Next Terrorist Attack

[tallcal101]

Leo,I don't need you to protect me,but thanks for offereing.It's our current gun laws that need a complete overhaul so that those who have a history of clinicaly diagnosed mental problems can no longer stop by the local 7-11 gun shop and pick up a slurpy and a fully automatic weapon of mass destruction (such as happened 2 weeks ago).It's bad news Leo,and you know it.You hide behind this cloak of strenth and wisdom about gun ownership as the blood bath continues.It's really getting old to hear your opinion.But I feel it's my duty to educate you and others who share your feelings and judgement to wake up and pay attention to where our lax gun laws and gun lobby money have led us.You want to go shoot wild things Leo,have it brother.You want blow away the bad guys,well,most statistics don't fall in your favor.I've never fired a gun,been around people who keep them and never will.I lock my friggin doors Leo and have secure locks.Maybe where you live the bad guys are hiding in the dark and you will get them before they get you.A hell of a way to live your life is all I can say.

How do any of you know what kind of a President any of the canidates will make? I admit,it looks like The Straight Talk Express may have a zipper problem,which is not a good thing,but other then that he seems like a hero type who has some humanity.
As for Hiillary or Obama,they can only be given a chance. For Christs sake,we gave numb nuts a chance even when we new he was a draft dodger(jet pilot,give me e break)He was a C student cheerleader at Yale who's daddy hooked him up with the Bama national guard,he never went anyway.He was a drunk and a doper.Money bought that President,lots of good old GOP Enron money(Kenny Boy) and don't forget Osamas uncle Mr. Saud.

We need to turn away from the darkness of these fools,can't you see that?They have sold us down the river and we are so much weaker for it.Our enemies are real,but they laugh at the foolishness of our way of life for putting such a clown in the role of leader of the free world.I for one am tired of being laughed at,screwed at the pump and an economy in shambles as a result of the W and his boys.Tax breaks for the rich on the backs of the worker bees. You should all be ashamed you ever voted for him and his posse.Ashamed and pi**ed off and ready to vote them all out.

I need to come around more,I've been busy trying to keep moving vans full,pretty tough when people can't sell their homes.

[arkjarhead]

I'm sorry you may disagree with me, but the man I think that would be a good choice for President isn't running. He spent many years in the military. He advised the first Bush not to go into Bagdad and tried to get the second one not to. He also told the second Bush he was invading with to small of a force. He also spent time as Sec. of State. He my friends is Mr. Colin Powell. He was running he would have my support. The only problem is he refuses to.

[greg334]

Leo,I don't need you to protect me,but thanks for offereing.It's our current gun laws that need a complete overhaul so that those who have a history of clinicaly diagnosed mental problems can no longer stop by the local 7-11 gun shop and pick up a slurpy and a fully automatic weapon of mass destruction (such as happened 2 weeks ago).It's bad news Leo,and you know it.You hide behind this cloak of strenth and wisdom about gun ownership as the blood bath continues.It's really getting old to hear your opinion.But I feel it's my duty to educate you and others who share your feelings and judgement to wake up and pay attention to where our lax gun laws and gun lobby money have led us.You want to go shoot wild things Leo,have it brother.You want blow away the bad guys,well,most statistics don't fall in your favor.I've never fired a gun,been around people who keep them and never will.I lock my friggin doors Leo and have secure locks.Maybe where you live the bad guys are hiding in the dark and you will get them before they get you.A hell of a way to live your life is all I can say.

Well I am not leo but I don’t know about this Tallcal what happened 2 weeks ago with an automatic weapon?

I may have missed it with the Obamania going on in this country and the nausium of people talking about the second coming of JFK.

If you have been in Africa, you know d*mn well that the only real way to protect people from dictatorship and mass murder is having armed citizens in the country. You know d*mn well that we have a cultural problem that goes way beyond the ‘local 7-11 gun shop’ mentality and into the problems of victimism and ‘not ask what you can do for your country but what you can take from the working people and keep for yourself’ mentality.

You know what really bothers me, maybe I held this in for a while, but it really bothers me to hear about a shooting and then the person who caused it was on anti-depressants – like this last ‘nice’ guy in Illinois. You know about mind altering drugs, what is so hard to understand the problem is not the gun, it is the drug. It is the politicians who have created this situation; they are not the one’s who can find solutions. The solution for the anti-depressant issues is simple; prevent MD’s from prescribing them for every ailment that comes along and stop this stupid policy to that allows the drug companies to advertise. These are the very drug companies that are CLOSE FRIENDS OF THE DEMOCRATS MORE THAN REPUBLICANS, the very drug companies that make BILLIONS.

How do any of you know what kind of a President any of the canidates will make? I admit,it looks like The Straight Talk Express may have a zipper problem,which is not a good thing,but other then that he seems like a hero type who has some humanity.
As for Hiillary or Obama,they can only be given a chance. For Christs sake,we gave numb nuts a chance even when we new he was a draft dodger(jet pilot,give me e break)He was a C student cheerleader at Yale who's daddy hooked him up with the Bama national guard,he never went anyway.He was a drunk and a doper.Money bought that President,lots of good old GOP Enron money(Kenny Boy) and don't forget Osamas uncle Mr. Saud.

Yea yea yea Tallcal, who cars about the national guard issue, who cares about if someone fought in Vietnam – that is in the past, it has no bearing on leadership qualities or integrity when you come down to it, we got to shed this need to compare Vietnam in every political race, until we do, we can’t move forward.

We need to turn away from the darkness of these fools,can't you see that?They have sold us down the river and we are so much weaker for it.Our enemies are real,but they laugh at the foolishness of our way of life for putting such a clown in the role of leader of the free world.

God, I agree with you if you mean the main stream political machine, which includes Obama, Hillary and all the rest. To do this, do you ask if people are registered to Vote, if they read what is going on or anything like that? I hope. But I got to tell you something that you may not realize, we really don’t have a clown in the WH like you think in comparison. I mean Chirac was an idiot, so was John Major and if you reach into the past, de Gaulle and Mitterrand were also, to mention a few. I think if you look at the world stage, you can find a lot of clowns in many nations past and present.

I for one am tired of being laughed at,screwed at the pump and an economy in shambles as a result of the W and his boys.Tax breaks for the rich on the backs of the worker bees. You should all be ashamed you ever voted for him and his posse.Ashamed and pi**ed off and ready to vote them all out.

Who is laughing? I think everyone is in fear of what is going on and still looks at the US as the world’s police. I know one thing, I listened to the Beeb today and they seemed to be thankful that we didn’t have a dem in office with the ‘Mortgage Crisis’ because they see what is going on, noting that the fed is trying. This is the Brits saying that they are glad that Bush is in office. Germany, if you didn’t know is hoping on McCain because of the massive investment that they have here and the German banks are already incurring losses with the investments they made in Fannie May and Freddie Mac – maybe it is time for someone to get into the WH and start eliminating the FDR programs that outlived their usefulness?

Ah… tax breaks for the rich BS. Please stop with the party line, you earned your merit badge already for that one. Look read this carefully – the real winners were not the rich but the lower class who saw a rate drop from 15 to 10% and the number of brackets drop too. I benefited a lot by the tax breaks, I bet a lot of other did and the last time I looked I was not rich, even by Clinton standards.

But this brings up a very good question for you to answer if I didn’t p*ss you off too much. Today I was discussing the good and bad about the Fair Tax, I was floored by the comment made by a liberal who said that “this should be embraced by the democratic party because this would solve the problems of many poor people”. So with that comment, I am wondering what do you think? Would it be a good thing or a bad thing and if you don’t mind, why? You can PM me if you like with the answer.

[LDB]

Well I am not leo but I don’t know about this Tallcal what happened 2 weeks ago with an automatic weapon?

Greg, nothing happened with an automatic weapon. That's the automatic response from the hysterical left whenever guns are mentioned. They're all either assault weapons or automatic weapons. In some cases it's ignorance and in most cases it's the left's usual policy of fear mongering.

[Pilgrim]

Time after time I read these liberal rants in newspapers and on websites, hear them on TV and radio, and listen to them from my wife of 35 years (a true bleeding-heart liberal sixties flower child), and the foundation for their argument is always the same: emotions. Documented facts are hardly ever brought into the discussion to support their assertions. Name-calling and mockery is always the standard attack. Our enemies are always justified in their actions because of percieved wrongdoings by the ugly American. It's simply a mindset based on a philosophy of life that is perhaps naive and idealistic, but at the same time sincere. These are the people that truly believe that Barak Hussein Obama is the real deal and can "save our country". I only skimmed the "Liberty Mind" article posted earlier by Turtle since it's pretty long, but I intend to go back and digest the whole thing. It appears to give an excellent insight into the philosophy of Liberalism.

That said, I am not going to sit back any more and let these nonsensical liberal assertions go unchallenged:

* "...dumbest President in the history of our nation". More silly name-calling. Bush has an undergraduate degree from Yale and an MBA from Harvard. His GPA at Yale was higher than that of John Kerry, his most recent political opponent. Granted, I don't agree with some of his decisions and he's not an eloquent speaker - but let's elevate the argument beyond the "dumb" business.

* "...draft dodger...". etc. Nonsense - it has been documented repeatedly that he served all his required time in the Air National Guard, and he was a pilot. So what if he didn't see combat in Viet Nam? Lots of people joined the Reserves and Guard in the'60s and 70's and put in their six years of service or more. Compare this with Slick Willie's attitude toward the military during his college years.

* "...economy in shambles..." Pure fiction. The past 7.5 years have yielded high growth and employment figures at record levels. No need to explain this - look it up on any number of non-political economic websites. Even now as the economy slows we're at traditional full employment levels. You want shambles - take a look at the late 1970s under the Carter administration.

* "...tax breaks for the rich on the backs of the worker bees..." Absolutely a false assertion that's easy to shoot down. Check out the IRS website - 86% of all income taxes are paid by the top 25% of wage earners.

Cal, I know these came out of your posts, but I'm using them as typical arguments I always hear from liberal friends, family, etc. It's my intention to counter the ideas and assertions, and at the same time not be personal. It's an open forum and different opinions and arguments are what make it interesting.

[LDB]

Pilgrim, facts and truth? Puhleeeeeeze, what do those have to do with anything? Exaggerations and fabrications are so much more esthetically appealing, don't you know?

[Turtle]

I just want to know when it was that an automatic weapon became reclassified as a Weapon of Mass Destruction. Was I sick that day? Did I miss the memo?

In any case, I'm not sure what guns laws we're talking about that need an overhaul. the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
Seems pretty clear to me...

What I find the most ironic about liberals is the thoroughly hypocritical views with regard to gun control and terrorism. In gun control, they want to prevent someone from having a gun in the first place, in order to prevent something bad that might happen, and with terrorists, they want to let them do whatever it is they want to do and then let the police handle it afterwards, rather than prevent them from doing bad in the first place.

[LDB]

Turtle, common sense and logic? Puhleeeeeeze, what do those have to do with liberal thinking? You've obviously been drinking from the same koolaid as Pilgrim. And now back to our regularly scheduled liberal hysteria and rationalizing.

[arrbsthw]

Obama may end up like Vince Foster..ya'll do remember him, don't u?

[greg334]

You know, I got to say this.

I got to the point that it is great to 'debate' liberals and ignorant people (most here don't follow into that category), it makes my day most of the time because they can't come up with concrete reasoning a lot of the time but become emotional there are four truths that we need to really promote.

1 - We are not a democracy, we are a republic and will always be one. It is a selling point for socialism.

2 - The right to vote for a president is not 'granted' to us. We have no right to vote - it is a state's right to govern, not the federal government's. But with that said, we must understand that senators were appointed for a reason by the states and that we are supposed to be representative by our representatives and it is both Senators and representatives who we need to focus on.

3 - The Constitution does not grant us any rights, it does not say that we are granted rights or indicate that there are rights granted - just the opposite. The constitution is there to limit the federal government on what the federal can and can't do, not us. It says that the federal government can do this stuff and nothing else, 10th amendment is clear on this issue.

4 - We have too many ignorant people, it don't matter if they are right, left, socialist, communist, fascist or alien, I think that they don't get it and read into the propaganda that we are a democracy, we have the right to vote and our rights are limited by the constitution. They want the government to take care of them, they want to control others and this was all produced by 110 years of socialist propaganda produced for class warfare.

Until we get the fundamentals about how our government really works, until we get our s**t together and force changes in our government, we will always be in danger of another attack.

[tallcal101]

I must offer my most heartfelt apology that I don't sit around playing with my BIG gun,stroking it and caring for it and fondling it and exploring all the wonders and joy my big gun brings me.Listen fools,YOUNG PEOPLE DIED IN COLD BLOOD IN THEIR CLASS ROOM BECAUSE CRAZY PEOPLE CAN BUY GUNS.Do you really think the parents of the dead student give a rats a** about the make and model of the small areonal this brain damaged young person(with a history of problems)killed with?
It's so sickningly typical of the gun fanatics to skirt the issue of death and brain tissue splatterd around our schools and universities to justify their hobby.It's nothing more then that. The second ammendment was never intended to fulfill the gap created in the 21 st century by man boys who never matured in a healthy fashon and pay homage to some distorted notion of p****s fixation in poweful cylindrical weapons. I consider the sickest of the sickest of all of us are those that worship at the alter of "our right" to revel in this temple of ignorant behavior.Have it man boys.

[LDB]

Cal, give me a list of all the mass shootings at police stations and then I'll consider the possibility you have some point to offer. Until then there is no point for you to offer. It's your liberal leftist restrictions that are responsible for the deaths of those students. Perhaps that knowledge and it's guilt are why your posts are so emotional and frenzied rather than rational discussion points. Over and this time out.

[Turtle]

2 - The right to vote for a president is not 'granted' to us. We have no right to vote - it is a state's right to govern, not the federal government's.

Well, the Constitution doesn't grant us the right to vote for the president, but it does, specifically, grant us the right to vote for the members of the House of Representatives. The president and the senators are chosen by the states, in any manner in which they choose. The states determine voting times, places and procedures, but Congress can, at any time, change by law any of these except the places where Senators are chosen.

The 15th, 19th and 26th Amendment specifically address the right to vote.

3 - The Constitution does not grant us any rights, it does not say that we are granted rights or indicate that there are rights granted - just the opposite. The constitution is there to limit the federal government on what the federal can and can't do, not us. It says that the federal government can do this stuff and nothing else, 10th amendment is clear on this issue.

Two separate issues here. One, yeah, the Constitution makes is very clear that the federal government can do only certain things, plus anything we allow it to do.

The other issue is, the Constitution most definitely grants us rights. The first ten Amendments are known as the Bill of Rights, in fact.

[Turtle]

Listen fools,YOUNG PEOPLE DIED IN COLD BLOOD IN THEIR CLASS ROOM BECAUSE CRAZY PEOPLE CAN BUY GUNS.

No, young people died in cold blood in their classroom because a brain damaged young person with a history of mental and other problems was allowed to wander around unsupervised. There is no skirting the issue. Removing guns treats the symptom, not the cause. And the cause goes far, far deeper than the availability of guns, automatic or otherwise. The easy way, the quick and dirty way, to look at it is to blame the guns. Remove all guns and instantly the world is a happy place. Utopia isn't that easy. Sorry.

[greg334]

Listen fools,YOUNG PEOPLE DIED IN COLD BLOOD IN THEIR CLASS ROOM BECAUSE CRAZY PEOPLE CAN BUY GUNS.

OK Tallcal, I am not a fool - I know exactly what is going on with the last few shootings and other incidents that hit the news.

IT HAS NOT A D*MN THING TO DO WITH ACCESS TO A GUN.

IT HAS TO DO WITH THE IDIOTS WHO PRESCRIBE MEDICATION AND THE MEDICATION THAT THEY ARE ON.

Is that loud enough for you.

I worked at a company, Pharmaceutical company, in the development part of the company where so I have a really different point of view on drug products. I won't bore you with the facts but let's say this company had 3 of the leading anti-depressants on the market and was going to buy another one when I left. I was privy to a lot of info that you don't ever see and the one thing that I have stood firm is the fact that anti-depressants are mind altering drugs. What really gets me is that idiot parents listen to an uniformed doctor who bought into the sales rep BS on how effective the drugs are. These drugs have not been tested on adolescent and from all research that has ever been done (and the fact that the Supreme Court also used the same research) the mind does not fully develop until the age of 20. Remember that we are all different and when one has reached full development, another maybe short of full development by 30%.

One of the biggest issues that was brought up to the FDA and ignored was the fact that there needs to be a warning that tells doctors do not prescribe medications that overlap. Meaning that if you take the blue pill for 3 months and it does nothing, then the doc says try the red pill, you need to wait for 4 to 6 weeks before everything gets out of your system. The FDA rejected this and the comments made in a closed door session by the way.

So think about this TallCal, you got a guy on three Anti-depressants, three that counter act each other because they do different things to the same areas of the brain. He is being fed all these chemicals and he snaps.

Who's fault is it?

Why restrict one thing to prevent a crime when the cause of it needs to be restricted or eliminated?

If you want to weed out the root cause of these problems, it may very well come down to the the why's, how's and who's of prescribing medicine. Remember we, in this country fast track New Drug Applications where no other place in the world does. We have a lot of really lax and out of date laws governing drug studies and that the drug companies still do not have to disclose all the data or allow disclosure of data from studies done by third parties. So you think about the cause, you think about other ways to solve the problem because when you come down to it, the fact is if someone wants to kill someone else, they will find a way to do it and we will end up with a very restrictive society just out of fear of something happening.