefer your beliefs to the truth. I prefer the truth.

[jmore1276]

First. Maybe He's actually working on important things like BILLS that will get our veterans better treatment when they come home instead of cutting there benefits and letting the VA hospitals fall into tatters.

Second. Consider the source. For someone who claims he was in the military he sure seems to have the OPPOSITE of the "NO MAN LEFT BEHIND PHILOSOPHY". From what I've read from chef...it's "me me me"...screw the other guy.

[jmore1276]

He also seems to despise Unions who are one of the largest supporters of veterans not only financially but in terms of awareness. Ever Notice the POW-MIA Flags at the plants? The T-shirts. The support groups for War Veterans. I know...he was in an ARMY once when he was 19 and never looked back. He might have had to see that guy asking him not to leave him behind. OOOOHHHHH.

[Turtle]

Well, if I consider the source too carefully, I run the risk of letting it become personal, and any sort of civil discussion would get flushed. You have to keep it to the topic at hand, and not introduce too many extraneous things from outside this thread that only cloud the issues at hand. Personal attacks serve no purpose. It's best to try and stick to what was posted, rather than to who posted it.

[chefdennis]

I had to stop for fuel here, so... Turtle, you need to sit back, take a deep breath and chili, you are losing it..I didn't get any letter and I didn't post any letter..... I made a phone call and left a message to a answering machine that had a voice recording my a man who said he was Craig Roberts Media Relations Manager for The American Legion. As I said, I hope to get a call back tommorrow. Again you need to relax here, you are now accusing people of things they didn't do .......kind of like lying and making things up......

Back on the road to Neb!

[jmore1276]

Well, if I consider the source too carefully, I run the risk of letting it become personal, and any sort of civil discussion would get flushed. You have to keep it to the topic at hand, and not introduce too many extraneous things from outside this thread that only cloud the issues at hand. Personal attacks serve no purpose. It's best to try and stick to what was posted, rather than to who posted it.

Point taken.

When I said chef...I meant the Far Right in general. :-) I'll keep it general in the future. I have met my nemesis though and it's fun.

[Turtle]

Sorry, my bad.

That was a typo on my part. It should have been addressed towards Pilgrim in that paragraph, but I guess I still had you on my mind.

I'm not lying and making things up or accusing anyone of something they didn't do. I simply made a mental slip-up akin to my Muslim faith. I've done it before and I'll probably do it again.

It is also quite likely that is was a casualty of replying to what was posted, rather than to who posted it. I rarely address someone by name in a posting directly, and while I knew Pilgrim posted it, I must have mentally discarded that information because I had been addressing most of the replies in your direction, tho not necessarily to you specifically. When I typed in your name instead of Pilgrim, it was a mistake simply due to the fact that I'm dealing with a lot of information here, and some of it got jumbled up a bit.

I certainly hope that such a blunder won't distract you, Pilgrim or others from the issues here.

[Pilgrim]

I'm not playing semantics and you know it. The facts as above are exactly as I stated them, as well as the fact that the president 4 years ago didn't go to it, either.

He went to this one - it was his FIRST STOP:

President thanks veterans for service during inaugural ball

President thanks veterans for service during inaugural ball
WASHINGTON -- President Bush addresses supporters at the "Salute to Heroes" inaugural ball here Jan. 20. The president and first lady Laura Bush made the event their first stop on a tour of inaugural galas. The ball, held since 1953, honors recipients of the Medal of Honor, the nation's highest military award, and the newly inaugurated president. (Department of Defense photo by Army Sgt. 1st Class Doug Sample)

by Army Sgt. 1st Class Doug Sample
American Forces Press Service

1/21/2005 - WASHINGTON -- President Bush and first lady Laura Bush were greeted with resounding cheers as they made the first stop of their whirlwind tour of inaugural galas here Jan. 20.

At the "Salute to Heroes" inaugural ball, hundreds of veterans from across the country, along with their wives and families, greeted the president with a resounding show of support.

Vice President Dick Cheney and his wife, Lynne, stopped in later as they made their way through the inaugural circuit.

The whole thing beginning with TSO's original post was a fake. He made it up, and he got caught doing it. You think someone wouldn't fake an e-mail to silence the doubters? No one would make up a lie to cover their butt on another lie or to foster a lie they favor? Puhleeze.

I've been on the Internet since before it was even called the Internet, and I have learned how to spot a fake e-mail from a mile away. And that one's not even a good one. It tries too hard. It looks a little too good to be true. It answers all of the questions a little too precisely, and touches all of the issues surrounding this mess, and offers not once scintilla of additional information, not one little tid bit about the event other than what is at issue on the Blogs. Nothing. Not even an "It was well attended". And the "was warmly received" was a bit over the top for a formal reply from Media Relations. It answers the questions, exactly as one would want then to be answered, so that when anyone reads it then instantly all of their doubts would disappear. Poof. See? I told you so. Nya, nya, nya.

Also, the Salutation and Closing are inconsistence with the form used inside the e-mail, something that would be very unlikely to occur considering the formality of the content from the Media Relations department of the Legion. But it might.

The person who copied and pasted the e-mail, headers included for effect, left out one critical component that makes it impossible for him to have received the e-mail, tho, and that's cetainly one big red flag of authenticity.

When you take all of these together, it casts serious doubt as to the authenticity of the e-mail. The names, e-mail addresses and phone numbers can be found on most of the press releases from the Legion, and certainly on their Web Site. What you can't find on their Web site, though, is any mention of the Salute to Heroes Ball that they sponsored this year. Not one word.

No, I don't think everyone on the Web is wrong, lying, writing fake e-mails and has it in for Obama. But some Bloggers do. And some, without a doubt, unquestionably, absolutely will put stuff out there that is totally fake and false. TSO's one of them. And people read it and they believe it. Then we've got dear Julie from the Cleveland Dealer yankin' stuff out of news stories from four years ago and inserting it into today's story as if it were true. Sorry, that's not a mistake in facts. That's makin' shіt up no matter how you want to spin it.

Then all this crap takes on a life of its own, spreads across the net like Ebola, gets read by bazillions of people, and because they read it on the Internet, it's real.

Well, it's not real. It's made up! I don't care how badly you wish it to be true, it's still made up.

The posting of now a second letter, with identical wording, with the new addition of even more too good to be true answers that should shut people up. But, it now has a different Salutation, and a different Closing, which is VERY inconsistent with a Media Relations department.

I'm pretty sure that letter wasn't sent to you, Chef, nor are the accompanying comments from you. That's cut-n-pasted all the way. If it is an e-mail to you, I'd love to see the full headers of that e-mail. hehe

Someone saw the first letter and decided there was one little question left unanswered, so they piled a little extra make-up on the made-up and there ya go.

It's classic. It really is. The "and if you think this is also made up, you're free to contact him yourself" line is one that is betting that people don't, and if someone does, and posts a response, the replies to that will be, "You made that up."

I don't gamble and I don't bluff - no need to. I also don't post phony e-mails, your self-proclaimed analytical expertise notwithstanding. See below.

Unless you can come up with a link to a credible news organization that knows a thing or two about fact checking, or a link to the American Legion Web site that talks about their Ball this year to salute CMH winners, you might as well just chalk this one up to being gullible and biting the bait hard, and let it go.

At the risk of being redundant, below is the contact info for Mr. Roberts from the American Legion website; below that is the link to the American Legion - it includes the direct phone number for Mr. Roberts, and also the link that reads "Contact Craig Roberts". If you click on this link it will enable you to send him an e-mail. I would encourage everyone (or instead, perhaps a neutral moderator) on this site to call or e-mail Mr Roberts and ask him if this event took place and if Obama attended.

Craig Roberts
Media Relations Manager
The American Legion
National Headquarters Washington, DC
(202) 263-2982
Contact Craig Roberts

American Legion

And you might want to consider being a little more skeptical of things you read on the Internet in the future. But you won't, because you're part of it. You come to conclusions with no evidence, and you believe what you want to believe regardless of whether it is true or not, simply because you prefer your beliefs to the truth. I prefer the truth.

It is that skepticism that leads me to look for other sources (like the sponsoring organization itself). Call or e-mail him yourself and see what happens.

[GracieB]

I just went to the American Legion site and Mr. Craig Roberts is a media representative for the American Legion.
Interestingly, I tried various searches for ball, Salute the heros, heros, inaugaration, the only thing I got was the flag code and how important it is especially for inaugaration day.
No press release, no pictures.
Gee, I have only been a computer user since 1977 and an internet user since the early 80s (something about working for a military contractor...), so maybe I just don't know how to find facts.

Thank you, Turtle, for saying ever so gently, the words I cannot find to say with grace.
--GracieB

[Turtle]

Pilgrim:

When you quoted me where I said, "..as well as the fact that the president 4 years ago didn't go to it, either," and then proceeded to tell me that Bush, did in fact attend the American Legion Salute to Heroes Ball 4 years ago, you failed to realize that my quote was in a direct response to Chef's comments about the Red White and Blue Ball, NOT the American Legion Salute to Heores Ball. These are two different Balls we're talking about here.

Just because it happened 4 years ago doesn't mean the same thing happend this year.

The Red, White and Blue Ball was first held, for the very first time ever, 4 years ago in 2005. George Bush did NOT attend that Ball. It was then, as now, a fund rasier for veterans charities. It was held again this year, and Obama did not go to that Ball. Neither time was the Red, White and Blue Ball THE same thing as the American Legion sponsored Salute to Heroes Ball. And neither time did either president attend.

This year, in 2009, the American Legion did NOT sponsor a Salute to Heroes Ball of any kind. I can find nothing in the press nor on the Legion site that shows they sponsored any ball of any kind at all.

The American Legion has NOT sponsored a Salute to Heroes Ball every inauguration since 1953.

The first Commander In Chief Ball (and that's what it was called) was held in 1953 to honor Eisenhower and current and former members of the armed services. It was held at the National Guard Armory. The other ball, The Presidential Inaugural Ball, was held at Georgetown University. Eisenhower attended both balls, but skipped out on all other festivities. The American Legion was one of many sponsors of the event.

In 1957 the number of balls grew to four, with The Presidential Inaugural Ball and the Commander In Chief Ball being but of the two official balls. Earlier, in August, 1956, a joint Congressional resolution passed the Presidential Inauguration Ceremonies Act, and thus the Presidential Inauguration Committee was born.

In 1961 there were five official Balls, one of them, the Commander In Chief Ball, would become a fixture at all subsequent inaugurations. The American Legion again was one of many sponsors of the event.

In 1965, there were five Balls. President Johnson lef the dancing at the Presidential Inaugural Ball, where 28,000 people were in attendance. He made brief appearances of approximatedly 30 minutes each at the other four Balls, including the CinC Ball. I cannot find where any of the sponsors of the CinC Ball for that year are mentioned. There is no mention of the American Legion nor the VFW.

In 1969 at Nixon's Inauguration, there were six balls. After Nixon led the parade route as anti-war protesters hurled rocks and beer cans at the president's limousine, the 3,000 D.C. Police, 5,000 regular troops and 1,000 National Guardsmen kept the protests at bay. The Nixons attended all six balls, including a relatively small CinC Ball at the Armory. The American Legion did NOT sponsor the event. It was sponsored entirely by funds made available by the Arms Services Committee.

In 1973 there were five balls. Again the CinC Ball was sponsored by the taxpayers with money provided from the Armed Services budget. That was the last time that happened.

In 1977 Jimmy Carter introduce the "People's Inauguration" theme and all seven of the inaugural balls wer called "parties," and none were permitted to charge more than $25 to get in. The Carter's attende all six of the official "parties," including the CinC Party.

In 1981 there were nine official balls for Reagan's first inauguration, and as promised to pull the American people out of hard time, the events and the inauguration were over-the-top luxury rivaling an even for Euopean royalty, something that did not go uncriticized considering it was on the same day that the Iran Hostage Crisis ended. The Reagan's attended all nine balls, including the CinC Ball, which has as its primary sponsor the American Legion.

In 1985, after the opulence of the previous inauguration, festivities and balls were scaled back, having just seven balls. But it still cost more than $20 million, and the heat was on for that cold January day when the Oath of Office was taken indoors because it was so cold. Nancy's $46,000 dress was fodder for Doonsberry and everyone else for quite a while. Once again, the President and First Lady managed to hit all of the official balls, including the CinC, which was sponsored by corporate (mostly Hollywood) funds.

In 1989 there were nine balls for George Sr, all of which he attended for the "George to George" bicentenniel theme of the anniversay of the first presidential inauguration. No mention is made of who sponsored the CinC Ball that year, but the Bush's did make it to all of the official balls.

In 1993 there were eleven official balls. Clinton made brief apperances at all of them, but spent by far the most time at the Home State Ball for Arkansas, where he played sax with BB King for a good portion of the night. The CinC Ball was another elegant, but subdued affair.

In 1997 we had an all time record fourteen official inaugural balls and the Clinton's day ended the next morning at 4AM. They managed to hit all fourteen balls, including the CinC Ball, funded primarily by corporate donations.

In 2001 and again in 2005, the American Legion and other veterans organizations sponsored the Commander in Chief Ball with the "Salute to Heroes" theme, and used the sponsorship to honor veterans of Desert Shield and Desert Storm, among all of the other veterans, past and present. The term "Salute the Heroes" wasn't much a part of the American vocabulary until Desert Shield, and it was never used as a theme for any of the previous Commander in Chief Balls, ever.

But like I said, show me a link to a credible news organization, or a link to the American Legion Web site, where it talks about any of this. Or, PM me the full headers of that e-mail.

[RLENT]

Yup ..... a true buzz-killer ...... but ya really gotta love him anyways

[Pilgrim]

Pilgrim:

When you quoted me where I said, "..as well as the fact that the president 4 years ago didn't go to it, either," and then proceeded to tell me that Bush, did in fact attend the American Legion Salute to Heroes Ball 4 years ago, you failed to realize that my quote was in a direct response to Chef's comments about the Red White and Blue Ball, NOT the American Legion Salute to Heores Ball. These are two different Balls we're talking about here.

I did realize that - the only ball I'm talking about is the Salute to Heroes Ball that until this year, has been attended by every newly inaugurated president since its inception. I couldn't give a rip about any of the other Inaugural Balls, their history, or who attended them. My bone to pick is with Obama's absence from this one.

But like I said, show me a link to a credible news organization, or a link to the American Legion Web site, where it talks about any of this. Or, PM me the full headers of that e-mail.

For what it's worth, here's the entire e-mail as cut/pasted from my Yahoo e-mail, with my personal info redacted. I'll say this for the third time: Contact him yourself - it's not that hard.

Yup, we're for real!
Thursday, January 22, 2009 5:03 PM

From:
"Roberts, Craig R." <croberts@legion.org>
Add sender to Contacts

To:
xxxxxx@yahoo.com

Good afternoon, Mr. xxxxxx,
In answer to your inquiry:
The American Legion, as it has on every inauguration evening since 1953, hosted the Salute to Heroes Inaugural Banquet & Ball on January 20th. The quadrennial event is co-sponsored with fourteen veterans service and military service organizations and honors recipients of the Medal of Honor. Forty-seven of these heroes attended this year’s event which was held in the Renaissance Washington DC Hotel.
President Obama was invited but did not attend. Vice-President Joe Biden did appear, however, and was very warmly received. The new President’s absence was understandable considering the unprecedented logistical challenges presented by the vastly increased number of visitors to this inauguration and the necessary attendant security measures. The American Legion, as an organization, does not feel offended or “snubbed.”
Thank you,
Craig
Craig Roberts
Media Relations Manager
The American Legion
1608 K Street, NW
Washington, DC 20006
202.263.2982 (direct)

I also sent him a reply this morning asking him to explain the lack of media coverage for their event. No reply as of 9:50AM EST.

[jaminjim]

LOL, see i am not looking to balance anything, i am not about Sharing the anything, yes i have an agenda, ill post as much negative as i can, and nothing positive, not that i look forward to anything psoitive from him to begin with.

And the "you" bein ok whith him, was meant in general, not at you personally...

LOL, the fact still remains, HE didn't go!! I and I'll continue to post here and on more then a few sites anything that makes him look bad... I'll keep you busy checking for accuracy!!

turtle wrote:



LOL, if i were in charge of the secret service, id simply send his security detail home, for his entire term!! LOL, id assign them to protect the janitor at the white house before i'd have them protect osamaba...

lol and you think that bothers me..........lol

and no, i won't deliberately post a lie, i'll just not go out of my way to verify, ill leave that to you ....

The problem I have with your comment Chef is that if you won't take any time to verify what you post, then it just becomes nonsense that anyone can Google "Obama sucks". If you truly despise, hate the man, take the time to post accurate info. If not why would anyone open one of your posts on the subject? I don't mind reading negative things about Obama, but try to insure they are correct.