[greg334]

I know many of you are mesmerized by the message the messiah has propagated to the masses, many more are fervent supporters of the message itself – change but I am looking at the news this morning and see a quip that Obama is thinking about tapping Jamie Gorelick as the Attorney General of the US. Where is the change in that?

But this was not really the big issue for me, what really mattered to me is running across the little quip about Obama returning to the criminal-justice prosecution of terror suspects which was the Clinton’s administration policy in dealing with terrorism overall. Obama made a point that the Reno’s Justice Department made successful efforts to imprison those who bombed the World Trade Center in 1993, pretty much incapacitating these people from doing it again, but that last part is not true by any means.

What this really means is that in the case of the WTC first bombing, the entire thing was handled like it was a robbery or some other crime, not a terrorist act. Subsequently, the US Cole was handled the same way until the policy was changed.


Now here is where you got to understand that if we continued down this path of treating everything like it was a crime and not an act against the country, we would have wrote off 9/11 as something like the first bombing and we would again put Bin Ladin on the FBI’s most wanted list and left it at that. I can’t see serving him with a warrant in the caves of Pakistan or Afghanistan.

Many of you Obama supporters say so what, let this happen because we mis-treated the prisoners in Gitmo and so on but truly this sends a clear signal that our guard is down and that we become weak again.

So back to Jamie Gorelick, the thing about her is that she created the walls to prevent the NSA, CIA and FBI from sharing information but she was appointed to the 911 commission and the commission covered her a** with the memo creating the wall. But she also has another problem, she was involved with Fannie Mae which is now being bailed out with our tax money and it really makes it difficult for congress to have an investigation into the problems of these organizations when the US attorney General has direct ties to the organizations that they are investigating.

I really wise you Obama fans wake up and look at what is going on instead of falling all over yourselves listening to his ‘I will bring change’ cr*p because everything thing he has said he will do is in clear contrast of what he is actually doing to put together his administration.

McCain is not far a better person but at least he won’t have the FBI trying to serve warrants to terrorist in caves.

[always confused]

criminals? i thought we are at 'war' with terrorists in caves or not. that would make them combatents. shoot them before they shoot us. besides bullets are cheap compared to prisons. save money. and an additional benifit is a dead terrorist doesn't create much terror.

[tallcal101]

Alway Confused,your a breath of freash air,even it it's hot.I have great respect for a man who use's a handle that cuts to the chase about his mental state of mind.I applaud you.
Now,come on back over from the dark side and lessen both the confused part and the always part.I feel and share your pain.
Ever Clear is an available handle to all those who wish to put the last 8 years of bleak and ever sinister corrupt and meaningless baffonery behind us. Once again have the courage to become proud of our country and it's potential. It's not all going to be rose's,but it will be an opportunity to put this train on a track that has straight and well forged rails instead of a figure eight that has us all thinking of 8 8 8 8 8.

[always confused]

Originally Posted by tallcal101

Alway Confused,your a breath of freash air,even it it's hot.I have great respect for a man who use's a handle that cuts to the chase about his mental state of mind.I applaud you.
Now,come on back over from the dark side and lessen both the confused part and the always part.I feel and share your pain.
Ever Clear is an available handle to all those who wish to put the last 8 years of bleak and ever sinister corrupt and meaningless baffonery behind us. Once again have the courage to become proud of our country and it's potential. It's not all going to be rose's,but it will be an opportunity to put this train on a track that has straight and well forged rails instead of a figure eight that has us all thinking of 8 8 8 8 8.

sorry but i feel that obama is not the right answer for the country. yes he is an excellent speaker, but so was hitler.

[arkjarhead]

Greg I wish you would quit referring to Obama as the "Messiah". I don't know your religious background and it doesn't really matter, but I'm a Christian and I find it offensive for you to call a normal human by my Lord's name. See Jesus was no politican or normal man he was God in the flesh.

Plus I've read your post numerous times and still don't see where you are going with this. I think we are fighting against some ruthless people, but I think we are doing some ruthless things as well. You bring up Gitmo. Those people aren't getting trials. That's pretty jacked up. Even the head Nazis got trials. How do we know none of those people are innocent. It is very possible. Watch the movie "Road to Guantanamo Bay". It shows some British Muslims of Pakastani descent and how one travels to Pakastan and his friends come later for him to be married. To make a long story short they decide to travel to Afgan to do some relief work and get arrested by the Northern Alliance and turned over to the US. The go to Gitmo. They were there for over a year before being released. They were innocent. That's jacked up. They were doing relief work and it cost them over 2 years in confinment from the time they first arrested until they were released. That's jacked up. If the war in Iraq has been fought for nothing else than to free the Iraqi people from the control of Saddam Huessien it was a good thing to fight for. Only time will tell. I just don't buy into the fact that it was for oil. If that were the cause Venezuala would have been easier to conquer if you ask me.

[LDB]

Is that what the deal is? It's not koolaid that's the problem with the Obama crowd it's Everclear? Seems it's better to be thinking of 888, if that's the case, than thinking 666 like we will be if we're saddled with Obama.

[arkjarhead]

I'm just ready for the day after election day to get here this mess is getting old. It's the same comments, made by the same ones every thread. Your drinking kool-aid, no your drinking kool-aid. Please I can't wait until the day after election day gets here. Whoever wins I will give them a chance to do their job before I bash them.

[Tennesseahawk]

Ark... we call him Messiah, because his followers act like he's the second coming. If you listen to his speeches on radio, you hear teenage-like screams from when the Beatles played in 64. Relax. No one is trying to offend you... except libs.

The Nazis got a trial, because it is part of the Geneva Convention that they did. The Nazis waged war against half the world; Al-queda, only us and a couple allies. Al-queda doesn't get a war tribunal, because they are not fighting a traditional war, as described by the GC.

I think we all know the war in Iraq is about a lot more than just saving the Iraqis and oil. Personally, I think it's about getting an American foothold in the Mideast, and making it a democratic domino.

About the British Pakistanis... mistakes happen. You can't expect something on this large a scale to be mistake free.

[arkjarhead]

I'm not expecting things to be mistake free, but had they been given trials they would have been released much sooner. The ones that are guilty should be hanged. Who do you think is paying to feed, clothe, and provide shelter for them while they stay so long at Gitmo?

[LDB]

Considering what happened to Eugene Armstrong, I have no problem with Gitmo and do have a huge problem with the fools on the court. There has been significant information garnered due to the procedures there. The only thing we should do differently is smear pig blood on the corpse of every terrorist that is killed.

My last comment was based on Cal saying alwaysconfused should change usernames to everclear, everclear being of course a cheap alcoholic fix and drunken stupor being possibly an excuse for being an Obamanite.

[greg334]

Originally Posted by arkjarhead

Greg I wish you would quit referring to Obama as the "Messiah". I don't know your religious background and it doesn't really matter, but I'm a Christian and I find it offensive for you to call a normal human by my Lord's name. See Jesus was no politican or normal man he was God in the flesh.

Well Joe, and a few others, the word Messiah and the word Savior does not referring to Jesus exclusively but an interpretation from some of the people as it only means Jesus. If you are offended, well I can’t apologize because there are things that others do in the religion that offends me a lot and one is using religion to promote hate for the purpose of expanding power or subjugating people - something that the religion needs to address within itself.

The word Messiah is from a Hebrew word which means the anointed one as does the word Savior which also has a dual meaning of one who saves.

The issue for me and many others who use the word in the proper context is that many people look upon Obama as the one who “is going to save us from d*mnation of the bush era”, in other words they are preparing themselves for the Messiahs ascension to power. I didn’t put the religion spin on it, it came from people who feel that he will be ruinous for the country.

Originally Posted by arkjarhead

Plus I've read your post numerous times and still don't see where you are going with this. I think we are fighting against some ruthless people, but I think we are doing some ruthless things as well. You bring up Gitmo. Those people aren't getting trials. That's pretty jacked up. Even the head Nazis got trials. How do we know none of those people are innocent. It is very possible. Watch the movie "Road to Guantanamo Bay". It shows some British Muslims of Pakastani descent and how one travels to Pakastan and his friends come later for him to be married. To make a long story short they decide to travel to Afgan to do some relief work and get arrested by the Northern Alliance and turned over to the US. The go to Gitmo. They were there for over a year before being released. They were innocent. That's jacked up. They were doing relief work and it cost them over 2 years in confinment from the time they first arrested until they were released. That's jacked up. If the war in Iraq has been fought for nothing else than to free the Iraqi people from the control of Saddam Huessien it was a good thing to fight for. Only time will tell. I just don't buy into the fact that it was for oil. If that were the cause Venezuela would have been easier to conquer if you ask me.

Well Ark, my take on things is not the idea that we need to be nice and above what others do. This is about survival and the safety of our people, not of the people in some other country who care about their safety. We have had almost 40 years of seeing what Israel and other countries have endured, we have had several terrorist attacks within our own country but we still don’t get it.


There were a lot of trials with the Nazis, the top people were only the ones who were in the public’s eye but there were a lot of executions going into the 50’s and even the 60’s. I feel that the people in Gitmo should get the same exact trial that some of the lower Nazi officials got, with the same planned outcome. I honestly don’t care about Gitmo, it is not an issue for me and most of the country except when they have the same rights as we do, and that is the fault of our congress who, like Obama is selling us out. ALL I CARE ABOUT IS PROTECTING THIS COUNTRY and if that means we have to be dirty about it, well they have my approval to do what ever is needed to protect everyone here.

We fought a war in Iraq for a few reasons, one was Oil, one was to liberate the people, one was to follow the mandate of the UN, one was to follow the policy of the previous administration and the last major reason was to have a presents there outside of Qatar and Saudi Arabia. If you like your way of life right now, the war has been one of things that helps prevent escalation of other issues with Iran. People think that Saddam prevent Iran from doing anything but fact is that he was too weak to deal with Iran. Venezuela would not be an easier job, we would have engulfed South America into the conflict because of the strong presents of the communist and left leaning guerilla organizations. Venezuela will implode sometime in the future but we can speed the process up if we have a strong economy.

Originally Posted by tallcal101

Ever Clear is an available handle to all those who wish to put the last 8 years of bleak and ever sinister corrupt and meaningless baffonery behind us. Once again have the courage to become proud of our country and it's potential. It's not all going to be rose's,but it will be an opportunity to put this train on a track that has straight and well forged rails instead of a figure eight that has us all thinking of 8 8 8 8 8.

Well Tallcal, I am trying to figure out where you were during Clinton’s administration, those 8 years were also had some really sinister corruption and meaningless buffoonery involved. Should there be a reminder of some of it?

Yep once again have the courage to become proud but not with a man who is groomed in such a way that his falseness cracks and can’t be consistent or even clear on what makes America great.

Honestly Andy, the one thing that amazes me is you know that this guy is bad for us, McCain is not far behind but I can't bring myself to put the country on the path of a train wreck. Sure we can lay straight tracks but we will put two trains heading towards each other on the same track with Obama. I am starting to think you don’t want to see the country prosper but tank.

T-Hawk,
The Nazis were tried under the Declaration of the Four Nations on General Security and under the denazification plans. Churchill was against trying the lower ranking officers but he was replaced right after the war and the allies were hell-bent on revenge. Unlike today where people jump on the Geneva Convention, there are agreements and laws that supersede the convention that are ignored now out of convenience. The convention was ignored by the allies after the war because it was outdated. For example the Red Cross could not get anyone to bring the allies to task for the inhuman treatment of the common German solider who died by the thousands in POW camps throughout Europe because of a lack of food and basic shelter. This was solved in the 1948 version of the convention and if we knew what we had to deal with 54 years later, Truman would have refused to have the convention ratified.

[arkjarhead]

When you're dirty about it all you do is breed more anger and hatred toward the US and raise more terrorists. If we become like them then it is hard for us to say we are any better. I guess it is a matter of morals. We can protect our country with out doing certain things like taking innocent lives. If we do that we are no better than the terrorists.

I think one of the biggest problems we have in this country is most people are either way to the right or way to the left. Very few people are in the middle and willing to look at both sides of things. Usually in the middle is where the truth is.

Smearing pig blood on dead people is about one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. It's not proper to defile someone's body after they are dead. You know you can go to prison for that here in the States. Plus I wouldn't want that to happen to any of our troops bodies. So why do it them? I really dislike terrorist, but I'm not that ignorant about it. Come on people how crazy must you be to think that kind of behavior is justified. If I were in those people's shoes I might be fighting to. Remember we are on their soil not the other way around. I approve of the war, but I don't expect people to just lay down when we bring our military into another nation and refuse to leave. Their Prime Minister even wants us gone. We are an occupying force. Nothing more nothing less.

[aristotle]

Ark, I don't know what your'e thinking when you type this stuff. War isn't fought on moral grounds. It is fought to the death or until one side capitulates. Believe me, the terrorists understand this. The fence sitters and naysayers(Democrats) have nearly achieved their objective, which is the "wussification" of America. This "wussification" began under Bill Clinton and 4 years of Obama will surely close the deal. These liberal eunuchs will be the the ruin of us all. The problem now is we don't fight hard enough. You and I both are veterans. I, too, remember the lure of academic liberalism offered up by college professors in my youth. I hope you haven't fallen under the hypnotic spell of your professors.
This war isn't a parlor game to be settled by academia. It will end when we beat them(terrorists) into submission. If we leave this war prematurely, the enemy will be emboldened and fight back with unrestrained vengeance. These academic types are the ultimate hypocrites. They do nothing but badmouth our war effort while enjoying all the freedoms a strong military defense ensures them. Perhaps, we should have all males in the United States serve a brief period of military service. This would give them a greater appreciation of this experiment in democracy.

[LDB]

If whatever pieces remain of the suicide bomber and if the bodies of the terrorists are smeared with pig blood they don't get their virgins and don't get their attaboy from allah. As far as them doing anything to us, I'd return whatever it is 100 fold. I'd find TR's big stick and sharpen the end of it. I don't care if they like us. I know they will never respect us. As long as they fear us that's good enough.

[greg334]

They won't fear us either until we show consistent strength. If we continue to worry about what others think it is a sign of weakness. If we give them their bodies back to bury properly, it is a sign of weakness. You got to understand that the difference between us being dirty and them is that at the end of the day, we return to our lives where they live all this.

The one thing that people miss is that in the western world, we can debate without action, but in their world they don't debate without action - sometimes the action comes first. Also while I am thinking about it, the redefined definition of patriotism where we can question our country and defy it or what ever, is a sign of a country that is weak and to them anything weak must be destroyed.